Council Ban Atheist, Paranormal, Pagan & Other Websites

[Mal_Adjusted]

Council ban on atheist websites

The city council said the system helped managers monitor staff web access

A city council has blocked its staff from looking at websites about atheism.

Lawyers at the National Secular Society said the move by Birmingham City Council was "discriminatory" and they would consider legal action.

The rules also ban sites that promote witchcraft, the paranormal, sexual deviancy and criminal activity.

The city council declined to comment on the possible legal action, but said the new system helped make it easier for managers to monitor staff web access.

'Very strong case'

The authority's Bluecoat Software computer system allows staff to look at websites relating to Christianity, Islam, Hinduism and other religions but blocks sites to do with "witchcraft or Satanism" and "occult practices, atheistic views, voodoo rituals or any other form of mysticism".

Under the Employment Equality (Religion or Belief) Regulations 2003, it is unlawful to discriminate against workers because of their religion or belief, which includes atheism.

National Secular Society president Terry Sanderson said the city council's rules also discriminated against people who practise witchcraft, which is also classed as a legitimate belief.


We feel very strongly that people who don't believe should not be denied the access that people who do believe have got
Terry Sanderson, National Secular Society

He said the society would initially contact the council and ask for the policy to be changed, and otherwise pursue legal action.

He said he believed he would have a "very strong case".

Mr Sanderson said: "It is discriminatory not only against atheists but they also are banning access to sites to do with witchcraft.

"Witchcraft these days is called Wicca, which is an actual legitimate and recognised religion.

"We feel very strongly that people who don't believe should not be denied the access that people who do believe have got."

He added that some opinion polls said that up to 25% of the UK population now considered themselves atheist.

A city council statement said the authority had a "long-standing internet usage policy for staff".

It added: "We are currently implementing new internet monitoring software to make the control of internet access easier to manage.

"The aim of this is to provide greater control for individual line managers to monitor internet usage, and for departments, such as trading standards and child protection, to gain access, if needed, to certain sites for business reasons."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/engl ... 530519.stm

 

[rjmrjmrjm]

I am shocked that they could do this... the mind boggles.

p.s. this annoyed me "Witchcraft these days is called Wicca, which is an actual legitimate and recognised religion" - this implies a historic link between Witchcraft and Wicca, of which there is non.

 

[PeniG]

There's also the factor that you don't have to believe in something to read about it. There's all kinds of reasons to go to a website.

Why didn't they just ban non-work-related browsing ('cause that always works...)?

 

[escargot]

We feel very strongly that people who don't believe should not be denied the access that people who do believe have got
Terry Sanderson, National Secular Society

I had to read that about four times before I understood it. :lol:

 

[BeatrixKiddo]

I work for Birmingham City Council (god help me) and i can guarantee this will be overturned. It makes no sense, one of the biggest resources that the council has is its Libraries.... so you're telling me that people who use the internet in those Libraries will have information restricted just because their religion is frowned upon by some do-gooder in the Council. Pleease.

 

[Mal_Adjusted]

I'd be interested to hear of peoples experiences in public libraries with forms of net censorship by Net Nanny type software.

I've heard from a couple of people that they tried to access certain sites in public libraries and were blocked - the staff saying it wasn't down to them, it was some software installed by management (or similar)

 

[rynner2]

I've heard from a couple of people that they tried to access certain sites in public libraries and were blocked - the staff saying it wasn't down to them, it was some software installed by management (or similar)

Maybe 4 or 5 years ago, after my then computer died, I tried accessing FTMB via a library computer - only to find it was blocked!

 

[BeatrixKiddo]

In my experience the only things blocked from public access are porn sites. There have been a few occasions when something benign has been restricted but that has turned out to be in error and soon fixed.

 

[WabbitHunter]

Last year I was researching tattooing for my degree thesis, when I went to use the uni's computers I found that not only had they blocked any site that dealt with the subject but also had stopped any to do with alcoholic drinks (I was looking for certain adverts showing tattooed people). Now I really can't understand why they would block any sites (within reason of course) at university level.

 

[ihatethatmonkee3]

this doesn't surprise me, birmingham city council is, after all, the council that hit the headlines a few years back when they changed christmas to wintervale, so it would feel more inclusive of ethnic minorities.

it always seems like some idiotic idea is made by upper management like this this.

 

[GNC]

this doesn't surprise me, birmingham city council is, after all, the council that hit the headlines a few years back when they changed christmas to wintervale, so it would feel more inclusive of ethnic minorities.

Not entirely true, they did have an winter-based event called Winterval, but it was only for one year (quite a while ago now, despite the frequency of the story cropping up in the tabloids) and did not replace Christmas in any way.

