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Human Sacrifice

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Why is it that human sacrifices always call for a virgin female to be sacrificed? I understand the general reason behind it, i.e. something to do with purity, but what are the nuts and bolts reasons for it (if you'll pardon the expression)?
 
do you mean the 'occult' reasons or are you looking at it from an outside perspective? some guy (19c writer i think) once said there's nowt so poetic as the death of a beautiful woman so from a literary/folkloric perspective - assuming it's not actually all real i mean - it could be tapping into that, with added kinkiness involving altars, knives etc (stop now before i get carried away and start writing a ken russell film)?
 
I don't think the Aztecs were that fussy, but they did, apparently, get through about a quarter of a million sacrificial victims a year.
Also, I'm not sure that the gender of sacrificed babies in dubious tales of Satanic soirees is ever specified.
I don't know where the notion of sacrificing virgins cmes from, but it ounds like part of the same gothic tradition as 'The Perils Of Pauline' and the "white slave trade" as portrayed in 'Thoroughly Modern Millie'.
 
I think whatever was sacrificed had to be valuable , a young woman or a baby were valuble because of the dangers of childbirth in the past , it wasn't rare for one or both to die during the birth process , these days women and especially babies are not valuable to society , a more meaningful sacrifice would be the burning of £1 000000 .
Marion
 
I think it's because

a. Female virginity has always been a valuable commodity- if a man marries a virgin and keeps her for himself, her children will all be his.
b. Female virginity is believed to be infallibly detectible by physical examination whereas male virginity is not.
c. It looks good in horror films to have terrified, nekkid girls thrashing about.

Look at the cult fillum 'The Wicker Man'-
the central joke is that the virgin lured to the island for sacrifice is a man, thus subverting all the above!
 
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Marion said:
I think whatever was sacrificed had to be valuable , a young woman or a baby were valuble because of the dangers of childbirth in the past , it wasn't rare for one or both to die during the birth process , these days women and especially babies are not valuable to society , a more meaningful sacrifice would be the burning of £1 000000 .
Marion

Ahhhh, so thats what the KLF where playing at!
 
The reason I asked the question was that I was watching the cheesy classic Clash of the Titans yesterday where Andromeda was supposed to be sacrificed to the Kraken, and specifically had to be a virgin. Why? Is a sea monster that scared of catching VD? Most other movies involving a cult sacrifice also make a similar request.
Thanks for your answers above, though so far it seems to be because (1) it's a literary device and (2) virgin females are valuable. But is there an occult/magickal reason?
 
Haha, scared of VD. That seems the best explanation I've heard so far.

But what about just the whole idea of purity? If you want to make someone happy giving them something filthy isn't a good idea. It should be something nice and pure. And if it is a sacrifice of som satanic sort, then it would also maie sense. What fun is there in destroying something filthy? It is better to destroy something that is clean and untouched.
 
Virgins are still being sacrificed now.

It's an old belief that sex with a virgin will cure VD. In African countries that belief is taken to extremes with the wholesale raping of young girls, kids of both sexes and even little babies in attempts to cure AIDS.

All these attacks carried out by men, of course.
There is a scandal going on now, about a little baby of I think 7 months who was gang-raped for this purpose.
B*st*rds.
 
Perhaps it relates to the requirement to sacrifice the purest and best (firstfruits if you're Hebrew). The sacrifice had to be unblemished, perfect in every way. If the sacrifice was to be a human, then virginity would be part of the "unblemished" quality. As pointed out above, virginity is easy to check on girls, thus less chance of cheesing off the god. (I mean, sacrificing a supposed male virgin who was actually a whoremonger would not score points, right? Better safe than sorry.) :)
 
aren't teenage girls physiologically best equipped to give birth, therefore most valuable mates?
 
I think the virgin idea is one of lack of blemish. You are offering the god the best thing that you can. Pre-pubertal boys are acceptable as well (if the legend of Merlin is anything to go by). Mind you Bog sacrifices appear to be fit, strong young men like Pete Bog the Lindow man.
 
Ha! Intaglio beat me to it with the bog sacrifices!

