Aether Science

[Ghostisfort]

Whoever designed this board was certainly not thinking Fortean. Because of the lack of a category I will have to put this on New Science.

Aether science is about the theory that preceded relativity and I doubt that posters on New Science have ever done any serious research on the subject. So prepare for some New Information.

It may surprise some to learn that all of our electrical technology derives from the assumption of a proven aether theory. It may also come as a shock when the realisation dawns that no technology has ever been derived from uncle Albert's theories.

At the time when aether theory was dominant, the proof of a theory came in the form of a working technology, something that was the rule before Albert's theories, when technological proof was replaced with elegant mathematics that no one understands.

It was Nicola Tesla, a strong supporter of aether theory, who started the electronic revolution with his invention of the alternator, without which we would still be struggling with the Edison type, DC power transmissions. A 1943 court also decided in Tesla's favour giving him the patent rights to the invention of radio. It was around these discoveries and several others that electronics became what it is today.

The only important technologies that can be said to have arisen after this time are transistors and computers. The transistor however, uses the same circuitry as the old vacuum tubes and works in an almost identical manner. The basic ideas for computers were already in place, only waiting for the application of a more modern technology.

Around the 1930's aether was killed off by Einstein and with it went the golden age of invention.
The answer to the power crisis (on a nearby thread) was solved by Tesla, but because aether no longer existed, it became impossible to use his ideas.
This is the reason our electricity bills are so expensive and to a large extent why there is so much third world poverty...the energy dictatorship.

Other aether energy pioneers were hounded into extinction at the time, the most well known being John Keely who dared to defy the dogma of the science community by suggesting that energy can be derived from cavitation.

The point of all of this being, that science has spent more than a hundred years, hard at work, making our electrical power expensive.

 

[Mythopoeika]

It may also come as a shock when the realisation dawns that no technology has ever been derived from uncle Albert's theories.

Nuclear bomb?

 

[rynner2]

Would you care to define your 'aether', or list its measurable properties?

And if it could be used as a cheap power source, I'm sure the world would love to know how!

The modern version of this dream is extracting zero point energy from the quantum foam that fills 'empty' space; every now and then somebody claims to have cracked it, but then they seem to disappear back into the woodwork again...

Maybe Nature has a ban on such freebies, or perhaps we just haven't found the right techniques yet. But with the number of people working in associated fields, if it is possible we might yet hit on the way to do it. Any practical suggestions would be welcome to an energy-hungry world.

 

[CarlosTheDJ]

As an off-topic aside..... I'm currently recording a track by Aetherius!

It is streaming from a Technics 1200 turntable straight into the line-in of this very laptop.

This Aetherius tune would be easier to record if it came through the ether though. Less cables.

 

[OneWingedBird]

You need an aethernet for that.

 

[Ghostisfort]

It may also come as a shock when the realisation dawns that no technology has ever been derived from uncle Albert's theories.

Nuclear bomb?

For some reason I can't explain, I'm always surprised when rationalists show their amazing lack of historical knowledge. It's as if history spoils a good story.

Nazi Germany had banned all Jewish science during WWII and yet we are told that they were well on the way to building a bomb?
With a wave of the hand, it is assumed that the bomb is thanks to Albert.

Poincare and several other were aware of E=MC2 well before Einstein's publication, the basis of the bomb according to current science.

Poincare' sketched a preliminary version of the special theory of relativity and stated that the velocity of light is a limit velocity and that mass depends on speed. He formulated the principle of relativity"
http://www.utm.edu/research/iep/p/poincare.htm

 

[Ghostisfort]

Would you care to define your 'aether', or list its measurable properties?

And if it could be used as a cheap power source, I'm sure the world would love to know how!

The modern version of this dream is extracting zero point energy from the quantum foam that fills 'empty' space; every now and then somebody claims to have cracked it, but then they seem to disappear back into the woodwork again...

Maybe Nature has a ban on such freebies, or perhaps we just haven't found the right techniques yet. But with the number of people working in associated fields, if it is possible we might yet hit on the way to do it. Any practical suggestions would be welcome to an energy-hungry world.

Aether is the medium from which the electromagnetic, gravitational and other forces proceed. It is also the medium in which, as was pointed out long ago, the waves of light wave.

