Yet Another Socorro Solution?

SkepticalX

Ephemeral Spectre
Joined
Nov 19, 2009
Messages
272
Reaction score
530
Points
109
Location
Midwest, USA
Apparently some of folks who lived in Socorro in 1964 are now speculating that Lonnie Zamora may have seen a prototype lunar module:

http://www.nmsr.org/socorro.htm

Actually, a prototype of the Lunar Excursion Module (LEM) fits Zamora's descriptions pretty well. The timeframe is certainly about right. Still, you'd think Zamora would have recognized his UFO when the moon landing occurred 5 years later (granted a prototype might not look much like the finished product). You would also think the manufacturers of the prototype would eventually have come forward and admitted one of their craft made an unscheduled stop (unless the flight was somehow unauthorized and illegal). Regardless, this possible explanation certainly makes more sense than the idea of an elaborate hoax pulled-off by engineering students from a nearby university.
 

Mythopoeika

I am a meat popsicle
Joined
Sep 18, 2001
Messages
44,291
Reaction score
36,519
Points
309
Location
Inside a starship, watching puny humans from afar
Prototype landers:

Lunar_Landing_Vehicle_-_GPN-2000-001889.jpg

30257095956_51cdfa4a2a_b.jpg

apollo-projects-prototype-of-the-lunar-landing-module-in-an-early-CWCE79.jpg
 

dr wu

Doctor Prog
Joined
Mar 12, 2002
Messages
2,373
Reaction score
1,853
Points
184
Location
Indiana
That's not a new idea....I recall reading that theory a long time ago.
And Zamora did say (if I recall correctly) the 'craft' flew away making noise and spouting smoke and flame.
Would a true advanced alien craft do such a thing...?
 

dr wu

Doctor Prog
Joined
Mar 12, 2002
Messages
2,373
Reaction score
1,853
Points
184
Location
Indiana
So...why didn't the NASA people or whoever come forward to clear up that incident?
 

SkepticalX

Ephemeral Spectre
Joined
Nov 19, 2009
Messages
272
Reaction score
530
Points
109
Location
Midwest, USA
That second image is particularly compelling. It is somewhat egg-shaped and those cone-shape appendages (when viewed head-on) might well explain the ensign he says he saw.

socorro drawing 1.jpg
 

SkepticalX

Ephemeral Spectre
Joined
Nov 19, 2009
Messages
272
Reaction score
530
Points
109
Location
Midwest, USA
So...why didn't the NASA people or whoever come forward to clear up that incident?
The only explanation I can think of is that there would be repercussions if it became known that they were testing a flying bomb in a populated area.
 

EnolaGaia

I knew the job was dangerous when I took it ...
Staff member
Joined
Jul 19, 2004
Messages
22,176
Reaction score
32,049
Points
309
Location
Out of Bounds
It's an interesting suggestion for an explanation, but I don't think it could have been either a Lunar Module (LM; LEM) or either version of the Lunar Landing training rigs (the 'flying bedstead'; illustrated in your 3rd photo).

Here's why ...

The Socorro / Zamora incident occurred in April 1964. As of that timeframe:

- The LEM contract had already been awarded to Northrop Grumman, so there was no need for any competitors to be testing anything to do with a LEM.

- No functional LEM existed, even in prototype form. There were static mockups, however.

- There wouldn't be any free (untethered) testing of a LEM's propulsion systems until 1968, and then only in earth orbit.

- The LEM was never designed to remain whole when taking off from the moon's surface. Its ascent engine lifted it from its descent (lowermost) section when blasting off. Phrased another way - if the mystery craft took its legs with it, it wasn't a LEM.

- The VTOL trainers weren't delivered and test-flown until later in 1964 (first flight October 1964).

- The VTOL trainers only had one person aboard.

- The training rigs were tested and test-flown exclusively at Dryden Flight Research Center (Edwards AFB, California).
 

EnolaGaia

I knew the job was dangerous when I took it ...
Staff member
Joined
Jul 19, 2004
Messages
22,176
Reaction score
32,049
Points
309
Location
Out of Bounds
Could Zamora have seen some other type of VTOL prototype craft? Maybe ...