What actual evidence is there that female virgins were the preferred victims? I suspect the literary influence, of the Dennis Wheatley variety, is mostly to blame for this idea.

As already mentioned, the middle american civilizations used victims of either sex, but since they had to go to war to get enough victims, probably most were men.

Killing war prisoners has a long and dishonorable history - part human sacrifice, part ethnic cleansing.

The Hebrew tradition of offering up the first fruits may derive from their neighbours the Phoeniceans, who sacrificed their infant first born to their gods.

Lovely people, our ancestors.
 
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Andean societies require the sacrificial victim to be drunk. Human sacrifice is quite rare now but when it happens its usually adult men, drunk as lords in tin or silver mines, or middle aged women in the foundations of very important buildings. Cant prove that like, I was told it and I believe it. I have seen a pissed up Llama sacrificed to the Virgin Mary in a hybrid Catholic/Andean rite, so maybe the Virgins are trying to even the score.
 
Back on thread, it was not just our ancestors who practised human sacrifice:

washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A25297-2001Nov27.html

(This is on today's FT website.) The victims in these cases in Brazil are boys.

Link is dead. The MIA article can be accessed via the Wayback Machine:
Letter From Brazil
'Witchcraft' Murders Cast A Gruesome Spell
By Anthony Faiola
Washington Post Foreign Service
Wednesday, November 28, 2001; Page C01
https://web.archive.org/web/2001112...ost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A25297-2001Nov27.html
 
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intaglio said:
I think the virgin idea is one of lack of blemish. You are offering the god the best thing that you can. Pre-pubertal boys are acceptable as well (if the legend of Merlin is anything to go by). Mind you Bog sacrifices appear to be fit, strong young men like Pete Bog the Lindow man.

Tollund Man was in his 40s or 50s, but he did appear to be from one of the higher strata of society.

Carole
 
And another bog find in Denmark seems to have been a belly dancer. I can't see her as being very innocent.
 
How do they know she was a belly dancer, Xanatic? OK, maybe the bra with tassels on it was a dead giveaway, but otherwise . . .

Carole
 
Didn't one of Julian Richards "Meet the Ancestors" programs have strong evidence of a human sacrifice?

BTW If human sacrifice came back as a devotional tool, who would be a good selection? Please leave out trolls but holy idiots, virgins (of either sex) or anyone who comes to mind as being worthy of taking a message to god?
 
She had her costume on. It seemed to skimpy to be an ordinary thing those day, and a present belly dancer showed it was actually very good for belly dancing.

On a fortean note, the belly dancer actually got the idea to try it out in a dream.
 
Oddness indeed. Call me naive, but I really didn't think this happened anymore. ~Ren
Peruvian police investigate possible infant sacrifice to earth god

LIMA, Peru (AP) - A decapitated baby boy found on a hilltop near Lake Titicaca may have been the victim of a centuries-old human sacrifice ritual meant to appease a pre-Columbian earth god, police said Wednesday.

The remains of the infant, believed to have been seven months old, were discovered Tuesday on a peninsula in the Yunguyo region near the Bolivian border, a police officer in the regional capital of Puno told The Associated Press.

Investigators believe the killing may have been a ritualistic sacrifice because the body was found on the hilltop surrounded by flowers, liquor bottles and containers of blood. Highland Indians consider many Andean hilltops to be the homes of earthen deities.

Police were led to the remote rural site by villagers upset by the killing, which took place last week, police said.

Peruvian anthropologist Juan Ossio said that human sacrifices date back to the Chavin culture, which flourished in Peru between 900-200 BC.

Although not as large scale as they were in the Aztec culture, which ruled what is now Mexico, human sacrifices remained an official part of Peruvian cultures until the Spanish conquered the Incas 500 years ago, he said.

"Sacrifices were made for more than a thousand year and it is hard to get rid of deeply rooted beliefs."

Anthropologists occasionally encounter reports of human sacrifices while conducting research in Peru, although it is more common to hear about old people being buried alive in an effort to appease the earthen gods, Ossio said.