As written above, aether was proven by the successful use of its theory up until the 1930's, being the basis of all electronic discovery including all of today's technology.

Zero point energy and quantum foam are terms applied by today's physicists, who are unable to function without some kind of back-door aether.

Aether power generation is freely available to all who have eyes to see.
I'm sure I've posted links in past posts? It is not "Free Energy" but energy conversion...like knocking a water pipe through a dam.

There is a very good reason why ideas "disappear into the woodwork". Any power generation device needs a means of production. Anyone approaching a company finds that the board will first ask the "experts" before investing. The experts are the very people who claim, as you do that such things don't exist or, best of all, have no theory. This usually manages to strangle an idea at birth. There are several well known examples and the most publicised is cold fusion.

A good start would be an unbiased study of cavitation.

 

[Ghostisfort]

As an off-topic aside..... I'm currently recording a track by Aetherius!

It is streaming from a Technics 1200 turntable straight into the line-in of this very laptop.

This Aetherius tune would be easier to record if it came through the ether though. Less cables.

Spooky action at a distance.

According to Albert Einstein's theory of special relativity, instantaneous action-at-a-distance was seen to violate the relativistic upper limit on speed of propagation of information. If one of the interacting objects were to suddenly be displaced from its position, the other object would feel its influence instantaneously, meaning information had been transmitted faster than the speed of light. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Action_at_ ... 9#Einstein

 

[rynner2]

As written above, aether was proven by the successful use of its theory up until the 1930's, being the basis of all electronic discovery including all of today's technology.

That's a very woolly statement. Can you give specific examples of things the aether theory predicted, and which were then exploited by technology?

And how did the aether theory predictions differ from other theories which saw no need for an aether? Because if there is no difference, you can't claim the "aether was proven".

Is there a killer proof? I don't think so!

 

[kamalktk]

No one talks about aether theory because it was famously proven wrong in 1887. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michelson-Morley_experiment. Note that this experiment was designed with the purpose of proving aether was real.

That wasn't the first time no evidence for aether could be found either. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luminiferous_aether#Second_order_experiments There was a long line of experiments to confirm it that failed.

By the 1930's there had been 50 years worth of failed experiments and predictive failures.

 

[Mythopoeika]

It may also come as a shock when the realisation dawns that no technology has ever been derived from uncle Albert's theories.

Nuclear bomb?

For some reason I can't explain, I'm always surprised when rationalists show their amazing lack of historical knowledge. It's as if history spoils a good story.

Nazi Germany had banned all Jewish science during WWII and yet we are told that they were well on the way to building a bomb?
With a wave of the hand, it is assumed that the bomb is thanks to Albert.

Poincare and several other were aware of E=MC2 well before Einstein's publication, the basis of the bomb according to current science.

Poincare' sketched a preliminary version of the special theory of relativity and stated that the velocity of light is a limit velocity and that mass depends on speed. He formulated the principle of relativity"
http://www.utm.edu/research/iep/p/poincare.htm

I didn't say that Einstein was directly involved in the atomic bomb. In fact, his involvement was more as a consultant. The scientists who worked on the bomb consulted him to determine its theoretical viability, and he signed off the project for the US government.

 

[Ghostisfort]

The killer proof is in the technology. The Golden Age of Discovery ended when Einstein's theories became dominant. You don't need to be a detective to figure that one out?

Tesla described the aether throughout his writing. He said it had the properties of a very dense fluid...

Stationary Luminiferous (Classical) Aether
Conversely, the notion of a static Aether, a mechanical, jelly-like Aether, finds its classical origins in Newton. In 19th century physics, the positing of a luminiferous aether was used to reconcile Maxwell's electromagnetic theory and Newtonian mechanics. This inaugurated the brief age of the Classical Aether embraced by Young, Maxwell, Kelvin, Lodge, Lorentz, etc.

"Ether or aether, a material substance of a more subtle kind than visible bodies, supposed to exist in those parts of space which are apparently empty" - so began the article on the "Ether" written by J.C. Maxwell for Encyclopedia Britannica, and O. Lodge's book against Relativity, entitled "The Ether of Space". http://www.encyclopedianomadica.org/English/aether.php

Maxwell's original quaternion's included aether as part of his equations. These were edited out for use in electrical academia...teaching scientists and electrical engineers to ignore it.

