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Old Urban Legends

Tempest63 said:
One of my uncles had the British Oak on the Lea Bridge Road for a short while. It held some record for the length of the bar if memory serves me right.
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Actually Temp, I’ve remembered a little story about the Oak that you may be interested in. Perhaps your uncle would have been in situ at the time of the incident. We are talking very late 1980’s /early 1990’s

As you were probably aware, the Oak was one of those pubs in which many of the young turks from Walthamstow, Leyton, Leytonstone, Hackney etc would congregate on a Friday and Saturday night. There was always an uneasy peace as the groups of lads from the different areas would eye each other up from different areas of the pub.

One night (and I don’t know why) a mass brawl broke out and most of the lads got involved. At one point a guy (who shall remain nameless, but I knew came from Walthamstow) took out a gun from his inside jacket pocket. Someone shouted, “he’s got a shooter”, which obviously caused chaos. People were jumping under tables, running out of the door or into the toilets to escape - it was bedlam.

I knew the guy who had the gun, and knew it wasn’t real. It was just an authentic looking water pistol, that he’s picked up on one of his travels abroad, so I found the whole thing very funny.

Eventually things calmed down and once people found out it was only a water pistol everyone saw the funny side, apart from obviously the landlord.

From memory the guy with the gun was not banned from the pub by the landlord, but he did get a harsh talking to by him. :)
 
Dick Turpin said:
Actually Temp, I’ve remembered a little story about the Oak that you may be interested in. Perhaps your uncle would have been in situ at the time of the incident. We are talking very late 1980’s /early 1990’s

As you were probably aware, the Oak was one of those pubs in which many of the young turks from Walthamstow, Leyton, Leytonstone, Hackney etc would congregate on a Friday and Saturday night. There was always an uneasy peace as the groups of lads from the different areas would eye each other up from different areas of the pub.

One night (and I don’t know why) a mass brawl broke out and most of the lads got involved. At one point a guy (who shall remain nameless, but I knew came from Walthamstow) took out a gun from his inside jacket pocket. Someone shouted, “he’s got a shooter”, which obviously caused chaos. People were jumping under tables, running out of the door or into the toilets to escape - it was bedlam.

I knew the guy who had the gun, and knew it wasn’t real. It was just an authentic looking water pistol, that he’s picked up on one of his travels abroad, so I found the whole thing very funny.

Eventually things calmed down and once people found out it was only a water pistol everyone saw the funny side, apart from obviously the landlord.

From memory the guy with the gun was not banned from the pub by the landlord, but he did get a harsh talking to by him. :)
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My uncle only had it as a holding manager for the owners when it was up for sale, which would have been early 2000’s.
Uncle Alan was the rogue of my mums family. Born and bred at the Rockingham estate, elephant and castle, he mixed with all the local faces, including the train robbers, and did a few stretches away in his time.
His MO was spiriting away HGV’s full of high value goods back in the sixties and seventies. Even When he was a sick old man the front door would come in and he would be hauled off to whatever nick for questioning whenever a high value load went missing.
Where I come from in Bermondsey it would be a brave man to pull out a water pistol in a pub as there would be a strong likelihood that a couple more of those present may have been holding the real thing and it could have got messy.

Me on the other hand was the goody two shoes who was out of south London for the wilds of Essex at 18 for a quieter life and to raise a family away from Bermondsey or Brixton, where my first wife was from. We had hoped to raise the kids without them being shot, stabbed or sent to prison. It worked and they all have decent jobs.
 
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Urban legends: stories of the unusual, grotesque, or implausible told in slightly altered forms by various people, often in the form of "it happened to me" or "a friend of a friend" or, more lamely, "they do say..."

I have spent much of my life in and around Nottingham. We used to have several very distinctive "tramps" although I have seen none of them for years and suspect they have all died. By "tramps" I mean people of no fixed abode, but not what you might call "ordinary" homeless people. The "ordinary" homeless sleep in shop doorways, or in cheap tents by the canal, or in homeless shelters. Tramps seem to be always on the move, and and are often dressed in badly torn rags, almost like a costume.

There were legends about these tramps, most of whom were widely reported to be extremely rich men who had each "lost their mind" when some tragedy had befallen them. It was never a business folding, or a routine severe illness. It was always the death of a spouse, or an entire family in horrible circumstances.

