The Defibrillator Theory

[Stormkhan]

This one had passed my notice until I saw it on FB today.
As people see more and more public defibrillator machines outside schools, some prominent scenery munchers such as Laurence Fox and the 'popular music stars' Right Said Fred have used it as a sign of harm linking it with 5G/Covid jabs etc.

"A post on Instagram claims that a Public Access Defibrillator near a children’s playground in a park in Nottingham has been installed because of heart-related conditions occurring as a result of a combination the COVID-19 vaccine and 5G phone signals.
"The post contains a reposted video of a man pointing towards a yellow PAD stand, who claims that children have been “dropping like flies” of heart-attacks since the COVID-19 vaccine was introduced, alluding to a conspiracy to ‘cover up’ the effects of the vaccine. The caption suggests that 5G phone signal masts are also responsible." [Source: Logically.ai - https://www.logically.ai/factchecks/library/50f913e1]

Now, my own take is ... the more the merrier. Considering the prevalence of heart attacks in an adult population any location where adults may gather is good and as a well-known and publicised public space, a school is an ideal spot for an adult to find anything.
I've not dug into the statistics of heart attacks or arrhythmia (the latter of which a defib is most useful) in children but I'm fairly certain that they've not been situated there to treat the children - if a school wanted one then wouldn't they have them indoors?

Thoughts, anyone?

 

[Floyd]

I wouldn't worry. A public access Defibrillator won't last five minutes without being vandalised.

 

[escargot]

Where we live there loads of public defibrillators. This one is in a former telephone box most of the way up a steep hill at Timbersbrook in Cheshire's Peak District.
When you're pedalling up there on a hot day, seeing double and with gritted teeth, it's a welcome sight. Might just need it.

 

[Min Bannister]

Now, my own take is ... the more the merrier. Considering the prevalence of heart attacks in an adult population any location where adults may gather is good and as a well-known and publicised public space, a school is an ideal spot for an adult to find anything.
I've not dug into the statistics of heart attacks or arrhythmia (the latter of which a defib is most useful) in children but I'm fairly certain that they've not been situated there to treat the children - if a school wanted one then wouldn't they have them indoors?

That makes perfect sense. This conspiracy theory is almost like a study in how conspiracy theories are started. People putting 2 and 2 together to come up with -1.

 

[Beresford]

This one had passed my notice until I saw it on FB today.
As people see more and more public defibrillator machines outside schools, some prominent scenery munchers such as Laurence Fox and the 'popular music stars' Right Said Fred have used it as a sign of harm linking it with 5G/Covid jabs etc.

"A post on Instagram claims that a Public Access Defibrillator near a children’s playground in a park in Nottingham has been installed because of heart-related conditions occurring as a result of a combination the COVID-19 vaccine and 5G phone signals.
"The post contains a reposted video of a man pointing towards a yellow PAD stand, who claims that children have been “dropping like flies” of heart-attacks since the COVID-19 vaccine was introduced, alluding to a conspiracy to ‘cover up’ the effects of the vaccine. The caption suggests that 5G phone signal masts are also responsible." [Source: Logically.ai - https://www.logically.ai/factchecks/library/50f913e1]

Now, my own take is ... the more the merrier. Considering the prevalence of heart attacks in an adult population any location where adults may gather is good and as a well-known and publicised public space, a school is an ideal spot for an adult to find anything.
I've not dug into the statistics of heart attacks or arrhythmia (the latter of which a defib is most useful) in children but I'm fairly certain that they've not been situated there to treat the children - if a school wanted one then wouldn't they have them indoors?

Thoughts, anyone?

A good number of community defibs have been installed in settlements close to me. They are situated in many different facilities e.g. on the external walls of shops, community centres, pubs and at least one in an old phone box. They started to be installed long before COVID appeared. With regard to schools, in my own area this programme is being rolled out just now.

In my opinion Mr Fox, Fred and Richard need help. Really, really need help.