 

[Anome]

Even better, Winterval was actually a promotional sales event for the retail district. It was just an advertising campaign for the holiday period.

So, not so much "Political Correctness gone mad" as "Capitalism gone rampant".

 

[PeniG]

Also, isn't restricting access to websites on certain religions, specifically minority or fringe ones, the opposite of inclusive?

 

[ihatethatmonkee3]

this doesn't surprise me, birmingham city council is, after all, the council that hit the headlines a few years back when they changed christmas to wintervale, so it would feel more inclusive of ethnic minorities.

Not entirely true, they did have an winter-based event called Winterval, but it was only for one year (quite a while ago now, despite the frequency of the story cropping up in the tabloids) and did not replace Christmas in any way.

i lived in birmingham at the time, so am well aware that it was only the one year that it happened for, nor did i state anywhere in my responce that it was for more than one year, as you can clearly see, i just state that they changed it a few years back, i took it that everyone would understand or at least realise that it was a one off and not a permanent change. i appear to have misjudged the intelligence of some of the people on the forum then.

it did replace christmas, as the council efused to put up any decorations that stated christmas in any way, so the "birmingham city council wishes you a very merry chirstmas" display was gone, as were chirstmas tree lights (as in lights in the shape of christmas trees) and santas. i cannot recall, being over the age of five, if there was a grotto in the city centre that year, but i cannot recall one, though having said that i think it is only with the new bullring opening that a grotto has made a return to the city centre shopping experience.

in my experience, the tabloids only bring it up at christmas to try and make sure something like it doesn't happen again. it's like they pick a town or city in the offices and say, right this year we're gonna say that they want to ban christmas, then they watch the public reaction.

to anome, the retail district does not need to make up an event for a promotional sales period, as with comsumerism so rampant already, christmas is a tool for retailers to offload the crap they couldn't sell in the pervious month, along with the more expensive new (or relabelled) products. in the event, it backfired badly on ed bore (i think he was council leader at the time) and the others as they were lambasted by the muslim, shiek and other minoirties, who stated that the point of living in britain was to share in the beliefs and traditions of that country while modifying their own.

 

[GNC]

Not entirely true, they did have an winter-based event called Winterval, but it was only for one year (quite a while ago now, despite the frequency of the story cropping up in the tabloids) and did not replace Christmas in any way.

i lived in birmingham at the time, so am well aware that it was only the one year that it happened for, nor did i state anywhere in my responce that it was for more than one year, as you can clearly see, i just state that they changed it a few years back, i took it that everyone would understand or at least realise that it was a one off and not a permanent change. i appear to have misjudged the intelligence of some of the people on the forum then.

I didn't say you did say it wasn't for more than one year, I was only pointing it out and I'm sorry you took it that way. But Christmas was still celebrated in Birmingham that year, right? The way it's reported it's as if King Herod was making a comeback on the council.

in my experience, the tabloids only bring it up at christmas to try and make sure something like it doesn't happen again. it's like they pick a town or city in the offices and say, right this year we're gonna say that they want to ban christmas, then they watch the public reaction.

Could the trigger behind these "Ban Christmas" stories be a drive to save money on the part of some businesses, etc.?

Feels weird disccussing Christmas in August. Where has the year gone?

 

[stu neville]

this doesn't surprise me, birmingham city council is, after all, the council that hit the headlines a few years back when they changed christmas to wintervale, so it would feel more inclusive of ethnic minorities.

Not entirely true, they did have an winter-based event called Winterval, but it was only for one year (quite a while ago now, despite the frequency of the story cropping up in the tabloids) and did not replace Christmas in any way.

i lived in birmingham at the time, so am well aware that it was only the one year that it happened for, nor did i state anywhere in my responce that it was for more than one year, as you can clearly see, i just state that they changed it a few years back, i took it that everyone would understand or at least realise that it was a one off and not a permanent change...

Your initial statement was fairly ambivalent, TBH. All you said was that the city council changed Christmas to Winterval a few years ago. Now, whilst UK posters, or those who have frequented these boards for a while would probably know all about the Winterval farrago, there are probably equally many who don't.

..i appear to have misjudged the intelligence of some of the people on the forum then.

You may wish to wind your neck in, everso slightly.

Feels weird disccussing Christmas in August. Where has the year gone?

My local Asda has already had its first delivery of crackers, etc. They're not on the shelves, yet, but they're there...

 

[WhistlingJack]

Could the trigger behind these "Ban Christmas" stories be a drive to save money on the part of some businesses, etc.?

