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The Washington Sniper

MuscularSpasm said:
That means that there are TWO people with a mindset to kill random members of the PUBLIC.
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I disagree, look at the case we have here in the UK involving the young couple who are alleged to have killed two schoolgirls that they knew.

In both cases I suspect there is a woman controlled by a male nutter.

Time will tell.

Lutz
edit]
I disagree with the idea in the post not the one line I quoted
 
ninja: "the assumption that it is domestic".
That's my point. If you look CAREFULLY at the details,
it's unlikely to be this "white gun-collector-survivalist"
that a lot of people have BUILT UP in their own minds.


Lutzman, why do you suspect that this is a "woman controlled by a male nutter"?
Why does that child murder case have ANYTHING to do with this?
 
If it is the action of islamic terrorists, then the Tarot card was left by someone else...

Tarot- Big No-No
Claiming you're god- Even bigger no-no.
 
Assuming that there are two people involved in the killings, I was disagreeing with the idea that both of them are individually motivated killers. I don't think anyone planning such a deed would share the idea with anyone, unless they had them totally in their control. Thus one mad dominant killer and one subservient controlled assistant. Making assumptions that the killer is male, it is (IMHO) likely that the assistant would be a dominated female. Thus the comparison with the killings here where we have one male suspect (charged with killing) and one female suspect (charged with lying to police).

Thinking about it, have there been many cases where killers have been two men, rather than man and woman (Hindley, West)?

Lutz
 
Charles Ng and the other guy who I cannot remember. Not that it diminishes your argument at all as they were probably the exception to the rule.

edit

Leonard Lake was the other guy

/edit
 
The latest idea is that poor Milly Dowler was abducted and murdered by two men together.
 
i was reading yesterday that the authorities are using a new kind of technology in their hunt for the sniper. it's called "brain fingerprinting". what they do is take a suspect, hook them up to a CAT-scan type machine, show them a picture of the crime scene and watch for nervous system reactions. if the scene is in their memory, the brain will react a certain way.

how's that for a prelude to the future of crime fighting?
 
There were, of course, the killings in the school a year or so back when 3 male schoolkids worked together. So my idea may flawed.

On another point, when the AK74 aka the AKM(the suspected weapon, rather than the ever popular AK47) was first 'launched', the US (this was in the cold war days) complained because as it used a smaller bullet than the AK47, the bullets were redesigned.

The bullet the USSR decided on, (smaller cartridge, less powder) had an air pocket at it's nose, to save weight. However this made it a 'dum dum' (crumple on impact, causing more damage). Which was, I believe, illegal in the theater of war!

I don't know if the gun was changed or if it still can use (if available) the same original bullets but it could explain why the shooter is using an AK74 rather than a hunting rifle.

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong.

Lutz
 
The AK74 is sold on the U.S. commercial market in a semi-automatic version.They're in both the 5.45 mm Russian cartridge and a 5.56 mm(.223 Remington)chambering.
 
synthwerk said:
i was reading yesterday that the authorities are using a new kind of technology in their hunt for the sniper. it's called "brain fingerprinting". what they do is take a suspect, hook them up to a CAT-scan type machine, show them a picture of the crime scene and watch for nervous system reactions. if the scene is in their memory, the brain will react a certain way.

how's that for a prelude to the future of crime fighting?
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Do you have any more information on that. It makes sense doesn't it? - show a criminal a series of images, then insert one of a significant location (crime scene, face or whatever) and watch those brain waves take off.
 
it was in wednesday's USAToday. that was basically all it said about brain fingerprinting. there were several other pieces of new technology highlighted in the article with little descriptions under them. the only other one that got my attention of "sniper sound detection": listening systems that can detect the signature soundwaves and frequencies that a sniper-gauge rifle makes. i think their intent was to put them up around town to detect the next shooting.
 
4imix - "Tarot- Big No-No Claiming you're god- Even bigger no-no."
That's really, really true.

I don't want to just back up the point that it's terrorism, because that is a very good point.