Separately, I wonder to what extent magazines such as Reader's Digest, as well as the internet, has affected the "natural pattern" of urban legends. I remember a very good friend, now sadly deceased, who told me in a great detail a "true story" that had directly happened to him when he worked on the ambulance service. It was a story I had read many times in old copies of Reader's Digest. I remember feeling mildly insulted that he was trying to pass off as true such an old story.
 
Tempest63 said:
I would beg to differ.

Admittedly I have not eaten on Brick Lane for several years now, but it no longer has a “Jewel in the Crown” restaurant such as Sadiques where I used to entertain clients in the nineties. Sweet and Spicy closed some years ago which was a canteen style lunch spot and has never been replaced.

The reports I get from colleagues is that Brick Lane has had its day and most restaurants are quite mediocre, fighting over a diminishing trade. A lot of the Indian restaurants have closed and been taken over by alternative trades.

I still shop there though for spices etc., that I would struggle to find locally, the Taj stores being my preferred outlet.
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Head to the hinterlands!

Southall still has some very good eateries, and vegetarian and dosa canteens, Indian sweet shops. A highlight for a splurge is Madhu's on the main street down from the station. Also Quality Foods, which is a big old supermarket filled with south Asian stuff, plus pots, pans, and all the fresh exotica - an even bigger branch is in Hounslow (memories of staying in Hounslow overnight in 2017 for a wedding do, and the next morning finding out Quality was around the corner. We had our first car -Mr J having just passed his test - and proceeded to fill it with onions, rice, spices, all the veg!). It's not a pretty place but it's got some useful shops.
 
Dick Turpin said:
Yup

Some of my earliest memories is sitting outside pubs, waiting for the old man to appear with a bottle of coke and a packet of crisps. On match days it would always be the Oliver twist on Oliver road Leyton (now flats sadly) Or if it was warm, I was allowed to take my little fishing net and we’d go to the prince of Wales in Hackney (it backed onto the river Lea) where I’d try to catch sticklebacks in the river.

Without a doubt though, every Sunday around 2pm my Mum would shout at me to go and find my dad as dinner was nearly ready. Off I’d go on my pushbike to every pub on brick lane. I’d always find him at the southern end of brick as he’d almost finished his pub crawl by then, from north of the lane to the south – most of the time I’d find him in the Severn stars. It’s been a while since I’ve been back. How many pubs on brick lane there is now I wonder.
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I remember the Seven Stars! My brother was a street trader and on Sundays I would help him out and we would fly pitch in a jewellers shop door by Aldgate East tube. When we had finished my brother would pop in to the Seven Stars and I would have to wait outside!
 
Re Tramps - Mikefule said "There were legends about these tramps, most of whom were widely reported to be extremely rich men who had each "lost their mind" when some tragedy had befallen them. It was never a business folding, or a routine severe illness. It was always the death of a spouse, or an entire family in horrible circumstances".

Yes , must be a country wide phenomena. The formerly rich tramp. We had one locally that we called ",Father Christmas" as kids, on account of his long white beard. The older folk used to gossip that he used to be rich !!
 
Tempest63 said:
I would beg to differ.

Admittedly I have not eaten on Brick Lane for several years now, but it no longer has a “Jewel in the Crown” restaurant such as Sadiques where I used to entertain clients in the nineties. Sweet and Spicy closed some years ago which was a canteen style lunch spot and has never been replaced.

The reports I get from colleagues is that Brick Lane has had its day and most restaurants are quite mediocre, fighting over a diminishing trade. A lot of the Indian restaurants have closed and been taken over by alternative trades.

I still shop there though for spices etc., that I would struggle to find locally, the Taj stores being my preferred outlet.
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I'm sure there used to be a jewish bakers nearby that used to open about 3am for the night club trade and you could get delicious fresh bagels.
 
eziofan said:
I remember the Seven Stars! My brother was a street trader and on Sundays I would help him out and we would fly pitch in a jewellers shop door by Aldgate East tube. When we had finished my brother would pop in to the Seven Stars and I would have to wait outside!
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Is it still open I wonder...?
 