 

[CharmerKamelion]

In my opinion Mr Fox, Fred and Richard need help. Really, really need help.

Not-so-fantastic Mr Fox - and Wrong Said Fred.

For me the weirdest thing about public defibrillators is how do they know that's where all the heart attacks are going to happen? Are they installed by time travellers? Or are people supposed to hang around nearby, just on the off chance?

 

[Beresford]

Not-so-fantastic Mr Fox - and Wrong Said Fred.

For me the weirdest thing about public defibrillators is how do they know that's where all the heart attacks are going to happen? Are they installed by time travellers? Or are people supposed to hang around nearby, just on the off chance?

It can depend on a number of things e.g. where people are most likely to gather, the business or community group leading the project, where it is less likely to be vandalised and the proximity of a suitable power source.

 

[Trevp666]

The public-use defibs have been getting installed all over the place for years and years.
"In the late 1970s the Heart-Aid was developed as the first truly automated external defibrillator that was designed for the public."
History of Defibs on wikipedia.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automated_external_defibrillator

IMO the increased incidence of people keeling over on sports pitches etc being linked (perhaps not so ridiculously) with C19 jabs (IIRC a recent figure of 1 in 800 as opposed to 1 in 2000 in records before 2019) is being hijacked to conspiracise* a link with "look at all these defibs popping up everywhere!"

* - new word invented.

 

[CharmerKamelion]

The public-use defibs have been getting installed all over the place for years and years.
"In the late 1970s the Heart-Aid was developed as the first truly automated external defibrillator that was designed for the public."
History of Defibs on wikipedia.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automated_external_defibrillator

IMO the increased incidence of people keeling over on sports pitches etc being linked (perhaps not so ridiculously) with C19 jabs (IIRC a recent figure of 1 in 800 as opposed to 1 in 2000 in records before 2019) is being hijacked to conspiracise* a link with "look at all these defibs popping up everywhere!"

* - new word invented.

Thanks for your very sensible and informative reply, Beresford - which my silly post definitely didn't warrant!

'Conspiracise' is a great new word, Trev. How have we got this far without it? It will defintely catch on.

 

[Beresford]

Thanks for your very sensible and informative reply, Beresford - which my silly post definitely didn't warrant!

Not at all. You were probably asking a question others would as well.

 

[Ascalon]

[Sigh]
The old 5G thing again.
FFS!
Whatever about a relationship between heart issues and vaccines, to say 5G has even the slightest influence is akin to saying the faeries did.

 

[kamalktk]

Dang faeries!

 

[CharmerKamelion]

Dang faeries!

It the ones with the 'e' in you really need to watch out for. Cunneng gets.

 

[kesavaross]

[Sigh]
The old 5G thing again.
FFS!
Whatever about a relationship between heart issues and vaccines, to say 5G has even the slightest influence is akin to saying the faeries did.

The 5G thing. Conspiracy theorists as well as quite a number of scientist are of the opinion that 5G causes a cell in the body to become starved of oxygen in a similar way the covid virus does. I've never heard of 5G being linked to heart attacks though.

The link between the vaccines and heart attacks does seem to be getting stronger as time goes on.

 

[Trevp666]

To be fair, it's not all vaccines, not even all C19 vaccines, that are getting pointed at.
It's specifically the mRNA ones (so not the Johnson & Johnson one which uses traditional 'virus-based' production), and even then, only certain batches have been being suspected of also containing 'something else' which is leading to these adverse reactions, including affects on the heart such as pericarditis and myocarditis (I think I read somewhere about 'nanoparticles' or 'lipids' or similar - TBH I lost interest as I already felt I had enough information to not be getting jabbed anyway).
It isn't unsurprising that as a greater number of people are made aware of these adverse reactions that the increased visibility of the placement and usage of defibrillators generally is going to be more conspicuous. Despite the fact that they have been around for years.