Over time, the existence of such a medium, permeating all space and yet apparently undetectable by mechanical means, proved more and more difficult to reconcile with experiments such as the Michelson–Morley experiment. Moreover, it seemed to require an absolute frame of reference in which the equations were valid, with the distasteful result that the equations changed form for a moving observer. These difficulties inspired Albert Einstein to formulate the theory of special relativity, and in the process Einstein dispensed with the requirement of a luminiferous aether. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Clerk_Maxwell

The Michelson–Morley experiments (That were not intended to detect aether but to detect movement in the aether) were continued for some years by Miller.

"The effect [of ether-drift] has persisted throughout. After considering all the possible sources of error, there always remained a positive effect." — Dayton Miller (1928)

"My opinion about Miller's experiments is the following. ... Should the positive result be confirmed, then the special theory of relativity and with it the general theory of relativity, in its current form, would be invalid. Experimentum summus judex. Only the equivalence of inertia and gravitation would remain, however, they would have to lead to a significantly different theory."
— Albert Einstein, in a letter to Edwin E. Slosson, 8 July 1925 (from copy in Hebrew University Archive, Jerusalem.) See citations below for Silberstein 1925 and Einstein 1926.

"I believe that I have really found the relationship between gravitation and electricity, assuming that the Miller experiments are based on a fundamental error. Otherwise, the whole relativity theory collapses like a house of cards."
— Albert Einstein, in a letter to Robert Millikan, June 1921 (in Clark 1971, p.328)

"You imagine that I look back on my life's work with calm satisfaction. But from nearby it looks quite different. There is not a single concept of which I am convinced that it will stand firm, and I feel uncertain whether I am in general on the right track."
— Albert Einstein, on his 70th birthday, in a letter to Maurice Solovine, *28 March 1949 (in B. Hoffman Albert Einstein: Creator and Rebel 1972, )
http://www.orgonelab.org/miller.htm

Einstein was having a quiet fit about Millers work at the time, but because certain members of the scientific community were hungry for what Eddington claimed was a theory that only he and Einstein understood, it became a necessity. It became political, just like global warming and climate change are things with too much money invested to let go.

The aether theory was a threat to vested interests who had invested in AC power distribution and a way out for physicists, who were being made to look silly by inventors like Tesla. They had something they could call their own and call all interlopers ignorant. Only those trained in the discipline could understand and this has persisted to this day. The problem now is that many like myself are asking for tangible results and they are not forthcoming.

 

[Ghostisfort]

I didn't say that Einstein was directly involved in the atomic bomb. In fact, his involvement was more as a consultant. The scientists who worked on the bomb consulted him to determine its theoretical viability, and he signed off the project for the US government.

You must excuse me for misunderstanding your post.
My point being that Einstein's theories were not used in Nazi Germany.
The bomb and nuclear energy being one of the very few new ideas since the 1930's. As far as I know fission was first observed in 1940.

 

[rynner2]

The killer proof is in the technology.

What technology, precisely, and how does it depend on the aether theory?

The problem now is that many like myself are asking for tangible results and they are not forthcoming.

I'm asking for tangible proofs of the aether, and they are not forthcoming!
All you're giving us is a load of old blather, avoiding specifics.

The aether theory fell out of favour because it contributed nothing that couldn't be handled by (eg) relativity theory.

The aether theory was a threat to vested interests who had invested in AC power distribution and a way out for physicists, who were being made to look silly by inventors like Tesla. They had something they could call their own and call all interlopers ignorant. Only those trained in the discipline could understand and this has persisted to this day.

Frankly, this is Conspiracy Theory up in the tinfoil hat class. If the aether theory had worked, or produced tangible results, it would have remained in favour; it was abandoned because it contributed nothing.

Opposition by physicists would have counted for nothing amongst the general public if there really was a useful technology that depended on aether theory. But in the real world there's no proof of the existence of the aether, and you're just swimming against the tide of history to believe otherwise.

 

[Ghostisfort]

Tesla completed his development of the alternator in the company of academics at one of the US universities.. I can't recall which one.
There have been no significant improvements to the technology since that time.