Dick Turpin said:
Bloody hell........really.?
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2008;
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eziofan said:
Wow! Must be over 35 years ago when I last had an egg bagel down Brick Lane at 4am! :hahazebs:
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Probably about the same for me. I’m sure they still do pretty well with clubbers/night owls. Proper beigels, a different animal to the ones you get in supermarkets - gotta get them fresh - a couple of them makes quite a substantial snack.

They’re all good - I used to like the chopped herring ones.

Dunno if the leather jacket shops are still there..
 
eziofan said:
we would fly pitch in a jewellers shop door by Aldgate East tube.
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Those were the days, fly pitching East Lane, SE17 most weekends though an occasional Sunday trip out to Blackbush Market would be a nice change; Leather lane Market during the week, and in the early days of my fly pitching career Oxford Street, until they had a purge, the fines went through the roof and they would confiscate your stock.
I still swear that whoever wrote Only Fools n Horses knew my two brothers and based it on them.
 
FunkyTT said:
Re Tramps - Mikefule said "There were legends about these tramps, most of whom were widely reported to be extremely rich men who had each "lost their mind" when some tragedy had befallen them. It was never a business folding, or a routine severe illness. It was always the death of a spouse, or an entire family in horrible circumstances".

Yes , must be a country wide phenomena. The formerly rich tramp. We had one locally that we called ",Father Christmas" as kids, on account of his long white beard. The older folk used to gossip that he used to be rich !!
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When I was young there was a 'proper' tramp around our way who pushed his stuff around in an old pram. It was said that it was stuffed full of money hidden underneath the rags in the pram.
 
Tempest63 said:
Those were the days, fly pitching East Lane, SE17 most weekends though an occasional Sunday trip out to Blackbush Market would be a nice change; Leather lane Market during the week, and in the early days of my fly pitching career Oxford Street, until they had a purge, the fines went through the roof and they would confiscate your stock.
I still swear that whoever wrote Only Fools n Horses knew my two brothers and based it on them.
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My brother did East Lane as well! Although he was from Stratford, he moved to Brockley when he got married.
 
I think we're a nation of sentimentalists, and natural storytellers. This trope of 'ill-fated tramps who were/are rich' - arguably like the (dubious) tragedies associated with so many real-life ghost stories - might be an example of our gift for making legends grow in the telling, and re-telling.
 
hunck said:
There’s 2 Beigel shops still on Brick Lane & both are open 24/7. Best Beigels around.

Beigel Bake

Beigel Shop
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Down to one - Beigel Shop has closed suddenly

Mystery as famous Brick Lane bagel shop famed for 'never closing' shuts its doors

The Beigel Shop claims to be one of the oldest in London having opened as a family run business in 1855 and then moved to its current location in 1987

The most recent hygiene inspection of the Beigel Shop gave it a rating of 2/5, meaning "improvement necessary" – it remains unknown if the recent closure is regarding this rating. Usually open 24/7, the shop did close down once before in 2014 because of a row between family members, which saw another legal notice slapped on the door for a short time before it reopened
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.Years ago when I was small there used to be an old woman who sold oranges from the steps of the post office.
Lots of people felt sorry for her and would buy an orange each time they passed.
She eventually died and apparently she had thousands in her bank account.
 
eziofan said:
Wow! Must be over 35 years ago when I last had an egg bagel down Brick Lane at 4am! :hahazebs:
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I went to one of them all the time with my cockney ex. I always had smoked salmon and cream cheese! Last time I went would have been 20 years ago...
 
Anyone remember the 1970s/early 80s tramps on Leeds bus station? The urban legends there were that they were old soldiers - probably true. At some point, they did up the bus station and the tramps seemed to largely vanish.

There was also a tramp who slept behind the hedge that ran along the line of a wall in the gardens opposite St William's College next to York Minster. Council got wise to it and tore down the hedge in an attempt to pretend there were no homeless people in York. There was a well worn path to his spot behind the hedge, like he'd been living there years.
 
There used to be a group of older people that would sit drinking in the alcove's
round the bottom of the lower lighthouse in Fleetwood, known as the Lighthouse
family, the Pier was maybe about a 100 yards away and one night in 2007 it burnt
down, the Pier had been bought by a business man and he wanted to build flats
on the site but this was turned down, now what ever happened that night I don't
know but I have not seen the Lighthouse family since.

https://piers.org.uk/piers/fleetwood-victoria-pier/
 
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