Suicide: What Happens Afterward? (Afterlife Ramifications)

[Anonymous]

I know the Christian view is you go straight to hell.....but what are other views?

 

[ruffready]

I don't think

that question can be answered. It can only be speculated upon. :cross eye

 

[Anonymous]

I know the Christian view is you go straight to hell.....but what are other views?

It was not always so. Here's some stuff from a Christian Science Monitor Web Page.

Indeed, the history of persecution of pople who attempt suicide - and their families - is nearly as long as the history of Christianity itself. In the 4th century, St. Augustine first condemned suicide as an act of self-murder,although scholars point out that church leaders did not stigmatize the practice before that.

In the Middle Ages, one church committee assembled a list of all of the martyrs who had taken their own lives and stripped them of their sainthood. In England, those who attempted suicide were brought to trial - and promptly executed, if they were found guilty.

Popular attitudes began to change in the 1890s, with the emergence of the field of sociology and its premise that society affects behavior. Later, the popularization of Freudian psychology furthered this belief, until in 1983, the Roman Catholic Church dropped suicide from its list of unforgivable sins.

Basically, St Augustine condemned suicide, because so many early Christians were using it as a path to early Martyrdom. Sound familiar?

Church leaders were worried because they were losing so many of their flock, it was becoming a serious problem.

 

[carole]

Didn't it used to be a crime under English Law - self murder and all that?

Carole

 

[James_H]

im not sure the idea was that you went to hell so much as you could not rest, haunted the living, or became a vampire. And you'd get buried away from holy ground, at a crossroads, just in case.

 

[Anonymous]

Thank you for the info. I look forward to hearing from more people.

 

[Inhabitant]

I think Dante had some views on this subject.

 

[Inhabitant]

"The Harpy has the upper torso of a hideous old hag, this image, combined with the wings, body and legs of a vulture is enough to put fear into the most steadfast of hearts. She has dirt encrusted talons at the end of her fingers and on her vulture feet, her hair is matted and filthy. Virgil describes the Harpies as suffering from constant diarrhea which adds to their already overpowering stench which can be smelled before their arrival and long after their departure. This stench is so strong that those who encounter it often suffer from nausea and so are less able to defend themselves. While their victims are retching the Harpies rip at the flesh with their filthy, sharp talons leaving great wounds which, if not immediately fatal, often become infected and poisonous.

Harpies scavenge for food in flocks of 20 or 30. The Greeks believed that the Harpies' ravenous hunger was due to a curse of the gods which condemned them to starve for eternity.

Dante credited the Harpies as being the guardians and tormentors of the souls of those who had committed suicide"

Mmm. Nice.

http://www.britwitch.com/dragons/harpy.html

 

[river_styx]

"The Harpy has the upper torso of a hideous old hag, this image, combined with the wings, body and legs of a vulture is enough to put fear into the most steadfast of hearts. She has dirt encrusted talons at the end of her fingers and on her vulture feet, her hair is matted and filthy. Virgil describes the Harpies as suffering from constant diarrhea which adds to their already overpowering stench which can be smelled before their arrival and long after their departure. This stench is so strong that those who encounter it often suffer from nausea and so are less able to defend themselves. While their victims are retching the Harpies rip at the flesh with their filthy, sharp talons leaving great wounds which, if not immediately fatal, often become infected and poisonous.

Harpies scavenge for food in flocks of 20 or 30. The Greeks believed that the Harpies' ravenous hunger was due to a curse of the gods which condemned them to starve for eternity.

Dante credited the Harpies as being the guardians and tormentors of the souls of those who had committed suicide"

Mmm. Nice.

http://www.britwitch.com/dragons/harpy.html

I used to work with a woman who was just like that.

If you kill yourself the police come along and arrest your corpse.
You're buried on unconsecrated ground, or at a crossroads as suicides were thought to return as vampires. Your head would also be removed.

 

[Anonymous]

The spirit goes to the same place as all others who die;where or what that is depends on a persons belief structure;the idea of suicide being a "mortal sin"is man-made and has condemned countless thousands of those bereaved left behind to despair and shame.

[Post edited by Moderator]

 

[Anonymous]

suicide

Your spiritual development at the time of the suicide may well determine whether you 1) have an afterlife, 2) have just enough spark to be reincarnated, or 3) rise and dissipate like so much helium...

 

[Anonymous]

No-one has truly succeeded and returned to comment. However, taking the testimony of numbers of would-be suicides who recovered or were pulled back from the brink suggests that the NDE experience resulting from ending one's own life is often conscious and unpleasant, resulting in few reattempting. In fact, many have found new enthusiasm and purpose in life as a result.
Whether these are real experiences as we understand them or not, as a counselling principle - that consciousness is not extinguished at death; that suicide is a path to potentially deeper anguish than the life one may be trying to escape; that life is purposeful and rewarding, and potentially so up to ever more by working through all of life's problems and shifting focus and concern for others and away from the self - it could surely benefit many: both the erstwhile suicidee and the true victims of such an act - their families and friends.