Bell Aerosystems (of Bell helicopter fame) was the contractor who built the lunar landing trainers. They'd also dabbled in other VTOL platforms for years, which is why they were the obvious choice for building the trainers.

White Sands Testing Range's extreme northwestern corner is less than 20 miles from Socorro.

I suppose there's an outside chance Zamora saw some sort of VTOL prototype that had wandered some miles from the testing range - e.g., something related to a non-NASA VTOL project. However, it would be unusual for any craft to wander off a controlled range like White Sands.

Bottom Line: It wasn't a LEM or one of the lunar landing trainers, but it might have been some other VTOL test rig, most likely associated with Bell and / or White Sands.
 

Mythopoeika

I am a meat popsicle
Joined
Sep 18, 2001
Messages
44,291
Reaction score
36,519
Points
309
Location
Inside a starship, watching puny humans from afar
The only explanation I can think of is that there would be repercussions if it became known that they were testing a flying bomb in a populated area.
Where it landed is not a populated area.
 

SkepticalX

Ephemeral Spectre
Joined
Nov 19, 2009
Messages
272
Reaction score
530
Points
109
Location
Midwest, USA
...The Socorro / Zamora incident occurred in April 1964. As of that timeframe:

- The LEM contract had already been awarded to Northrop Grumman, so there was no need for any competitors to be testing anything to do with a LEM.

- No functional LEM existed, even in prototype form. There were static mockups, however...

I would add to this list the qualifier "that we know of." There's no telling what off-book projects may have been occurring 50+ years ago. Still, a craft capable of doing what Zamora described in Earth gravity would have been a considerable achievement. Even if it didn't get picked for the Apollo program, you'd think the developers would have done something with it.
 

EnolaGaia

I knew the job was dangerous when I took it ...
Staff member
Joined
Jul 19, 2004
Messages
22,176
Reaction score
32,049
Points
309
Location
Out of Bounds
I would add to this list the qualifier "that we know of." There's no telling what off-book projects may have been occurring 50+ years ago. Still, a craft capable of doing what Zamora described in Earth gravity would have been a considerable achievement. Even if it didn't get picked for the Apollo program, you'd think the developers would have done something with it.

My point was that this couldn't have been anything related to NASA's Apollo program, which was as 'open book' as any major governmental project during my lifetime.

It could very well have been a DOD or DARPA project, or even a surreptitious test of something the Soviets were working on in their own military VTOL R&D.

I'd also point out that 1964 was the timeframe during which the early proto-Harriers began flight testing with US and German involvement. I'd credit Zamora with the ability to recognize a terrestrial jet, but there's always the possibility someone was playing with a propulsion-only test platform of some sort.

It could also represent (e.g.) one of the big aerospace companies testing something they carried over from a failed attempt at the LEM contract - something they thought had promise in another context.

I totally agree that the operational behavior Zamora described for the craft exceeded anything anyone had demonstrated for jet- or rocket-powered VTOL capabilities at that time.
 

Mythopoeika

I am a meat popsicle
Joined
Sep 18, 2001
Messages
44,291
Reaction score
36,519
Points
309
Location
Inside a starship, watching puny humans from afar
I'd credit Zamora with the ability to recognize a terrestrial jet, but there's always the possibility someone was playing with a propulsion-only test platform of some sort.

It could also represent (e.g.) one of the big aerospace companies testing something they carried over from a failed attempt at the LEM contract - something they thought had promise in another context.

I totally agree that the operational behavior Zamora described for the craft exceeded anything anyone had demonstrated for jet- or rocket-powered VTOL capabilities at that time.
I think you're right, because a full LEM or prototype would be too heavy and fragile to use for training or test by simply flying it about on Earth. The LEM design relied on low or no gravity for its secondary stage to take off from the Moon. With the extra weight of the upper stage, trying to fly the LEM on Earth would use up the fuel pretty quickly and it wouldn't fly that far (probably not flying off the base and then back again).
Socorro and White Sands are 118 miles apart - I dunno - could it fly there and back on the small fuel tanks it had?
 