I might say, though, that I heard that the 'holy war' thing allows them to drink alchohol & whatever.

I also thought as soon as I heard of the card that someone was just playing-up to all the talk of 'psychological profiling' & stuff.

Also, todays news that one of the witnesses faked his/her story makes us doubt some of the tenuous facts that have been presented up to now.

Synthwerk, your statement chills my -- i don't f*cking know what it chills - it f*cking CHILLS me. Some technology should be disallowed. Cloning, anything remotely like 'brain fingerprinting'. Sh*t, dude.

Dark Detective, don't you agree? Pshychologists already know too much about the human mind. It's already too cold & clinical.

I always think that it must have been pretty screwed up when the Stazi started peering into a lot of people's lives in East Germany. Picking one's nose became a statistical behavioural attribute. Bleuh!
 
That gunshot triangulation system has been around for YEARS. I saw it on Discovery around 1995.
That's why the effected counties have been asked to stop recreational shooting, and it's why there won't BE any more shootings. WHY they make these things public is beyond me.

Yeah, you saw the fingerprinting thing just this week Synthwerk?

Sometimes it does seem that the whole terrorism thing IS just being used to implement draconian measures.
 
i think serial killers leave huge emotional and psychological fingerprints on crime scenes because they attach themselves to it. the biggest f**king fingerprint in the world. why not use it?

i was intrigued by it's simplicity, but then i realised on a massive scale it's an invasion of our innermost selves. the first thing i thought of was Minority Report. i mean catching a killer with it is wonderful, but some government agency get's an idea to fingerprint us all and it's Big Brother time. just think, you pass through the sensors at any department store and they not only keep you from stealing, but they alert the police to the memory of a crime scene in your head.

here's a link to the people who developed the technique:

http://www.brainwavescience.com/

creepy...it's like that small techno-firm in any sci-fi movie that comes up with a small idea that turns on people...

EDIT: oh, another piece of technology the FBI is implementing is laser scope detectors.
 
MuscularSpasm said:
Dark Detective, don't you agree? Pshychologists already know too much about the human mind. It's already too cold & clinical.
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It depends on how the technology is used. I'd think that if the cops hauled in a suspect on a charge related to, for example, the abduction of Amanda Dowler, and had access to equipment which could screen those suspects, it would be a very useful tool indeed. I don't believe technology like this would be the sole proof of guilt or otherwise, but a piece of circumstantial evidence to back up the rest. A scenario where a tool like this would drag in someone off the street would be frightening, I agree.

Here's one for you conspiracy buffs - I was talking with a friend of mine here in the US of A, and I was told a bizarre fact which hopefully someone can corroborate.
I've posted elsewhere on one of the opposition arguments to gun control being "it's like fingerprinting the whole of the US". I pointed out I was fingerprinted when I got a driver's license, which I believe is standard practice(?). I was told tonight that all newborn babies in the US are fingerprinted, on the premise that "if a child is abducted or found dead he/she can be readily identified."

Someone tell me this is not true. I don't believe it.
 
well...you get fingerprinted several times in your life. when i little i remember the police coming to school using a thinly-veiled "Safety Demonstration Day" to fingerprint us all. i think i was about to ask the officer "...why are you really doing this?"

i think human beings have a certain "guilt detector" in them and we've yet to actually use it properly.
 
Synthwerk,

I'm amazed. I come from a country where I've never been fingerprinted, any attempt to bring in compulsory photo ID is slapped down, yet the US is a vehement defender of it's "civil rights". What gives?!
 
synthwerk said:
well...you get fingerprinted several times in your life.
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Gracious, my hospital birth certificate has my little footprints on it (and we're talking back to the early 50's here in the USA).
 
baby fingerprints are nothing to worry about. it's just identification. i had my toes and fingers printed, no biggie.
 
synthwerk said:
show them a picture of the crime scene and watch for nervous system reactions. if the scene is in their memory, the brain will react a certain way.
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What about all the many people who have seen the crime scenes on TV or were in the area at the time, surely they will react to the pics as well. Just hope that if they ever use such a method the really know what they are looking for.

