Children Kick Wallaby To Death

[Anonymous]

Re: Re: Re: Pot calling kettle a vessel?

Everyone wants to use this as a predictive indicator of future viloence, my point, primarily, is that this is almost certainly the result of past violence.

In "some cases" it is the result of past violence. Past violence certainly doesn't make up for the majority of such behavior. There have been quite a few case studies on this. But in the same manner as cautionary measures should be taken for the future, cautionary measures for the past or present home life should be treated with equal concern and consideration. Often both would be addressed within group therapy sessions and visits of the like.

 

[Kondoru]

I have known several bad homes, `supposedly` being monitored by the authorities, and the kids just go from bad to worse.

I have also known kids from bad backgrounds get a `lucky break` they are fostered by a decent couple in a decent area of town, and get to go to a good school.

Funny how they either stray back to their bad parents or run away full stop.

`disclipline` is the reason.

Ok, if you were a kid and you had the choice between a grotty council flat, a drunk parent, no garden, no car, no holidays, no mod cons, and a nice household where mummy was sober and you got all those things that so say `normal` kids had, what would you choose?

<shrugs>

 

[austen27]

`disclipline` is the reason.

Ok, if you were a kid and you had the choice between a grotty council flat, a drunk parent, no garden, no car, no holidays, no mod cons, and a nice household where mummy was sober and you got all those things that so say `normal` kids had, what would you choose?

I agree, but it isn't always so obviously split on the lines of class. There are some terrible drunk middle class mothers, and some brilliantly resourceful and loving parents on council estates.

 

[Anonymous]

The kids kicked the young Joey type in because they find authority a joke and a challenge. This can be for severel reasons. The most common is being brought up learning from a parent (Yes...a parent). *That's not to say single parents are vectors for anti-social kids* that authority is nothing but a pain in the arse and nothing to comply to unless you are a wimp.
The environment which the poor creature, (and it's peers) was murdered isn't much better than the sole of the little bastards' feet!
Counselling and therapy aren't the answer, (Unless the problem is ailing client participation in counselling and/or therapy etc!). The answer is parental responsibility. Punish the parents for all activity an under 16 year old child does, (Only the bad activity, hehe!) and once the kid reaches 16, let him/her take responsibility, [unless they raise the age of consent to 18 or 21, which is possibly what it should be anyway, especially the minimum driving age FOR MALES!].
It is true that animal abuse can be an indicator of other abuse, but typically, those on a council estate, are brought up to see rabbit shooting, ferreting, ratting, fishing, and "cat baiting" as normal "working class" attributes. I see it all the time and it pisses me off! It's not just the upper class twats that murder wildlife! So, the baby wallaby is, to them, just another "dumb" animal that means sod all in their lives of "nowhere".
Shut zoos down ("Oh but how else can normal folk learn about animals close up without zoos?" Don't even try that excuse mate!) and force education on the ignorant anti-social people who drag their kids up with latchdoors, needles, violence, misogyny and alchohol nightmares.
Saying that someone should "Kick the kids to death". is like saying "I am a total and utter utter Nazi bastard! Thankyou."(O-er...Just read more of his post and found the "I've tasted blood" syndrome. So it's no surprise he typed that. (No offense, if it was mainly irony)
I'm ranting now, so I'll shut me gob PS...Hitler wasn't a veggie either. That was a myth perpetuated by the upper class bigots in the Countryside Allience!
Oh aye. Si thi.

 

[Anonymous]

I grew up on a council estate.

Kids that age should consider cute little fluffy wallabies just that - cute ickle fluffy animals to cooed and ahhed over. About the only danger an animal like that should face from kids is the outside chance of being cuddled to death.

More than likely, there's a ringleaded. Someone who put them up to it. One of them who wanted to kick the animal, and got them all to do it so they're all equally responsible. And that's the one that's displaying danger signs.

I hope they find them. And when they do, I hope the parents turn out to be middle-class respectable types. That'll show people. Failing that, I hope they're not the type of parents who don't see why their children need to behave. Now that's the type of parent I despise.

 

[Anonymous]

spillage indeed.

"Kick the kids to death". is like saying "I am a total and utter utter Nazi bastard! Thankyou."

No, I thankyou.