EnolaGaia

I knew the job was dangerous when I took it ...
Staff member
Joined
Jul 19, 2004
Messages
22,176
Reaction score
32,049
Points
309
Location
Out of Bounds
... Socorro and White Sands are 118 miles apart - I dunno - could it fly there and back on the small fuel tanks it had?

That's the distance between the _town_ of White Sands and Socorro. The White Sands Testing Range is north of the town and extends northward toward Socorro. The extreme northwestern corner of the testing range is only 15 - 20 miles from Socorro.

No - there's no way anything sized like a LEM with LEM-sized fuel tanks could sustain VTOL flight for very long (distance or time).

For example, the longest endurance individual 'jet pack' or 'rocket belt' is only good for a maximum of 33 seconds.

The claim that the Socorro craft zoomed away briskly once airborne indicates a capability for lateral / horizontal thrust no LEM had. This is one of the reasons I mentioned the timeframe correlation with the earliest Harrier prototypes. A ducted vent / jet / fan vehicle would be capable of the swiftly accelerating lateral movement Zamora described.
 

Mythopoeika

I am a meat popsicle
Joined
Sep 18, 2001
Messages
44,291
Reaction score
36,519
Points
309
Location
Inside a starship, watching puny humans from afar

EnolaGaia

I knew the job was dangerous when I took it ...
Staff member
Joined
Jul 19, 2004
Messages
22,176
Reaction score
32,049
Points
309
Location
Out of Bounds

SkepticalX

Ephemeral Spectre
Joined
Nov 19, 2009
Messages
272
Reaction score
530
Points
109
Location
Midwest, USA
I believe that Ted Phillips did compression tests on the "landing pad" marks and determined that about 9 tons of pressure would have been required to make the indentations. Seems to me, that much weight would take a considerable amount of thrust to raise vertically. You'd think there would have been significantly more damage/evidence beyond a slightly singed bush.
 

Analis

Gone But Not Forgotten
(ACCOUNT RETIRED)
Joined
Apr 12, 2006
Messages
1,624
Reaction score
356
Points
99
I agree that a LEM could never be a valid explanation for the Socorro sighting, except if we were to rewrite history. While the NASA space program being far from as open public as sometimes claimed to be, and probably retaining secret parts, the object seen by Zamora was so removed from anything that a LEM, secret or not, could perform, that the LEM hypothesis would suppose that whole sections of the program remain completely unknown to the public.

Now, another explanation, as implausible and inadequate as all the other ones put forward before : it was a barrel launching, part of an experiment by either staff or students at the New Mexico Institute of Mining and Technology. Another tall tale that will keep company to student jokers :

http://kevinrandle.blogspot.com/2018/10/ithas-taken-awhile-but-i-have-now-been.html
 

Zeke Newbold

Carbon based biped.
Joined
Apr 18, 2015
Messages
1,010
Reaction score
2,121
Points
159
Everyone seems to be overlooking the fact that this sighting also involved two humanoid occupants - of smaller stature than a `normal` human beings.

We can choose to discount this inconvenient aspect of the case - say that it was an embelleshment maybe, or Zamora's shocked mind adding further details - except for the fact that these types of sightings ( viz diminutive beings who scarper when noticed) are very, very typical of that period of UFO history.

If it weren't for the occupants, I'd go with the Lunar landing testing hypothesis (in some form). As it is, it's a very troubling case - not least because of the fact tht the `blue flame` that the craft is said to have produced is highly untypical of almost all other CE2/CE3 encounters, and does indeed suggest something terrestrial.
 

1963

Fresh Blood
Joined
Aug 11, 2017
Messages
6
Reaction score
16
Points
4
That's not a new idea....I recall reading that theory a long time ago.
And Zamora did say (if I recall correctly) the 'craft' flew away making noise and spouting smoke and flame.
Would a true advanced alien craft do such a thing...?

