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Is there a serial killer around the South of England???

A

Anonymous

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Okay, I appreciate this is rather a gruesome thought, but it's been bugging me for months. Before the Soham case even.

There appear to have been several disappearances of young girls in the last 12 - 18 months around the South. There have also been reports of a serial rapist around the Surrey area. Now, as far as I know, the media have not linked any of these, but is it at all possible that a link exists? Are we looking at a serial killer here? Of course, the 'problem' is that we are not privy to the police investigations until it's all pretty much done and dusted, so we have no idea of how the bodies were found, killed, dumped, etc. It would be interesting to see a map pinpointing the disappearances, dumping grounds and rape scenes to see if a possible connection exists.

What particularly disturbed me at the time of the Soham investigation was that only a week or so before, I commented to 'Im Indoors that 'we were due another one soon'.

I'm probably not alone in considering that, as one of the Cambridgeshire officers arrested on child pornography charges apparently had something to do with the collection of evidence against the two charged with the Soham murders, I can see possible problems for CPS on the horizon in their case.

And a further disturbing thought of mine is that I can only think of three scenarios where a sensible girl would get into a car: 1) someone she knows reasonably well; 2) a man and a woman with a plausible story (such as Brady and Hindley's 'Help me look for a lost glove' story) or 3) a police car.

Maybe I have an overactive, particularly gruesome, imagination though, which 'Im Indoors reckons is just my disturbing way of saying things that no one else wants to, or wants to think.
 
I agree Helen. It has occured to me before that there may be a link between all these cases. But, as you say, it will be impossible to find out until the investigations are dome and dusted. It just seems strange that there are all these similar crimes being comitted in the same part of the country at the same time.
 
Thank God for that Adrian. I thought it might just be me being morbid.
 
Yes, I've been struck by the similarities too: the MO seems to be very similar in each case of recent years.

Surely someone on high has noticed this too?

Hope so :(

Stu
 
Problem is that some of these cases are rather high profile so people could include things in their crimes that could point to a link with other crimes in order to throw people off the scent.

If we could see the entire police file on each crime and see the stuff that the press dont know then we could probably accertain if there is a link or not. I am sure the police have looked into this.
 
I am sure the police have looked into this.
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although, it must be pointed out, they didn't notice that some of the officers involved with the Soham murders were on the list of suspects in an internet child porn investigation:(
 
jima said:
although, it must be pointed out, they didn't notice that some of the officers involved with the Soham murders were on the list of suspects in an internet child porn investigation:(
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They were identified by the FBI as having given their credit card details to gain access to a US pornography site; this particular operation is a lengthy and ongoing one right now and has led to hundreds of arrests in the US. As I understand it, the charges against the two Soham officers relate to incitement to commit a crime, and the distribution of pornographic 'pseudophotographs' - computer-generated images.
Reading between the lines, it seems that the Soham plods were clumsily trying to catch paedophiles, baiting them with faked photographs of child pornography and inviting them to trade. Incitement and entrapment, however worthy the cause, is illegal in the UK which is why they are being prosecuted.
 
And the nasty, cynical part of me thinks 'Entrapment - that's a good defence....'
 
It seems to me that the police in this country don't like to let people know that a serial killer could be hunting in their area. They never say for definite it's always.."Oh we think it might be the work of a serial killer but there's no evidence to support that theory"
 
Helen said:
And a further disturbing thought of mine is that I can only think of three scenarios where a sensible girl would get into a car: 1) someone she knows reasonably well; 2) a man and a woman with a plausible story (such as Brady and Hindley's 'Help me look for a lost glove' story) or 3) a police car.
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I agree with 1 & 2. But wouldn't a police car be a bit, well, noticable?
Anyway, just which cases precisely do you think may be the work of this hypothetical serial killer?
 
I'm not sure a police car would be that noticeable, unless it was acting in a strange way, like driving very slowly. I know I don't tend to notice 'official' people, unless there's something out of the common with their presence, like masses of them gathered before a match.
And you would tend to trust a copper or other person in authority, even though common sense tells you they're as likely to be dangerous as the next person. Or you've got a thing about authority. ;)
 
For a child to know it was a police car, it would have to be marked, and someone would have noticed that, surely?
If the public thought a serial killer was on the loose, every strange loner in the area would be swinging from a lamp post in no time; giving the public information is dangerous.
 
Inverurie Jones said:
If the public thought a serial killer was on the loose, every strange loner in the area would be swinging from a lamp post in no time;
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Yes, the message board would be so quiet. ;)
 
Maybe it's just a conceptual thing - these things tend to happen in clusters. I remember a currant cake analogy - if you mix currants into some cake mix, rather than distribute evenly they tend to cluster. The last big cluster I remember was back in the mid-80s. If you watch the news, it's also the same with plane crashes - you go for months without one, then you get two or three within a couple of weeks.