Perhaps if I'd pointed out my cultural up bringing then maybe you'd have employed some common sense before calling me an "utter utter Nazi bastard"...I say maybe, but that's just me being liberal with what's called the benefit of the doubt

(O-er...Just read more of his post and found the "I've tasted blood" syndrome. So it's no surprise he typed that. (No offense, if it was mainly irony)

Ah, so I take it because you suspect irony was employed that you did finally read the rest of my post. Once again I'm being liberal with benefit of the doubt...because otherwise you missed the rest of what I wrote or you're just stiring up trouble because its Wednesday? Either way, you're feisty monkey

I did agree with your "upper class twats murdering wild life" though And your comment about zoo's. Not that there is much nature left in britain for people to learn about (nor country side to explore...nice to see they're bringing back the waterways on the grand union canal though), but then there is the discovery channel

 

[Kondoru]

Whats the betting that nothing is done?

And I dont like any of your classist comments

BTW, One of the `worst` (I use the term advisedly, she was an independent, wayward brat who suffered from mollycoddling parents, and what happened to her was not that bad after all.) storys I knew was of a local 15 year old girl who suddenly ran away to London to become a prostitute.

She managed to stay uncaught untill she was 16 and her parents could not recapture her. They have forgiven her now (11 years on) but she `still` wont go home.

and that was a nice middleclass home.

 

[Tyger_Lily]

I quite miss his posts...
If you need to see look upon the avatar and reminisce: http://www.forteantimes.com/forum/member.php?s=&action=getinfo&userid=1004

Are 'permanent bans' always... well... permanent? :sceptic:
Like forever?

Yes they are, unfortunately.

On a more cheerful front, he is alive and well. (Don't tell anyone but there is quite a soft and sweet side to the old boy. I can't say it too loudly 'cos it would ruin his "git-like" reputation!! )

 

[Anonymous]

Arrr! I wasn't calling you a Nazi bastard. Just likening the two statements: but I knew you weren't being serious, and neither was I.
I hope noone thinks I was being classist either.....I live, and have done so for over 38 years in a council estate, (Although on the outskirts of "The green and pleasant countryside"), and have always been 'working class' and never had what could be regarded as a "Proper education", decent wages or comfort. I am, typically mining village working class. But noone I know has no morals or anti-social values. They're all decent people. Oh, a few adolescent bastards *Baseball capped little Nike wearing gits and those bleeding motorised standup scooter riding buggers that you want to immediately immobilise with a sharp hoe!*, but they eventually grow out of it or are locked up/see sense.
I'm an artist and a vegan, so it only makes sense that I suffered for my cause, being where I am and all the rest. But I've found that noone round here has given me shit about it. Live and let live and even the crassist of people here are willing to listen and have (Miraculously) behaved themselves when reasoned with, without patronising them (Like some people tend to do when confronting them).
ie; for a few nights, there were a few people in the street behind my house, drinking and talking loudly, playing music loud until the very very early hours. Police came, arrested a few now and then, but it still continued. Days later, (when it wasn't raining and they started again...) I waited until the music paused between CDs and asked politely if they could tone it down as I had kids in bed (which I didn't) and it was 1 oclock in the morning. A friendly "Sorry mate" and the music went off, voices quietened and a "Thanks mate." from me, and it has stopped. THat was 2 months ago!

There's always a ringleader in youth anarchy. Always. Organised crime is usually a mixture of "nice public school types" using "Desperado" types. The kids that did the kicking were probably more scared than the poor bloody creature. *Being Fortean, I wouldn't be surprised if the "Kids doing it" wasn't a cover up, and it was some vicious plot to photograph "Something" being mistreated for an "Iraqi military undercover photo exclusive"! Or something less comically viable.
Sorry once again for ranting.

 

[Anome]

More than likely, there's a ringleaded. Someone who put them up to it. One of them who wanted to kick the animal, and got them all to do it so they're all equally responsible. And that's the one that's displaying danger signs.

It's possible that, rather than specifically wanting to kick the wallaby to death, they wanted to exert some kind of power over the others. Show that they were in charge, and get their thrills from that. Plus knowing who was involved gives them more power.

Let me point out that I don't know either way what socio-economic group these kids belong to, nor is it relevant. I don't care what their parents are like, or where they live, as long as something is done to stop them.