Yes there is nothing new about this theory, it was mooted several times before , checked out and summarily dismissed by all the concerned authorities.
And what is your thoughts of 'the limit of barbaric looking craft' when considering a hasty unplanned get away being made by a pair of surprised covert-intentioned-aliens in a faulty craft Wu?
 

dr wu

Doctor Prog
Joined
Mar 12, 2002
Messages
2,373
Reaction score
1,853
Points
184
Location
Indiana
Yes there is nothing new about this theory, it was mooted several times before , checked out and summarily dismissed by all the concerned authorities.
And what is your thoughts of 'the limit of barbaric looking craft' when considering a hasty unplanned get away being made by a pair of surprised covert-intentioned-aliens in a faulty craft Wu?
That's a decent question......but unless we assume the 'aliens' were only at that level of technology then their craft wouldn't have rocket type tech to begin with. Are we to assume that advanced aliens are still at rocket type thrust for their craft? If that's the case we would be seeing them everywhere on earth at that time since they couldn't hide that type of exhaust easily whenever they took off.
I simply don't buy that explanation so to me it was either an unknown human project of some kind or...and here it gets weird....some kind of unknown 'alien entity' pretending to have rocket ships to once again mimic our emerging technology of that period.
 

Comfortably Numb

Antediluvian
Joined
Aug 7, 2018
Messages
7,599
Reaction score
12,121
Points
279
Location
Phone
What Zamora encountered was almost certainly a hot-air ballooon.

The hot-air balloon was only a recent innovation and attracted attention of the CIA for agent insertion/purposes.

There was top-secret testing taking place nearby in what was known as 'The Albuquerque Project'.

I had a feature article published on this discovery in the 'Albuquerque Journal' some years ago.
 

dr wu

Doctor Prog
Joined
Mar 12, 2002
Messages
2,373
Reaction score
1,853
Points
184
Location
Indiana
^That's a reasonable solution...so then we are to assume that the size of the 'balloonists' was miscalculated by Zamora..?
 

Comfortably Numb

Antediluvian
Joined
Aug 7, 2018
Messages
7,599
Reaction score
12,121
Points
279
Location
Phone
^That's a reasonable solution...so then we are to assume that the size of the 'balloonists' was miscalculated by Zamora..?
IIRC, Zamora lost his glasses and never actually observed bottom of the object as it was hidden from view due to some bushes.

In essence, a slowly ascending, white spherical object with a roaring, visible flame, which drifted off into the distance, piloted by one or more figures in what resembled white 'jump suits'....

The test flights were taking off from the banks of the Rio Grande.

There were also additionally reported sightings of a comparative, unidentified, aerial object around the same time.
 

EnolaGaia

I knew the job was dangerous when I took it ...
Staff member
Joined
Jul 19, 2004
Messages
22,176
Reaction score
32,049
Points
309
Location
Out of Bounds
^That's a reasonable solution...so then we are to assume that the size of the 'balloonists' was miscalculated by Zamora..?

One must bear in mind that Zamora only saw the figures once - while still at a distance and trying to get his police car up a slope (which took 3 tries) on his way to investigate the mystery object.

He caught a glimpse of these figures long before he reached the point of his closest approach, parked his car, and started to walk toward the mystery object.

He made no mention of seeing the figures at this closer distance once he'd parked the car. He also never mentioned seeing the figures leave or enter the mystery object.

Many of the endlessly recycled accounts state or insinuate Zamora saw the figures multiple times, from multiple distances, and entering / leaving the object. None of these points appear in his testimony at the time.
 

Comfortably Numb

Antediluvian
Joined
Aug 7, 2018
Messages
7,599
Reaction score
12,121
Points
279
Location
Phone
Many of the endlessly recycled accounts state or insinuate Zamora saw the figures multiple times, from multiple distances, and entering / leaving the object. None of these points appear in his testimony at the time.
For sure.

How often do we find that the *original* documented 'UFO' testimonies are pivotal... Arnold and Rendlesham especially also intrinsically thus..
 

dr wu

Doctor Prog
Joined
Mar 12, 2002
Messages
2,373
Reaction score
1,853
Points
184
Location
Indiana
Even if it was a hot air balloon test....one wonders why the participants never came forward later to say so when the event was probably well known in the area at the time.
 