Interesting thought, though.
 
Summer holidays always seem to be the time kids get abducted and murdered,lots of bored kids , roaming around alone , not wearing much . ( I know , people ahould be allowed to wear what they like without fear of being attacked because of it but this is the real world ) . With the recent high profile cases over the last few years the attackers seem to have been caught , so either the MO is the same bacause that is how you go about abducting and murdering kids ( abduct-attack-murder to silence them-dump them in coutryside ) or yes, it is the police doing it .
 
Re: Re: Re: Is there a serial killer around the South of Eng

Helen said:
Yes a police car would be noticeable, but you wouldn't pay much attention to it. You would just assume it was going around, doing it's law-abiding business.
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Well of course it wouldn't be noticed at the time. But it would obviously be mentioned in witness statements: "Well, I did notice this funny-looking bloke walking quite slowly up that road around 7.30 or maybe 8 - it was just after one of your patrol cars came by, so perhaps you could check the time with the driver..."
 
Detectives drive unmarked cars, and its within the bounds of possibility that some evil person has fake detective credentials.
Tell a child that, for example, its parents have been in an accident and they'll be driven to their homes, and how many kids would question the information or think of an alternative to going along with the driver. Its a horrible thought.
I think my imagination has gone into overdrive. :eek:
 
Susan Bulmer said:
Detectives drive unmarked cars, and its within the bounds of possibility that some evil person has fake detective credentials.
Tell a child that, for example, its parents have been in an accident and they'll be driven to their homes, and how many kids would question the information or think of an alternative to going along with the driver. Its a horrible thought.
I think my imagination has gone into overdrive. :eek:
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Yes, I agree. There are unmarked police cars driven by plain-clothes plods - but would an abductor pretending to be a policeman waste time by trying to convince a child they they were a copper,with the risk that the child would see through the bluff and run off, or that he would be seen by a witness? The child might have just seen her parents 30 seconds before, for instance.
Robert Black's MO - to just grab the kid as they pass and stuff them into the vehicle as quickly as possible - is the method usually employed by successful abductors.
 
Just had a thought - what has happened to 'rape' alarms etc? I still think they could be effective in an emergency - if only as a temporary deterrent, giving enough time for a getaway.

Also train children to note details about any driver/vehicle which offers a lift or asks directions. Legitimate drivers only talk to other adults or groups.

H.
 
Annasdottir said:
There are unmarked police cars driven by plain-clothes plods ....
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..and there are also unmarked cars driven by uniformed plods. A clean, tidy, 'official'-looking car, clothing that resembles a police uniform - effective enough to be credible, especially to a child?
 
DerekH said:
..and there are also unmarked cars driven by uniformed plods. A clean, tidy, 'official'-looking car, clothing that resembles a police uniform - effective enough to be credible, especially to a child?
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Yes, but still too much time for the child to get away, for witnesses to notice. As Robert Black knew, every second counts in this sort of crime. Some kids do escape from inept would-be abductors - none of them has so far reported being lured by a bogus copper.
 
Annasdottir said:
Yes, but still too much time for the child to get away, for witnesses to notice. As Robert Black knew, every second counts in this sort of crime.
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Timing, confidence, the amazing luck these bastards seem to have....

Annasdottir said:
Some kids do escape from inept would-be abductors - none of them has so far reported being lured by a bogus copper.
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Confidence, credibility, homework - and only offer a lift when it's certain the target is duped.

OK, I agree, actually, the idea probably belongs in the realm of fiction - but I still think it's a possibility, nonetheless.
 
This is an extraordinarily interesting thread!

The thing with rape alarms, is I'm presuming the same problem with car alarms. Nobody pays any attention to them. I saw someone being bundled into a car once and out of concern I called the police, only to be told by them a few hours later that the girl was a runaway who was being "abducted" back home by her father. She was putting up a hell of a struggle, I can tell you.

Incidentally, what was the Brady/Hindley story?
 
Susan Bulmer said:
Detectives drive unmarked cars, and its within the bounds of possibility that some evil person has fake detective credentials.
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Aren't there/were adverts in FT which advertised fake ID?
Always wondered what sort of person would respond to these.
 
The children would surely have been told by their parents never to go with anyone they didn't know, even those claiming to be a police officer. We were told that even in primary school.
 
if police are possible what about the army?
weren't the soham bodies found near an army base?
 
I'd just like to point out at this juncture that the police car scenario was just a suggestion. I was only thinking of possible scenarios that would induce a child to get into a car with a stranger.

It may also do to remember that Black was going for years before anyone witnessed him bundling his final victim into the back of his van.
 
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