 

[Anonymous]

And I dont like any of your classist comments /and that was a nice middleclass home.

Which ones and whos?

 

[Anonymous]

Oh, a few adolescent bastards *Baseball capped little Nike wearing gits and those bleeding motorised standup scooter riding buggers that you want to immediately immobilise with a sharp hoe!

That's a shared sympathy regardless of class as this breed of thug grow in number!

I'm an artist and a vegan

Then you and I are of similar ilk, but I'm not vegan.

Organised crime is usually a mixture of "nice public school types" using "Desperado" types.

So it takes the upper classes to organise the lower classes to have the organisational skills to rob a bank or rob a pensioner? I've got slightly more faith in the common criminal than you then I'd be more inclined to think that people are people, regardless of class. Class is just a pidgeon hole facility by which to segrigate people for blame. Bollocks to that.

 

[TheQuixote]

I did attempt to post an article from a local rag which went into detail about how the Zoo is kicking off an education drive with local schools in the area but I got timed out and as there was no link on the Express and Star's website I couldn't rip it off the net.

The local MP is also calling for the children to "face firm action" and there is also talk of the children being made the subject of a Child Safety Order and a Parenting Order.

As two of them were under the age of 10, they are below the age of criminal responsibilty, the CPS are advising the police on what action to take against the elder children.

Edit!

I just found this on the BBC website that has the MP's statement and is practically word for word as the local rag article

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/west_midlands/3706511.stm

 

[Anonymous]

I tried to post many times but it went mad!!!
I can't remember what I originally posted but....................

Harold Arsewright, judge and local pillar of society (and head of overseas manager of affairs of the incoming high profit illegal merchandise) , employs Barry banana incubator Smith "I ain't got nuthin so I ain't got nuthin ter lose" Jones to bash ethnic minorities just to take the focus off his "little" scheme to make kettles redundant so that spoons become more expensive, thus smackheads and tea stirring factories spend more money so that his "Glass arse inducement policies" become a viable business in the eyes of his bank managers!
THere. Did I relay that effinciently? lol!

 

[austen27]

Class is just a pidgeon hole facility by which to segrigate people for blame.

Nonsense!

The Upperclass are eccentric, rakish, lanquid and endearing.

The Working class are mad, criminal, lazy and stupid.

Quite different from each other!

Originally posted by Quixote
the Zoo is kicking off an education drive with local schools

There might have been a better way to phrase that!

 

[Anonymous]

Nonsense!
The Upperclass are eccentric, rakish, lanquid and endearing.
The Working class are mad, criminal, lazy and stupid.

Couldn't have found a better example of pidgeon holing myself

We need to surely bring the north/south devide into the debate now? As I recall, doesn't it go something like; All northerners are as thick as f*ck and all southerners are as soft as shite?

 

[Anonymous]

North/South divide could cause problems, as Dudley's pretty much slap bang in the middle. Mind you, that would just mean, of course, that anything could apply!

Be aware, though, that as a Midlander myself, you may be on the receiving end of some flak from myself!

 

[Anonymous]

North/South divide could cause problems, as Dudley's pretty much slap bang in the middle. Mind you, that would just mean, of course, that anything could apply!

Be aware, though, that as a Midlander myself, you may be on the receiving end of some flak from myself!

Dood-lay!

I'm a midlander though not born and bred (but I'm a tax paying, homeowning midlander) so perhaps I'd qualify to give you westmidlands flak from an east midland stand point?

The midlands is a huge expance of fence when it comes to the north south divide.

 

[Bannik]

I quite miss his posts...

Yeah. Sometimes I'll be reading some old thread and one of his posts will show up and make me laugh. Then I'll remember he's gone and I'll feel sad.

 

[Anonymous]

Kicking the kids to death.... while i'm not saying this is a good idea it does make me wonder what makes the kids kick, and how much do you want people like that around. What we hate is often not the fact that an animal is dead but that we are disappointed in humans for stooping to such a thing.

 

[Anonymous]

Er, i meant makes them 'tick' not 'kick'.

 

[TheQuixote]

Boys face court over killing of zoo wallaby

By Wyn Matthews
Jun 1, 2004, 15:56


Three schoolboys will appear in court in connection with the kicking to death of a wallaby at Dudley Zoo.