He then set to work on what he considered to be the natural evolution of his power distribution work, the lossless, wireless transmission of power. This was his pure aether technology based on the assumption that the aether theory was valid.

There can be little doubt that it worked, because having completed his research he went on to spend large amounts of cash on the Wardenclyffe Project. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wardenclyffe_Tower

His methods can be found throughout his writings and the best description I can find is compiled from Tesla's own description and written in "Lost Science" by Gerry Vassilatos.
http://www.n-atlantis.com/tesla.htm

Basically, Tesla used high frequency DC pulses (something like a high-powered, un-tuned, megahertz radio transmitter) in a simple circuit with a spark-gap and a condenser (capacitor) to produce a radiation that persisted even though he had shorted-out the original source of power. It was this radiation that powered his Wardenclyffe tower.

Tesla went to great pains to emphasise that he was not using Hertzian radio waves but scalar waves, like the movement of sound waves in the atmosphere, so the scalar waves propagated through the aether.

 

[Mythopoeika]

I didn't say that Einstein was directly involved in the atomic bomb. In fact, his involvement was more as a consultant. The scientists who worked on the bomb consulted him to determine its theoretical viability, and he signed off the project for the US government.

You must excuse me for misunderstanding your post.
My point being that Einstein's theories were not used in Nazi Germany.
The bomb and nuclear energy being one of the very few new ideas since the 1930's. As far as I know fission was first observed in 1940.

AFAIK, Nazi Germany didn't create a working bomb.
So, whether they used Einstein's theories or not is probably irrelevant.
But, the Manhattan Project did consult with Einstein, so it can (perhaps) be said that Einstein's theories did help to lead to the building of a working nuclear bomb.

 

[Ghostisfort]

The German nuclear energy project in Nazi Germany, informally known as the Uranverein (Uranium Club), began in April 1939, just months after the discovery of nuclear fission in January 1939. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_nuc ... gy_project

My argument above concerned the lack of any significant new concepts since the 1930's when Einstein's theories started to dominate. I originally gave you 1940's for fission, but Wiki says 1939, within my original limits.

The point of the Nazi mention was that fission was studied in an atmosphere where Einstein's theories were banned. I think it follows that a bomb could have been made without his intervention.

 

[Mythopoeika]

The point of the Nazi mention was that fission was studied in an atmosphere where Einstein's theories were banned. I think it follows that a bomb could have been made without his intervention.

In an alternate reality where history developed in a different way...yes, I'm sure that could have happened.









But it didn't.

 

[Ghostisfort]

Back to topic:

J.P. Morgan, the richest and most powerful man of that time, was a financier of the Tesla Broadcasting system. The Tower was designed as a world communications center and Nikola Tesla added to the project in that the tower would also be used for transmitting electrical energy without wires to the entire globe. Tesla wanted to saturate the globe with electricity as a dynamo so that everyone on the surface of the globe could obtain electrical light just by sticking wires into the soil and a electrical bulb would light. When J.P. Morgan heard about the Tesla project, he was asked: "How can we get money from the electricity which Tesla is supplying to every part of the world?" After that Morgan cut the funds and the Tower was never finished. http://www.teslasociety.com/teslatower.htm

The reader must surely note that there is never any doubt that Wardenclyffe would work. Also that no academic scientific research has followed Tesla's path in order to ease the burden that afflicts us with energy poverty today. I hope that some of our more scientific posters can enlighten us as to why this should be?

 

[Pietro_Mercurios]

If the Nazis wanted to build a nuclear bomb, then it was impossible for them to avoid using science based on Einstein's equation, E=MC². Einstein's own input into the development of the Manhattan Project bombs was apparently minimal.

http://www.doug-long.com/einstein.htm

ALBERT EINSTEIN
and the
ATOMIC BOMB

The physicist Albert Einstein did not directly participate in the invention of the atomic bomb. But as we shall see, he was instrumental in facilitating its development.

In 1905, as part of his Special Theory of Relativity, he made the intriguing point that a large amount of energy could be released from a small amount of matter. This was expressed by the equation E=mc2 (energy = mass times the speed of light squared). The atomic bomb would clearly illustrate this principle.