 

[Anonymous]

What happens after is everyone who ever loved or cared for you are left broken hearted and burdened with guilt. It is the most selfish act possible with very few exceptions (cancer etc).

 

[rynner2]

.....it could surely benefit many: both the erstwhile suicidee and the true victims of such an act - their families and friends.

But suppose someone commits suicide because they no longer have any family or friends, and they feel totally alone...?

What happens after is everyone who ever loved or cared for you are left broken hearted and burdened with guilt.

Perhaps if they really had cared, the suicide would never have happened.

Whingeing afterwards is a symptom that people did not recognise the actual distress the suicidee was in - they are trying to offload their own guilt.

Some of these comments are as insensitive as saying to people with depression "Pull yourself together, it's not so bad!" or to telling someone overweight "Just eat less!"

SIMPLISTIC CRAP.

 

[Anonymous]

in bible class, the teachers handed out these pamphlets with more sins in them(all of which were bullocks.) one of them was "Being gloomy." the Church actually thinks it can dictate our feelings...

 

[Anonymous]

But suppose someone commits suicide because they no longer have any family or friends, and they feel totally alone...?Perhaps if they really had cared, the suicide would never have happened.

Whingeing afterwards is a symptom that people did not recognise the actual distress the suicidee was in - they are trying to offload their own guilt.

Some of these comments are as insensitive as saying to people with depression "Pull yourself together, it's not so bad!" or to telling someone overweight "Just eat less!"

SIMPLISTIC CRAP.

Nothings ever simple, and I apologise for making it seem that way(I was in a rush and on the way out). This is a very emotive and long considered topic of mine, having somewhat expereience of both sides of the issue. My life very much depends upon and revovles around my friends and loved ones, as I am sure it does for most people. When I was younger, I did not appreciate that so much and through various depressions approached the idea of suicide. I never did, suffice to say but became quite wanton with the idea.
After seeing the wide ranging and long lasting effects of someone else doing so however, I have come to detest the notion and know that as long as I care or love anyone, I would never do such a thing for it truly has the power to destroy more than your life, whatever you think of yourself. In some ways I am lucky to gain such a perspective, as I am sure it has saved my own life and helped me through. But given the chance I would rather it had never happened and all my friends and their family would have been spared that suffering. At the end of the day the dead are dead and in whatever nirvana awaits them, but the living still live and have to cope with it.

Whingeing afterwards is a symptom that people did not recognise the actual distress the suicidee was in - they are trying to offload their own guilt.

Not the most sensitive statement either, very few people whinge aboutit but in fact let it eat them up and destroy them, and is never something that can be offloaded. In aworld as busy as ours is it is often the case that we neglect those we care about and that is a fault that shoulod be rectified, but the true responsiblility must reside with the individual (how do you prevent their suicide if they don't even let on they are depressed?).

If you commit suicide you may or may not go to hell, but everyone you leave behind will.

 

[Anonymous]

I have a friend who though she has freqent suicidal thoughts has never atempted it.

Her reason is that she hasn't found a foolproof methord and wouldn't want to fail.

Sensable view.

 

[Anonymous]

Re

Well said, Hermes.

It's a frightening thought that, should you be in a state of extreme anguish when you commit suicide, that anguish energy may stay with your soul for who knows how long....creating a Hell of your own making, an afterlife of extended pain.

 

[Pete Younger]

If you smoke, drink alcohol or use recreational drugs, are you committing suicide by stealth?

 

[rynner2]

If you smoke, drink alcohol or use recreational drugs, are you committing suicide by stealth?

If you live, you die, whether you drink alcohol, tea, Pepsi or water. Life is fatal - unless, perhaps, you are a Raelian....

 

[Anonymous]

If you live, you die, whether you drink alcohol, tea, Pepsi or water. Life is fatal - unless, perhaps, you are a Raelian....

It was that crazy, Glaswegian, Jazz playing, psychiatrist, R.D. Laing that said it (may not have been the first either):

"Life is a terminal illness with no cure."

But, I prefer that Welsh, crazy boyo, Dylan Thomas:

"Fight, fight against the dying of the light!"

I lost two people very close to me last year, one in a horrible, slow fashion, one shockingly quick.

Life's an amazing thing. Think of that moth fluttering in to the lighted room through an open window, fluttering around for a while and then returning out into the darkness. What is it all about?