Also, I presume as its never been tested in a court of law there will need to be large amounts of testing and other evedence to back up the case as it wont be admissable as valid evidence yet.
 
I was amazed, too, when I was in the US and found out that many people I knew were fingerprinted in the school system at grade 3.

Do a lot of governments do this?
 
synthwerk said:
i was reading yesterday that the authorities are using a new kind of technology in their hunt for the sniper. it's called "brain fingerprinting"....how's that for a prelude to the future of crime fighting?
Click to expand...
I really don't think this will be any more reliable than a polygraph test. I, for one, am one of those wusses referred to as "those of a nervous disposition". I react strongly to screen violence, even if I know its acting and special effects. So you can imagine what effect real violence has.
And there's the "small" matter of many serial killers being defective or extremely well controlled in the emotion department - either because they've had military training, or because they have the type of personality that feels no emotion and have merely learned appropriate emotional responses. In cases like these, I wouldn't have thought the brain waves would give anything away.
 
Fingerprinting for a driver's license is not universal practice in the U.S.Here in my home state of Indiana,for instance,it isn't practiced,as I suspect it isn't in most states.On my birth certificate,only my footprints were imprinted.The only reason the government has my fingerprints is because I served in the military.
 
I was going to bring up the childhood fingerprinting thing. I remember having my finger prints taken in Infants school so I must've been only 5 or 6. Did everyone else have their fingerprints taken?

Also late on at secondary school I was one of only a few people chosen for "Interview practice" I was taken into a private room and grilled by a man who asked some very odd questions - "If someone told you they were a Communist how would you react?" and "Would you describe yourself as diplomatic?"
What was all that about? Was he from the governemnt? MI5? (I'm not sure if this was before or after I was one of the founding members of the New Left Marxist Party in our mock elections) The only feedback I got from the "Interview practice" was that I needed to clean my finger nails... they weren't even dirty!
 
the fingerprint thing isn't really that big a deal. america has a lot of initiatives to protect it's children and fingerprinting is one of them. they're not trying to control us. that's laughable
 
synthwerk said:
they're not trying to control us. that's laughable
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I agree. The point is, Americans make a big song and dance about civil liberties and freedom, when it seems they have less of it than the rest of us. The argument about gun control being like "fingerprinting the US" seems redundant as it seems this has happened already.
 
Interesting that this thread has become
"single emotive events being used to change wide-ranging laws"

One of the best examples in the UK is Double Jeopardy.

What people used to realise in times past is that the current government WILL NOT ALWAYS BE the current government.

Laws were made to be timeless. To be an ideal, irrespective of WHO is in control.

Double Jeopardy laws were in place because some clever bod realised that from time-to-time scumbags persecute the innocent with the legal system.

So people can only be tried once for any one thing.

The right to No Double Jeopardy was removed from us in the same week as some white police officers were in the news for being involved in the death of a black man. Some of the newspapers commented on how it was good that these men could be tried again.

So now we've lost that, along with "the right to remain silent".

Single issues shouldn't change laws. Just like they shouldn't be used to implement new technologies that give Government greater powers.

It's not because we don't trust The Government. It's because we don't trust Governments, full stop.

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As this post is almost irrelevant to the subject already, I'd like to add:

A lot of people, especially in the U.S, have this image of a gun-toting anti-Government white man.

A lot of people could probably describe the sniper's ODOUR right now, from their own imagination!

Yes, these people exist, but I'm sure it exists MORE as a FEAR than it does in reality.

I also believe that this FEAR, and recriminations to that FEAR, like Waco, have CREATED many more people of that type than would EVER have existed otherwise.

It's a self-fulfilling prophecy.

"There are gun-toting anti-Government white men, let's get 'em!"
"They think we are gun-toting anti-Government white men, let's get 'em!"

You get the idea.

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