But bombs were not what Einstein had in mind when he published this equation. Indeed, he considered himself to be a pacifist. In 1929, he publicly declared that if a war broke out he would "unconditionally refuse to do war service, direct or indirect... regardless of how the cause of the war should be judged." (Ronald Clark, "Einstein: The Life and Times", pg. 428). His position would change in 1933, as the result of Adolf Hitler's ascent to power in Germany. While still promoting peace, Einstein no longer fit his previous self-description of being an "absolute pacifist".

Einstein's greatest role in the invention of the atomic bomb was signing a letter to President Franklin Roosevelt urging that the bomb be built. The splitting of the uranium atom in Germany in December 1938 plus continued German aggression led some physicists to fear that Germany might be working on an atomic bomb. Among those concerned were physicists Leo Szilard and Eugene Wigner. But Szilard and Wigner had no influence with those in power. So in July 1939 they explained the problem to someone who did: Albert Einstein. According to Szilard, Einstein said the possibility of a chain reaction "never occurred to me", altho Einstein was quick to understand the concept (Clark, pg. 669+; Spencer Weart & Gertrud Weiss Szilard, eds., "Leo Szilard: His Version of the Facts", pg. 83). After consulting with Einstein, in August 1939 Szilard wrote a letter to President Roosevelt with Einstein's signature on it. The letter was delivered to Roosevelt in October 1939 by Alexander Sachs, a friend of the President. Germany had invaded Poland the previous month; the time was ripe for action. That October the Briggs Committee was appointed to study uranium chain reactions.

...

The Germans did try to develop a home grown nuclear physics, but they were somewhat hampered by their attempt to reject, 'Jewish science'.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deutsche_Physik

...

During the early years of the twentieth century, Albert Einstein's Theory of Relativity was met with much bitter controversy within the physics communities of the world. There were many physicists, especially the "old guard," who were suspicious of the intuitive meanings of Einstein's theories. The leading theoretician of the Deutsche Physik type of movement was Rudolf Tomaschek who had re-edited the famous physics textbook Grimsehl's Lehrbuch der Physik. In that book, which consists of several volumes, the Lorentz transformation was accepted as well as quantum theory. However, Einstein's interpretation of the Lorentz transformation was not mentioned, and also Einstein's name was completely ignored. Many of these classical physicists resented Einstein's dismissal of the notion of a luminiferous aether, which had been a mainstay of their work for the majority of their productive lives. They were not convinced by the empirical evidences for Relativity: the measurements of the perihelion of Mercury and the null result of the Michelson-Morley experiment might be explained in other ways, they thought, and the results of the Eddington eclipse experiment (the first observed instance of gravitational lensing, a key prediction of Einstein's) were experimentally problematic enough to be dismissed as meaningless by the more devoted doubters. Many of these doubters were very distinguished experimental physicists—Lenard was himself a Nobel laureate in Physics.

...

Under the Third Reich
Johannes Stark attempted to become the Führer of German physics.

When the Nazis entered the political scene, Lenard quickly attempted to ally himself with them, joining the party at an early stage. With another physics Nobel laureate, Johannes Stark, Lenard began a core campaign to label Einstein's Relativity as Jewish Physics.

For a few years after the Nazi takeover in 1933, this found strong support from Nazi leadership, as it played upon a number of Nazi ideological themes, and gave yet another method to harass and delegitimize Jewish citizens and institutions. Lenard[6] and Stark enjoyed the Nazi support because it allowed them to undertake a professional coup for their preferred scientific theory, an example of using heavy-handed politics to resist an ideologically unwelcome scientific "paradigm shift". Under the rallying cry that physics should be more "German" and "Aryan," Lenard and Stark, with backing from the Nazi leadership, entered on a plan to pressure and replace physicist positions at German universities with people teaching their preferred theories. By the late 1930s, there were no longer any Jewish physicist professorships in Germany, since under the Nuremberg Laws of 1935 Jews were not allowed to work in universities. Stark in particular was also trying to get himself installed as the Führer of physics—not an entirely fanciful goal, given the Gleichschaltung (literally, "coordination") principle applied to other professional disciplines, such as medicine, under the Nazi regime, whereby a strict linear hierarchy was created along ideological lines.