Comfortably Numb

Antediluvian
Joined
Aug 7, 2018
Messages
7,599
Reaction score
12,121
Points
279
Location
Phone
What Zamora encountered was almost certainly a hot-air ballooon.

The hot-air balloon was only a recent innovation and attracted attention of the CIA for agent insertion/purposes.

There was top-secret testing taking place nearby in what was known as 'The Albuquerque Project'.

I had a feature article published on this discovery in the 'Albuquerque Journal' some years ago.
It was actually the, 'El Defensor Chieftain' and just rediscovered on a backup CD!

'UFO' Case Opens Window on Secret CIA Balloon Flights

Around 5:45 p.m. on 24 April, 1964, Socorro police
officer, Lonnie Zamora, was pursuing a speeding car on
Old Rodeo Street.

Suddenly, Zamora "heard a roar and saw a flame in the sky
to southwest some distance away". As there was a dynamite
shack nearby, Zamora was concerned it might have
exploded, aborted the chase and set off to investigate.

Zamora travelled slowly westward, on the gravel road
which ran alongside an arroyo.

He noticed a "shiny type object" about 150 to 200 yards
distant in the arroyo and at first glance, believed it
was an overturned car, especially as there were "two
people in white coveralls" close by.

When Zamora neared the scene, he stopped his car and
began "to go down to where I knew the object was".

He had no sooner left his car when a flame was emitted
from beneath the object, accompanied by a deafening roar.
Fearing an explosion, Zamora turned and ran for cover.

Now safely behind a hill, he watched as the object slowly
rose upwards and then, with its rocket-like flame and
roar both deactivated, silently ascend in a slanting
trajectory towards the southwest and Box Canyon.

When Zamora returned to the arroyo, he was greeted with
still smouldering brush.

What on Earth, or perhaps otherwise, had he encountered.


It was such an enigma that in the 1966 CIA publication,
'Studies in Intelligence', Major Hector Quintanilla, Jr.,
former head of the US Air Force's 'Project Bluebook', UFO
investigations team, wrote:

"This is the best-documented case on record, and still we
have been unable, in spite of thorough investigation, to
find the vehicle or other stimulus that scared Zamora to
the point of panic".


New research may, however, have solved the mystery,
involving CIA operations which remain classified to this
day.

The most significant clue comes from Zamora himself, as
revealed by Ray Stanford in his 1976 book, 'Socorro
Saucer'. Stanford writes, "Zamora reported that as the
craft rose vertically and then moved away, he observed an
estimated four-foot-long elliptical opening on the bottom
of the object, out of which the flame issued".

He further explains [the asterisks denotes Stanford's
emphasis], "Zamora felt a distinct heat on his body
coming from the craft's exhaust, but *there was not
nearly so much heat as there should have been if this
were a rocket's exhaust of equal size and brilliance*.

The sound made up for it, however, Zamora thought later.

Something else, though, made the 'flame', streaming
downward only fifteen paces from Zamora, seem unusual.

He told me, 'That roaring flame. It looked like it
should'a bounced [deflected] off the ground, *but it
didn't*.

In fact, *it was more like some fiery Excalibur, actually
penetrating into the rocks and the earth*, instead of
deflecting off to the side as a gaseous rocket exhaust
would have done'."

Stanford adds, "I was puzzled about this as I stood at
the landing site that afternoon...".

"Further, after the roaring engine was cut off, the craft
accelerated away in complete silence".

"One may wonder why two different propulsive modes were
evidently utilized by the Socorro craft".

One may indeed.

What type of flame, accompanied by a tumultuous roar, is
emitted by a landed object which then _slowly_ rises
upwards, yet the flame doesn't evidence any thrust off
the ground, instead seeming as though it must be going
straight through the soil.

Answer; a thrust that isn't being blasted downwards at
all, it only gives that expected appearance. The flame is
actually being directed upwards, that's why the object
above has a large opening at the bottom, it's the reason
why the object is able to lift off slowly and
subsequently no longer need the burner to provide
'power'.