Don't think you don't make a dent, though. I look back at the people I have known, now gone and I remember much. There is pain in the heart, because there's an awareness of that human experience, uniqueness, and beingness slipping into the past, into history and oblivion. And then you realise you are on the same train, just heading on up the line a few more stops.

I believe deeply that the journey is important. Is the ticket a single, return, or season? Just make sure you're in the WC when the conductor comes along. You don't want to be thrown off before your stop!


:spinning

 

[Pinklefish]

Just make sure you're in the WC when the conductor comes along. You don't want to be thrown off before your stop!


:spinning

From now on this will be the reason I give for spending so long in the loo.

 

[Anonymous]

suicides and hell

Well said, Hermes.

It's a frightening thought that, should you be in a state of extreme anguish when you commit suicide, that anguish energy may stay with your soul for who knows how long....creating a Hell of your own making, an afterlife of extended pain.

I agree. I personally believe that "hell" is a self created place, different for everyone. I think when a person dies with any bad attatchments (i.e. terrible guilt or sadness) it is only natural that it would stay with the conciousness after the body has passed. This has sort of always been my explanation to why there are some souls who seem to stick around and become ghosts and others don't. Maybe they have bad attachments, regrets, or just can't accept that it's over.

 

[marion]

My mother has strong Buddhist leanings and always told me that if your life is shit and you kill yourself you will be born again into the same sort of shit life and so on until you learn from it and stay alive . It is possible she thought I might be thinking about suicide when she said that , it seems to make sense though. It puts you off if you think it might be true!

 

[escargot]

But, I prefer that Welsh, crazy boyo, Dylan Thomas:

What Dylan said was 'Rage, rage against the dying of the light'. For him, the 'light' died and not the person. He saw death as a sort of engulfing night in which humans cannot be seen: their consciousness lives on but is engulfed in darkness. Sounds like hell to me.

 

[Anonymous]

Crumbs!

What Dylan said was 'Rage, rage against the dying of the light'. For him, the 'light' died and not the person. He saw death as a sort of engulfing night in which humans cannot be seen: their consciousness lives on but is engulfed in darkness. Sounds like hell to me.

I stand corrected there Escargot! That's how I remembered it.

Note: must check quotes more carefully in future.

 

[escargot]

Ah Andro, you remembered the INTENTION of the poem, which is what a poet would appreciate more than an ability to spout it parrot-fashion.

An old English tutor of mine told us how he'd seen and heard his young son and friends banging sticks on an old oildrum, to the rhythym of 'Tiger! Tiger! Burning bright! In the middle of the night!'

They were of course referring to Blake's 'The Tyger'-

Tyger! Tyger! burning bright
In the forests of the night,
What immortal hand or eye
Could frame thy fearful symmetry?

- and their misquoting and actions were perfectly in the spirit of the poem, which is about God's massively physical task of creating the world. In the poem God uses foundry tools like a blacksmith would to hammer out everything from animals to stars, hence the bang! bang! bang! rhythym.

Blake would have been happy with my tutor's son's rendition of The Tyger, and Dylan would be pleased with you.

(And I am too, as Dylan is a hero of mine and I named a son after him.)

 

[Pete Younger]

My mother has strong Buddhist leanings and always told me that if your life is shit and you kill yourself you will be born again into the same sort of shit life and so on until you learn from it and stay alive . It is possible she thought I might be thinking about suicide when she said that , it seems to make sense though. It puts you off if you think it might be true!

I could never reconcile myself to that belief, after all, how could you learn from mistakes made in a past life if you cant remember it?

 

[Anonymous]

Escargot wrote:
...and Dylan would be pleased with you.

:blush: blush!

I could never reconcile myself to that belief, after all, how could you learn from mistakes made in a past life if you cant remember it?

Sounds a bit like Evolution to me!

 

[Anonymous]

It was that crazy, Glaswegian, Jazz playing, psychiatrist, R.D. Laing that said it (may not have been the first either):

"Life is a terminal illness with no cure."

But, I prefer that Welsh, crazy boyo, Dylan Thomas:

"Fight, fight against the dying of the light!"

I lost two people very close to me last year, one in a horrible, slow fashion, one shockingly quick.

Life's an amazing thing. Think of that moth fluttering in to the lighted room through an open window, fluttering around for a while and then returning out into the darkness. What is it all about?

Don't think you don't make a dent, though. I look back at the people I have known, now gone and I remember much. There is pain in the heart, because there's an awareness of that human experience, uniqueness, and beingness slipping into the past, into history and oblivion. And then you realise you are on the same train, just heading on up the line a few more stops.

I believe deeply that the journey is important. Is the ticket a single, return, or season? Just make sure you're in the WC when the conductor comes along. You don't want to be thrown off before your stop!


:spinning

I like the sentament Androman and i feal for your loss.