They met with moderate success, but the support from the Nazi party was not as great as Lenard and Stark would have preferred. After a long period of harassment of the quantum physicist Werner Heisenberg, including getting him labeled a "White Jew" in the July 15, 1937, issue of SS's weekly, Das Schwarze Korps (The Black Corps), they began to fall from influence. Heisenberg was not only a pre-eminent physicist whom even the Nazis realised they were better off with than without, however "Jewish" his theory might be in the eyes of Stark and Lenard, but Heisenberg had, as a young boy, attended school with SS chief Heinrich Himmler. In a historic moment, Heisenberg's mother rang Himmler's mother and asked her if she would please tell the SS to give "Werner" a break. After beginning a full character evaluation, which Heisenberg both instigated and passed, Himmler forbade further attack on the physicist. Heisenberg would later employ his "Jewish physics," in the German project to develop nuclear fission for the purposes of nuclear weapons or nuclear energy use. Himmler promised Heisenberg that after Germany won the war, the SS would finance a physics institute to be directed by Heisenberg. [7]

Lenard began to play less and less of a role, and soon Stark ran into even more difficulty, as other scientists and industrialists known for being exceptionally "Aryan" came to the defense of Relativity and quantum mechanics. As historian Mark Walker puts it, "despite his best efforts, in the end his science was not accepted, supported, or used by the Third Reich. Stark spent a great deal of his time during the Third Reich fighting with bureaucrats within the National Socialist state. Most of the National Socialist leadership either never supported Lenard and Stark, or abandoned them in the course of the Third Reich."

...

Heisenberg was one of the the physicists in charge of the Nazi nuclear project.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Werner_Heisenberg#Uranium_Club

...

Heisenberg was appointed director-in-residence of the KWIP on 1 July 1942, as Peter Debye was still officially the director and on leave in the United States; Debye had gone on leave as he was a citizen of The Netherlands and had refused to become a German citizen when the HWA took administrative control of the KWIP. Heisenberg still also had his department of physics at the University of Leipzig where work was done for the Uranverein by Robert Döpel and his wife Klara Döpel. During the period Kurt Diebner administered the KWIP under the HWA program, considerable personal and professional animosity developed between Diebner and the Heisenberg inner circle – Heisenberg, Karl Wirtz, and Carl Friedrich von Weizsäcker.[18][99]

...

So the Germans may have rejected, 'Jewish science', but it was still necessary for an understanding of the physics of nuclear fission.

 

[Xanatic_]

I like the old theory of the luminiferous aether, so I was hoping this thread might bring something new to light. Instead it´s the tired old "Tesla was the messiah" crap you hear from so many cranks. If electronics rely on the aether, in some way you still haven´t explained, then how did we ever manage to invent the transistor, or the microchip years after the aether theory was proven wrong? Hell, how did we *ever* manage to invent anything that involves electricity or magnetism after this time?
What was the use of those quotes from Einstein? So he says the two theories don´t fit together, that one must be wrong. That somehow implies a vast conspiracy? Or that we have two competing theories, and one just happens to be backed up by evidence and so we went with that.
Also could you remind me what machines were created that showed Newton´s theories were correct? Trebuchets?

Incidentally, here´s a bit about a few people who are using wireless electricity: http://www.popsci.com/scitech/article/2 ... ricity-air

 

[Cochise]

Tesla's stuff is one of those areas where closed minds prevail. I don't say he had all the answers, but he certainly had ideas that were both 'left field' and extremely practical. Because the man himself became progressively more odd people run a mile rather than looking at his inventions dispassionatly.

And yes, I think there is something to be said for finding out if an idea works and then bothering about the theory afterwards. Which modern companies, out of a spirit of accounting-led caution, do not generally do.

I'm not sure there is anything new theoretically about the transister, aren't they an alternative (and better, obviously) way of doing what a valve does? In computers, even though we have microchips, its only a manufacturing difference from the old room-sized computers, the theory of operation is the same.

 

[Cochise]

AFAIK, Nazi Germany didn't create a working bomb.

I thought they were actually more interested in nuclear power, particularly for submarines? Didn't they have some sort of plans for a nuclear submarine using what I think they called a 'heavy water engine? Or am I hallucinating again?