On the link to 5G transmitters, IIRC I did read something somewhere which seemed to make a believable case for the wavelengths that they operate on to have some link to some health effect yadda yadda yadda.......My problem with stuff like that though, is that for to believe that 'The powers that be' have some sort of over-arching plan to damage the general public and population with some sort of technology designed to affect everyone, then you would have to also accept that 'they' are also happy for it to affect 'them' as well.

I'm not buying it.
I mean, I'm not 'all in' or 'all out' on any of these things really, but as things stand at the moment I reckon (A) some vaccines are causing some damage and it isn't being addressed adequately, and (B) 'defibs' are better to have and not need, than need and not have, whatever the reasons. The prevalence of (A) not being linked to the existence of (B) in any way really.

 

[maximus otter]

This one had passed my notice until I saw it on FB today.
As people see more and more public defibrillator machines outside schools, some prominent scenery munchers such as Laurence Fox and the 'popular music stars' Right Said Fred have used it as a sign of harm linking it with 5G/Covid jabs etc.

"A post on Instagram claims that a Public Access Defibrillator near a children’s playground in a park in Nottingham has been installed because of heart-related conditions occurring as a result of a combination the COVID-19 vaccine and 5G phone signals.
"The post contains a reposted video of a man pointing towards a yellow PAD stand, who claims that children have been “dropping like flies” of heart-attacks since the COVID-19 vaccine was introduced, alluding to a conspiracy to ‘cover up’ the effects of the vaccine. The caption suggests that 5G phone signal masts are also responsible." [Source: Logically.ai - https://www.logically.ai/factchecks/library/50f913e1]

Now, my own take is ... the more the merrier. Considering the prevalence of heart attacks in an adult population any location where adults may gather is good and as a well-known and publicised public space, a school is an ideal spot for an adult to find anything.
I've not dug into the statistics of heart attacks or arrhythmia (the latter of which a defib is most useful) in children but I'm fairly certain that they've not been situated there to treat the children - if a school wanted one then wouldn't they have them indoors?

Thoughts, anyone?

(Genuine pic, BTW)

On a more serious note, I wish that I could trace the item I saw in a reputable newspaper; it maintained that the upsurge in numbers of defibs was simply down to the NHS "gaming" its poor response time statistics.

maximus otter

 

[Min Bannister]

(Genuine pic, BTW)

Very sensible place for one. Lots of older people under stressful circumstances attending cremations.

 

[Trevp666]

Very sensible place for one

However, when you think about, a poor addition to the business.

 

[Min Bannister]

However, when you think about, a poor addition to the business.

Why?

 

[Trevp666]

I wouldn't have expected to have to explain it.
It's a crematorium. Their business is cremating the dead bodies of our loved ones (or at least, usually loved - I realise there won't be many tears when I cark it).
The defibrillator is keeping people alive, thus depriving them of business.

 

[Min Bannister]

I wouldn't have expected to have to explain it.
It's a crematorium. Their business is cremating the dead bodies of our loved ones (or at least, usually loved - I realise there won't be many tears when I cark it).
The defibrillator is keeping people alive, thus depriving them of business.

Oh I see.

 

[brownmane]

Considering that defibs are still not available in all sports venues (here at least), it's good to see that they are more widely available elsewhere. The latest incident with NFL brought to light that they need defibs available for the off chance that they are needed.

It seems to me that these people posting new ideas to conspiracise (thanks Trev) take anything that is used to help society at large and try to drag in ridiculous claims. Fear controls a lot of people.

As you mentioned @Trevp666, only the mRNA vaccines have been targeted, not, for example J&J vaccine. Let's introduce a new conspiracy theory and implicate that J&J are responsible for creating the stories concerning the crazy info about mRNA vaccines. Probably to boost their sales because, you know, big pharma.

 

[Stormkhan]

I wouldn't worry. A public access Defibrillator won't last five minutes without being vandalised.

Our town has a middle aged/elderly demographic along with tourists so such vandalism would be met 'with extreme prejudice'.