The ritualistic killing of llamas in an effort to bring good crops is also common in the region around Lake Titicaca, he said.
http://www.cbc.ca/cp/world/040204/w020478.html
 
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Re: Police investigate possible infant sacrifice to earth go

Renigirl said:
Oddness indeed. Call me naive, but I really didn't think this happened anymore.

Christianity never really replaced old religions it just absorbed them and in the New World I'm sure all the old ways are stilling bubbling away underneath the surface.

Its also interesting in regard to the various mummies they have found in the andes at high altitudes like this.

Emps
 
:blush:
Maybe I should explain so as to not sound so ... judgmental.

I meant didn't think it happened more in the sense of ... like it would be weird to come across a group of people out in their front yard making lye soap or something. Just in an archaic sense of the word. (Although I don't personally think human sacrifice is the way to go either ....)

Oh dear ... any way out of this one without sounding horrid?

This must be why I lurk ...
 
Renigirl: LOL no reason to apologise I was really just musing outloud ;) And I'm glad you posted the piece too.

I also didn't think it happened these days either ;) I had assumed the more extreme aspects of the old ways had been sublimated into other practices.

like it would be weird to come across a group of people out in their front yard making lye soap or something.

Or more like taking a walk in the woods and finding as druid sacrificig a virgin or getting out of your tourist bus at an Aztec ruin and finding someone throwing corpses down the stairs ;)

Anyway its good to see traditions being kept alive - I wonder if they could apply for lottery/state funding ;)

Emps
 
Just got through watching the amazing re-release of 1954's Godzilla, fully restored.

1st, a piece of interesting trivia from the film from IMDB:

The idea for Gojira (aka Godzilla) was spawned after producer Tomoyuki Tanaka was forced to cancel a planned Japan-Indonesia co-production called Eiko kage-ni (Behind the Glory). The story was inspired by a real-life nuclear accident in which a Japanese fishing boat ventured too close to an American nuclear test and was contaminated.

But my question (or observation) comes from early in the film, when Godzilla is terrorizing an island. The villiagers there (and it looked like it was supposed to be an old Japanese fishing villiage removed from the mainstream of Tokyo life) talked about human sacrifice to Godzilla in ancient times, who they called a god of the sea. It was presented in the film as a backwater, old-fashioned attitude that only the old and superstitious were into, but it made me wonder: does Japanese history have mention of human sacrifice to old gods? Seems like if they actually did, they would have it historically preserved in histories as an old and established society....
 
Dunno about japan but it you get it in legend elsewhere - well in Clash of the Titans anyway ;)
 
Dim distant past...FT ( a small format one so prity long time ago)..cover story was about mystery Oriental women...washed up on beeches in far east...haveing been improisoned in lens shaped wood and iron "boats" and cast adrift ...middle ages maybe?... anyone else remember it?..
 
Don't know whether this helps:

Some Hokkaido legends about Japanese persons seem to reveal the guilt Japanese people had felt regarding the Ainu throughout the history of colonization. The story called "Human Sacrifice at Cape Yagoshi" expresses the deep-seated resentment of Ainu women who were drowned in the sea by Japanese people in an attempt to appease the anger of a sea god. The story goes on to tell of an uprising by the Ainu and the subsequent downfall of the family of Suetane Aihara who victimized those women. The fictional story focuses on Japanese characters but is composed from the viewpoint of the Ainu. This is proven in the concluding part in which the Japanese who brought death to the Ainu women are punished.

taken from this site:

pref.hokkaido.jp/kseikatu/ks-bsbsk/digest/chapter_7_2.html
Link is dead. The MIA webpage can be accessed via the Wayback Machine:
https://web.archive.org/web/2005092....jp/kseikatu/ks-bsbsk/digest/chapter_7_2.html
 
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sidecar_jon said:
Dim distant past...FT ( a small format one so prity long time ago)..cover story was about mystery Oriental women...washed up on beeches in far east...haveing been improisoned in lens shaped wood and iron "boats" and cast adrift ...middle ages maybe?... anyone else remember it?..

It wasn't the one with the discussion of an old Japanese illustration which some people thought was a UFO?
 
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