 

[sporadicsmiles]

I believe GPS would not function correctly without a correction that comes from relativity. I would class that as a contribution from relativity to modern technology. =}

 

[rynner2]

I believe GPS would not function correctly without a correction that comes from relativity. I would class that as a contribution from relativity to modern technology. =}

We've tried all that stuff on Ghostisfort before (on various other threads) but he either ignores it or explains it away with hand-waving type arguments...

So now we await his proofs of the aether theory...

 

[Ghostisfort]

I like the old theory of the luminiferous aether, so I was hoping this thread might bring something new to light. Instead it´s the tired old "Tesla was the messiah" crap you hear from so many cranks. If electronics rely on the aether, in some way you still haven´t explained, then how did we ever manage to invent the transistor, or the microchip years after the aether theory was proven wrong? Hell, how did we *ever* manage to invent anything that involves electricity or magnetism after this time?
What was the use of those quotes from Einstein? So he says the two theories don´t fit together, that one must be wrong. That somehow implies a vast conspiracy? Or that we have two competing theories, and one just happens to be backed up by evidence and so we went with that.
Also could you remind me what machines were created that showed Newton´s theories were correct? Trebuchets?

Incidentally, here´s a bit about a few people who are using wireless electricity: http://www.popsci.com/scitech/article/2 ... ricity-air

You seem to be under the spell, like so many on this board, of scientific educational brain washing. A few threads ago, we had one guy threatening to kill-file me. This reminds me of a religious acolyte fleeing the heathen who threatens to drag him down to hell.

There will be something new when we finish the also running thread about Einstein.

I don't follow messiahs, but when someone, a hundred years ago, offers the opportunity of a new energy source and it's ignored by the very people who we all pay to work on such things, I makes me wonder what the hell is going on.

Your question about how we managed to invent the transistor is interesting though. I've answered your question here: http://www.n-atlantis.com/transistor.htm
I repeat what I've already said, that there have been very few or no inventions or new concepts since the 1930's and this coincides with the beginning of the domination of Einstein's theories.

There is no unequivocal evidence that his theories are true. We are told that his theories are true for pulsars, a theoretical concept themselves.

"The closest known pulsar to Earth is "PSR J0108-1431". It lies in the direction of the constellation Cetus, at a distance of about 85 parsecs (or 280 light years)." http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_c ... r_to_earth

No one is likely to board a starship to check out the figures.

Newton's theories were at least logically based on the knowledge of the day and not specifically designed to befuddle the uninitiated..

Your link, if the accompanying text is anything to go by, is about induction, something know about since Faraday. Tesla's Wardenclyffe tower was not about induction or anything remotely connected with induction.

 

[Ghostisfort]

I believe GPS would not function correctly without a correction that comes from relativity. I would class that as a contribution from relativity to modern technology. =}

Yes, indeed it has been tried before and the problem lies in the academic habit of revisionism.
Before the GPS was operational, there were some physicists who said it would NOT work BECAUSE of relativistic effects. There were still others who said it would work for the very same reason.
Now, if even physicists can't agree on such a basic test, then what hope for the rest of us? What hope for pulsars 280 light years away?

 

[rynner2]

I believe GPS would not function correctly without a correction that comes from relativity. I would class that as a contribution from relativity to modern technology. =}

Yes, indeed it has been tried before and the problem lies in the academic habit of revisionism.
Before the GPS was operational, there were some physicists who said it would NOT work BECAUSE of relativistic effects. There were still others who said it would work for the very same reason.
Now, if even physicists can't agree on such a basic test, then what hope for the rest of us? What hope for pulsars 280 light years away?

:hello:

 

[Ghostisfort]

Hello rynner2 :_pished: :hello:

 

[Ghostisfort]

Tesla's stuff is one of those areas where closed minds prevail. I don't say he had all the answers, but he certainly had ideas that were both 'left field' and extremely practical. Because the man himself became progressively more odd people run a mile rather than looking at his inventions dispassionatly.

And yes, I think there is something to be said for finding out if an idea works and then bothering about the theory afterwards. Which modern companies, out of a spirit of accounting-led caution, do not generally do.

I'm not sure there is anything new theoretically about the transister, aren't they an alternative (and better, obviously) way of doing what a valve does? In computers, even though we have microchips, its only a manufacturing difference from the old room-sized computers, the theory of operation is the same.

Thank you Cochise.
BTW, what happened regarding the thread on Religion?