(Genuine pic, BTW)

On a more serious note, I wish that I could trace the item I saw in a reputable newspaper; it maintained that the upsurge in numbers of defibs was simply down to the NHS "gaming" its poor response time statistics.

maximus otter

Heh.
Our main street has one cited on a prominent corner.
It's pure coincidence it's outside a funeral directors.

 

[gordonrutter]

On a more serious note, I wish that I could trace the item I saw in a reputable newspaper; it maintained that the upsurge in numbers of defibs was simply down to the NHS "gaming" its poor response time statistics.

maximus ototter

Many of the public defibrillators here are installed by St John's along with sponsorship and charitable donations.

 

[Ghost In The Machine]

This one had passed my notice until I saw it on FB today.
As people see more and more public defibrillator machines outside schools, some prominent scenery munchers such as Laurence Fox and the 'popular music stars' Right Said Fred have used it as a sign of harm linking it with 5G/Covid jabs etc.

"A post on Instagram claims that a Public Access Defibrillator near a children’s playground in a park in Nottingham has been installed because of heart-related conditions occurring as a result of a combination the COVID-19 vaccine and 5G phone signals.
"The post contains a reposted video of a man pointing towards a yellow PAD stand, who claims that children have been “dropping like flies” of heart-attacks since the COVID-19 vaccine was introduced, alluding to a conspiracy to ‘cover up’ the effects of the vaccine. The caption suggests that 5G phone signal masts are also responsible." [Source: Logically.ai - https://www.logically.ai/factchecks/library/50f913e1]

Now, my own take is ... the more the merrier. Considering the prevalence of heart attacks in an adult population any location where adults may gather is good and as a well-known and publicised public space, a school is an ideal spot for an adult to find anything.
I've not dug into the statistics of heart attacks or arrhythmia (the latter of which a defib is most useful) in children but I'm fairly certain that they've not been situated there to treat the children - if a school wanted one then wouldn't they have them indoors?

Thoughts, anyone?

Or are they simply easier to install in spaces owned by local councils? Would be my first thought there.

If the past few years has taught us anything - it's scary how many people are out there who are no different to medieval peasants in terms of their gullibility, their eagerness to believe nonsense ("Because I do my own research me"). 5G, vaccines, now defibrillators causing all their woes... You can imagine if you wrote "There Be Dragons" on a map, they'd believe it.

There's one near here outside a local pub and I think it says on it the locals contributed to pay for it. It's been there several years, and before covid. But rural area here so maybe they were in these back of beyond (or "dragon infested areas"?) sooner, as I've thought nothing of seeing them pop up in various villages, the past several years. Also, maybe the technology to do this maybe just got cheaper as they've got more common..?

 

[Victory]

For me the weirdest thing about public defibrillators is how do they know that's where all the heart attacks are going to happen? Are they installed by time travellers? Or are people supposed to hang around nearby, just on the off chance?

There is a loose campaign to install then at all London Underground Stations.

That is not by chance.

There are:

A large amount of people who travel by the London Underground, 364 days per year.

The ability to have trained staff present to operate them

A prevalence of heart attacks/cardiac arrests during 8AM - 9.30AM, when people are stressed heading to work.

(Sadly a local campaign has yet to raise the money.
But locals seem to find the money for crack, alcopops, energy drinks, fireworks, adding spoilers to their cars etc.)

This song was written by Chas Smash about his father who had a heart attack.

 

[Zeke Newbold]

The public-use defibs have been getting installed all over the place for years and years.
"In the late 1970s the Heart-Aid was developed as the first truly automated external defibrillator that was designed for the public."
History of Defibs on wikipedia.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automated_external_defibrillator

IMO the increased incidence of people keeling over on sports pitches etc being linked (perhaps not so ridiculously) with C19 jabs (IIRC a recent figure of 1 in 800 as opposed to 1 in 2000 in records before 2019) is being hijacked to conspiracise* a link with "look at all these defibs popping up everywhere!"