The Socorro 'flying saucer', was evidently a hot-air
balloon.


For such a classic sighting, when we analyse the data,
Zamora hardly had time to observe anything at all.

In a detailed report to authorities, Zamora explained
that as the roaring flame descended, "Did not notice any
object at top, did not note if top of flame was level.
Sun was to west and did not help vision. Had green sun
glasses over prescription glasses. Could not see bottom
of flame because it was behind the hill. No smoke noted.
Noted some 'commotion' at bottom--dust?".

His initial glimpse of the object and occupants was,
"when I had stopped, for possibly two seconds or so, to
glance at the object". He adds, "At the time, I didn't
pay much attention to what it was".

Zamora confirms that at closest proximity, "As soon as
saw flame and heard roar, turned away, ran away from
object but did turn head toward object".

How many steps did Zamora take from his car, before
fleeing from the object which he thought was about to
blow up.

Incredibly, only three.

Although not mentioned in his statement, it's confirmed
by Zamora in an interview with Stanford: "I turned [from
the car] and headed for the object, stepping pretty fast.
Had gone maybe three paces toward object when I heard a
sudden, very loud, ear-splitting roar".

Therefore, the entire duration of Zamora's clearest view
was three steps forward and one glance backwards.

Zamora further confirmed how greasewood bushes had
obscured the object's underside.

Compounding matters was that as Zamora fled, "Bumped leg
on car--back Fender area... Glasses fell to ground, left
them there".


Although gas-filled balloons were around since the 18th
century, the first modern hot-air balloon flight had
taken place on October 10, 1960, when renowned New Mexico
balloonist, Ed Yost, took to the air in Bruning,
Nebraska, piloting a prototype hot-air balloon
manufactured by Raven Industries.

Even by April 1964, there were only some 20 hot-air
balloons in the United States.

I wrote to Aerostar (who had since taken over Raven
Industries) and Jim Winker replied:

"Your e-mail to Aerostar was referred to me. I am retired
from Raven Ind. now, but I was there for most of their
first 35 years".

"This was about the time that Raven's hot air balloon
work received its first significant worldwide publicity,
and was a result of a first-ever crossing of the English
Channel by a hot air balloon in April 1963".

"I had heard the name Zamora before, but I never knew
what incident he was associated with, nor the details of
his sighting, such as where it happened. You have
clarified that and it allows me a new line of thought".

"I have long been aware of some hot air balloon flights
in New Mexico in the early to mid-1960s for research
purposes. These have always been referred to as the
'Albuquerque flights', but Socorro is not all that far
from ABQ and there may be a connection. I saw a film of
those flights about 10 years ago and at least some of
them were with an all-white balloon, having a platform
for the crew".

"At the time of that viewing, I made some notes that I
still have. The balloons of that description were built
between Dec 1962 and Feb 1963. I was not able to pinpoint
the flight dates, but speculated then that they were
probably late 1963 or into 1964. This is beginning to
sound very significant".

Perhaps more so than first realised; Zamora's sighting
was only one of many which took place in New Mexico
during that period, as 'UFO' researcher Coral Lorenzen
described, "Other tales of objects similar in appearance,
which 'buzzed' cars and homes in the general area from
Las Cruces north to Albuquerque along the Rio Grande
river, seem to support the evidence that strange objects
were flying and landing there".

Ed Yost was contacted and confirmed those contemporary
flights were launched from a site on the banks of the Rio
Grande, north of Albuquerque.

However, according to Yost's recollections, none of the
flights landed near Socorro.


On 1 July, 2003, the CIA replied to my Freedom Of
Information Act request for records pertaining to,
"Central Intelligence Agency operations involving hot-air
balloon flights during the years 1960-1964 inclusive":

"The CIA can neither confirm nor deny the nonexistence of
records responsive to your request".

It was duly clarified:

"I simply wish to establish whether one of those
'Albuquerque flights' was responsible for Zamora's close
encounter and ideally, if other flights tie-in with the
Rio Grande 'UFO' sightings".