Two 11-year-olds face two charges of causing cruelty to an animal and a 10-year-old is charged with one offence of causing cruelty to an animal.

They will all appear before Dudley youth court on Thursday.

A fourth youth, aged nine at the time of the offence, has been referred to Dudley's youth offending team.

The five-month-old male wallaby, Roo, died after being attacked in its enclosure at Dudley Zoo on May 5.

It was believed to have been kicked, dragged into a pool and then its body was left in the shelter where its terrified family was hiding.

Chief Superintendent Dennis Hodson, of Dudley North police, said: "Three youths have been charged with cruelty and the fourth, who is under 10, is being referred to the youth offending team.

"They will work with the youth and his family as part of a multi-agency referral panel, looking at options such as parenting orders."

Peter Suddock, chief executive at Dudley Zoo, said: "We are very pleased that police are actually taking action against these youngsters and we hope the court deals with it appropriately."

The zoo has been inundated with calls and e-mails from people horrified by news of the attack.

Animal lover Councillor Bryan Cotterill, who has been campaigning for tough action against the culprits, said: "For this offence to go unpunished would not only send out the wrong message but it would do nothing for the children's future lives - they need to be corrected and to understand right from wrong."

Zoo staff found the dead animal on the morning of May 6, along with the surviving six members of the family which were frightened and distressed but unhurt.

A post mortem revealed that the animal, which had only left its mother's pouch a few days before, probably died of shock as it was being kicked.

From here:
Express & Star

 

[RainyOcean]

You vegetarians are the worst.

HEY!

Also, as far as being a meat eater who is against animal cruelty is concerned, at least in the United States anyway, they do incredibly horrible things to the animals before they kill them. The animals endure a life of pure suffering only to be killed for food. Its really terrible.

 

[Anome]

Here in Australia, we have standards to prevent that sort of thing.

Come to think of it, I think they do in the US as well.

Not everyone meets the standards, I'm sure. And they could do with improvement (and better enforcement), but I think you'll find that most places actually treat their animals well.

Then again, I'm sure PETA have a pamphlet that proves me wrong.

 

[OneWingedBird]

IIRC didn't a European country a few years ago do a version of Big Brother with children, where the organisers had to intervene to stop them torturing a hedgehog that they found?

 

[original_fLeebLe]

IIRC didn't a European country a few years ago do a version of Big Brother with children, where the organisers had to intervene to stop them torturing a hedgehog that they found?

that was a channel four programme where a group of kids got to live in a house by thereselves with no adult intervention. but when they were about to attack the hedgehog the film crew stopped them.

 

[Leaferne]

Here in Australia, we have standards to prevent that sort of thing.

Come to think of it, I think they do in the US as well.

I would say most, if not all, of the civilized world does.

There's this recent story out of Austria:

Austria passes strict animal rights laws

Vienna, , May. 28 (UPI) -- Austrian lawmakers have passed several strict animal rights laws, including measures to keep chickens out of cages and dogs free of choke collars.

The legislation passed Thursday is the strictest in the world, the Telegraph reported Friday.

The new laws also criminalize placing animals in the care of minors, displaying pets in shop windows, using wild animals in circus acts or other spectacles or keeping cattle on a rope or line.

Animal rights groups welcomed the changes, but the country's farmers reacted angrily, arguing that forcing them to keep only free-range chickens would increase prices and lead to a flood of eggs from foreign battery hens.

As for PETA, IMO they hinder their own cause by being so extreme. They don't actually seem to know anything about animals anyway (horses don't mind being ridden, you know. They really don't).

 

[Raya_Kaiserin]

Thugs as young as eight kicked a baby wallaby to death and tormented lions after breaking into Dudley Zoo.

It would've been a whole lot better if one of those lions had thought "Stuff this" and mauled one of the little shits to death.

Mm, irony.

 

[Tyger_Lily]

Battery hen cages will be illegal in Europe by 2012. Why so long??

 

[Anonymous]

Last year PETA issued a statement against milk, stating that cows should not be milked by humans. I'd like to see them dealing with the consequences of rampant mastitis in lactating bovines. Bloody idiots.