* - new word invented.

if it IS true that a greater number of active people are keeling over from heart failure - then might there be a simpler, non- vaccine related explanation for it?

During the lockdown period, people were dissuaded, or indeed forbidden, from taking exercise. As I recall, the argument went that when people exert themselves they are more likely to perspire and breathe heavily and hence more likely to spread the virus. (I always considered this to be the most egregious edict of that time, but that's by the by).

I was in Moscow at the time and it wasn't much enforced there. I would go nordic walking in my area every evening. Howwever, I understand that in some parts of the UK, America and Europe people exercising outdoors were quite strongly monitored by the police.

So you had large numbers of active people suddenly living sedentary lifestyles. Then, when the lockdowns were partially or fully lifted, these same people would no doubt have - with some abandon - returned to their jogging/squash playing/iron pushing/whatever routines.

Now I recall from my own jogging and gym going days that the advice was, that if you had been laid low by an illness for a while (and hence had not been exercising) the best thing to do would be to let yourself back into it gently - to avoid too much strain on your heart.

Have some people's hearts been giving out under the stress of a suddent transition back to being active?

Anything here?

 

[James_H]

A common sight in Hong Kong, outside fire stations for some reason.

 

[Trevp666]

if you wrote "There Be Dragons" on a map, they'd believe it.

Wait...where? Dragons you say? I'm avoiding there wherever it is.

then might there be a simpler, non- vaccine related explanation for it?
During the lockdown period, people were dissuaded, or indeed forbidden, from taking exercise

Have some people's hearts been giving out under the stress of a sudden transition back to being active?

Meh...it's all speculation really. Studies that have been done (not very many, granted) appear to indicate that there really wasn't very much difference to peoples exercise regimes 'during lockdown', or at least not sufficiently enough to be a causative factor in the increased numbers of people reporting such health issues.
People that did regularly 'go to the gym' just found other ways of exercising. And people who previously never did any exercise, when it came to having an enforced 'stay indoors' imposed upon them, instead of existing in a sedentary way, would find any excuse to go out walking etc.
And people who have not been exercising for whatever reason (if they do normally do regular exercise) know that they need to 'warm up' etc and start off gently, not immediately (eg) enter a marathon.

And then you have to temper that thought with the levels of incidence of these reported health issues with places that didn't have lockdowns, but have had similar levels of vaccinations.
I don't have that information to hand, but I expect someone has done the research, and I'm sure I recall reading such.

 

[Floyd]

if it IS true that a greater number of active people are keeling over from heart failure - then might there be a simpler, non- vaccine related explanation for it?

During the lockdown period, people were dissuaded, or indeed forbidden, from taking exercise. As I recall, the argument went that when people exert themselves they are more likely to perspire and breathe heavily and hence more likely to spread the virus. (I always considered this to be the most egregious edict of that time, but that's by the by).

I was in Moscow at the time and it wasn't much enforced there. I would go nordic walking in my area every evening. Howwever, I understand that in some parts of the UK, America and Europe people exercising outdoors were quite strongly monitored by the police.

So you had large numbers of active people suddenly living sedentary lifestyles. Then, when the lockdowns were partially or fully lifted, these same people would no doubt have - with some abandon - returned to their jogging/squash playing/iron pushing/whatever routines.

Now I recall from my own jogging and gym going days that the advice was, that if you had been laid low by an illness for a while (and hence had not been exercising) the best thing to do would be to let yourself back into it gently - to avoid too much strain on your heart.

Have some people's hearts been giving out under the stress of a suddent transition back to being active?

Anything here?

I don't really know enough people to comment on this theory, but for me, if I don't get at least some exercise every day I feel terrible. I had to go out during the lockdown, but even if I didn't I would have done so anyway.

When I used to run, if I even had one day off it was more difficult the next time, so if just one day can do that to your body, think what a year would do.

I suppose that merely being depressed that you can't go out and do the things you like to do could be a contributing factor (along with actually not exercising?) Depression/anger etc causes many illnesses, stress etc.