I think it's probably more due to the fact that since the Tories removed the ability of local authorities to sue for libel, certain sections of the media can run 'loony left' stories such as this with impunity.

 

[ihatethatmonkee3]

i apologize wholeheartedly for my comments, to both gncxx and other forum users. to gncxx, yes christmas was still celebrated that year, but the decorations in the city centre - i cannot be sure about the suburbs of birmingham, though i am sure that erdington had at least some kind of merry christmas light up, and i know wylde green still had the christmas tree shaped lights on the lampposts - were very ambivalent, i think, as with all bans like this, the overt christmas signs were only banned from council premises, so shops and pubs could still decorate however they wanted internally.

to whistlingjack, are you sure it was the tories that removed the ability of local authorities to sue for libel? it sounds like a labour idea.

the ban christmas stories are just that. no business in it's right mind would try to ignore christmas as they know full well it's a cash cow that has to be milked. the problem is that those companies are now pushing christmas on us earlier and earlier each year, then are wondering why the profits for the actual christmas period are down. just give it another month or so and they'll be at least one high street store with something christmassy on sale.

 

[Beakmoo]

to whistlingjack, are you sure it was the tories that removed the ability of local authorities to sue for libel? it sounds like a labour idea.

Wow, you must be young!

 

[BeatrixKiddo]

I'm just waiting for the 'all encompassing equality for all blah blah' council to ban religious jewellery being worn by it's workers.

 

[Pietro_Mercurios]

to whistlingjack, are you sure it was the tories that removed the ability of local authorities to sue for libel? it sounds like a labour idea.

Wow, you must be young!

Yes, There's a whole generation that doesn't even remember counting lampposts for YOPS.

Still, their chance will come again.

 

[ihatethatmonkee3]

to whistlingjack, are you sure it was the tories that removed the ability of local authorities to sue for libel? it sounds like a labour idea.

Wow, you must be young!

i realkised after i posted it that labour are a bit too power hungry to have given up local authority powers like that to appease voters. so not young, just sometimes very stoopid lol.

 

[GNC]

i apologize wholeheartedly for my comments, to both gncxx and other forum users. to gncxx, yes christmas was still celebrated that year, but the decorations in the city centre - i cannot be sure about the suburbs of birmingham, though i am sure that erdington had at least some kind of merry christmas light up, and i know wylde green still had the christmas tree shaped lights on the lampposts - were very ambivalent, i think, as with all bans like this, the overt christmas signs were only banned from council premises, so shops and pubs could still decorate however they wanted internally.

Don't worry about your comments, it was just a breakdown in communications. No worries. My point was only that Winterval was nowhere near the total anti-Christmas crusade it was painted as. Thanks for the info.

 

[pTerryH]

Christmas in August

My local Asda has already had its first delivery of crackers, etc. They're not on the shelves, yet, but they're there...

Yesterday (6 August) I noticed the window display in my local Waterstones included an array of Children's Annuals for 2009.

 

[ihatethatmonkee3]

stupid one was paramount comedy have just had a season called christmas in july.

 

[Mal_Adjusted]

Birmingham City Council promises “atheist websites are not blocked”

Responding to a letter of protest from the National Secular Society, Stephen Hughes, the Chief Executive of Birmingham City Council, says that the Council has never blocked websites dealing with atheism and nor does it intend to – even though it is installing the new Bluecoat filtering system from the USA.

The copy of the categories contained on the Bluecoat system that we have seen certainly lump atheism in with cannibalism and the occult as being sites that are to be blocked at all times. It also categorises it with other philosophical positions that it regards as “undesirable”.

Now Mr Hughes says: “The new software (Bluecoat) offers the opportunity to improve the control of access to web sites by producing reports on usage and by allowing more sophisticated access control – such as by time of day. This allows the council to place more of the responsibility of monitoring the use of the Internet on individual service managers and there is a project in place to achieve this. The City Council does not block sites for containing material on atheism, agnosticism, secularism, Wicca, witchcraft, the occult or any similar subjects. It never has done and no proposal has been made that it should.”

Keith Porteous Wood, Executive Director of the National Secular Society, commented: “We are delighted that Birmingham has confirmed, as we very much hoped, that it has no intention of discriminating by blocking access to websites on atheism or Wicca, while allowing it for sites dealing with mainstream religion. This episode highlights that great care needs to be taken when setting up web filtering software that originates outside Europe where attitudes are much less accepting towards those without conventional religious belief and where European anti-discrimination laws do not apply.”

http://www.secularism.org.uk/birmingham ... esath.html

 

[GNC]

A lot of jumping to conclusions, then. Good to know there wasn't much in it, but bad to know that kind of censorship goes on in the US if the NSS source is correct.