"Bottom line; is there any documentary evidence which
either confirms or disproves that on 24 April, 1964, the
apparent hot-air balloon which landed near Socorro was
related to CIA test-flight/training, etc. operations?"

The CIA remain resolute:

"Please be advised that our 1 July, 2003 response to you
also applies to this subject and timeframe".


How though to rationalise the burning brush, Zamora's
depiction of both figures as possibly slightly smaller
than adults or the landing site indentations?

There was one curious aspect of the significantly
persuasive trace evidence - it was inconsistent with a
rocket thruster. Instead of burning radiating from a
central point, it was a 'finger of fire'.

Stanford writes of State Patrolman Jordan, "Jordan said
that what most impressed him at the landing site was the
way the 'flame' had evidently 'sliced' a large greasewood
bush, located almost centrally in the landing gear
quadrangle, without leaving any signs of strong
turbulence, as the exhaust of a powerful rocket thrust
unit or even the whirling of helicopter blades would have
done".

"'The flame from that damn thing just sliced that
greasewood bush in half, just burned it off clean like a
blade of fire had cut right through it'."

Could a hot-air balloon's burner produce such a
flamethrower effect; New Mexico author Karl Pflock
recalled a local incident, "A while back, a hot-air
balloon landed near my home. While trying to get airborne
again with the help of myself, a couple of my neighbors
and their chase gang, the two balloonists' gondola basket
tipped over just as they fired their burners. Result:
minor brush fire".

Circa April 1964, hot-air balloon platforms were
primitive, sometimes merely a wooden board.

The official case investigator was Dr J. Allen Hynek,
former Chairman of the Astronomy Department at
Northwestern University and who became a consultant for
the US Air Force's 'Project Blue Book'.

In a private memo dated 20 May, 1964, Hynek wrote that,
contrary to the landing marks being 'impressions', they
were in fact, "4 rectangular scrapings as if a
rectangular object had scraped along digging into the
ground...".


Capt. Richard T. Holder from White Sands also visited the
site and commented, "When an object blasts off by rocket
or jet propulsion, there's usually damage or debris in
the area. But there was no indication of that type of
disturbance".

Although Zamora's report states, "possibly they were
small adults or large kids" and this has been construed
by some as 'small creatures', it's lesser known that
Capt. Holder - one of the first to investigate - noted
that apparent footprints were, "about the size of a
footprint a bigfooted teenager would make".

Small creatures with big feet... presuming we can safely
discount Hobbits, there's no riddle here.


It's a premise which can now be applied to this entire,
extraordinary, story.

It wasn't Zamora who popularised the tale as a celebrated
UFO incident and somewhat ignored in Zamora's statement
was his following description:

"I ran back to my car and as I ran back, I kept an eye on
the object. I picked up my glasses (I left the sun
glasses on ground), got into the car, and radioed to Nep
Lopez, radio operator, to 'look out of the window, to see
if you could see an object'. He asked what is it? I
answered 'It looks like a balloon'."


As Jim Winker and legendary hot-air balloonist Don
Piccard, respectively, concur:

"I can't do much but agree that all evidence points to a
hot air balloon".

"I would take the position that your surmises are correct
and that the case is closed. Any further investigation
could be considered tilting at windmills".
[END]


(c) James Easton, November, 2003
 

charliebrown

Abominable Snowman
Joined
Nov 2, 2020
Messages
704
Reaction score
885
Points
93
Location
Earth
People like Lonnie Zamora, Dr. Jesse Marcel, Jr., and Antonio Villas Boas never changed their stories until day they died.

These kind of people persevered through all the criticism and stuck to their stories.

This is the unwavering spirit of someone who had a true UFO experience and don’t care what other people think.
 

Comfortably Numb

Antediluvian
Joined
Aug 7, 2018
Messages
7,599
Reaction score
12,121
Points
279
Location
Phone
People like Lonnie Zamora...
This is the unwavering spirit of someone who had a true UFO experience and don’t care what other people think.
For sure, it's just not that a, 'UFO experience' is sure certainly of an alien encounter.

Any actual, factual, evidence which confronts that which is comprehensively confirmed above?
 
Top