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FT216

TheQuixote

Gone But Not Forgotten
(ACCOUNT RETIRED)
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Sep 25, 2003
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3,268
So far it looks a pretty good issue.

  • The woman who believes she is the reincarnation of Marilyn Monroe

    David Lynch

    A two-page photo spread of crop circles from 2006

    Stone Age soldiers - how Borneo headhunters became the strangest army of WWII

    Centenarian Update (quite apt)

    Tin foil hats - in which the FTMB gets a personal headsup
 
Sounds good, I'll look forward to recieving this in about another month, if the subscriptions people actually bother to send it out this time
 
Funny you should say that Zoltan, mine did not arrive last month either - had to ring up for a replacement in the end.

This month's arrived decently early, though. Grabbed it on the way out to work earlier, but have not had chance to go through it yet.

PB
 
It looks to be a good issue - I can't wait to read the one on headhunters from Borneo.

TheQuixote said:
Tin foil hats - in which the FTMB gets a personal headsup[/list]

Saw that one :)
 
The photo on the letters page of the flying saucer is, as they say, pretty obviously a cloud, which makes me wonder: surely the anonymous taker of the photo would have noticed this when it didn't move much or eventually dispersed, so what was their motivation in sending it? To show the unusual weather or to try and fool someone?

I guess we'll never know...
 
I did a little "Woo- hoo" when I saw it on the doormat. My days are rather sedentary of late, being nearly 38 weeks pregnant, and the sofa is where I live. Fresh interesting reading material! Such was my delighted haste I actually bent to pick it up myself instead of whining for the chap to come and get it off the floor for me :lol:
But no IHTM! Whyever not?!
 
Anyone else think the Borneo article is misrepresented by the cover? There's hardly anything about World War II in it.
 
gncxx said:
Anyone else think the Borneo article is misrepresented by the cover? There's hardly anything about World War II in it.

I agree, but I suppose 'How Borneo's headhunters became the strangest army of WWII' is more likely to attract attention than 'Man Parachuted into Borneo in 1944', or 'Stones found in jungles of Borneo' ;)
 
zoltan_g said:
Sounds good, I'll look forward to recieving this in about another month, if the subscriptions people actually bother to send it out this time

Well, I take it all back, I got home on Friday and there was issue 216 sitting there waiting for me. :D
 
So who's already ordered their copy of "The Science of Extraterrestrials"? It's about time UFOs were explained. At last.
 
I picked up my copy from the newsagent this morning but before I'd had a chance to read it, I'd ripped it in half trying to remove the 'please take out a subscription' sh*te which was glued into the spine. So, well done FT/Dennis - you may not have got a subscription out of me, but you have managed to make me spend an extra £3.80 this month... :evil:
 
Class issue. I was hoping for more craziness from David Lynch though.
 
HenryFort said:
Class issue. I was hoping for more craziness from David Lynch though.
He saves it for his movies.

You don't think his wholehearted endorsment of TM isn't just slightly bonkers, though?
 
Pietro_Mercurios said:
You don't think his wholehearted endorsment of TM isn't just slightly bonkers, though?
To be honest man, I only got a third of the way through it and I moved on - only picked up my copy today. I love Lynch, but I guess his film-making processes etc would get into Empire rather than FT.
 
It was more about his spiritual beliefs. At least Lynch isn't into Scientology...
 
I really liked this issue. Still think the 'heirophant's apprentice' should shut up, or at least dress down his (her?) convoluted language, which is neither clever nor funny, but is a little tiring on the eyes.

Glad to see that FT's strange obsession with all things WWII continues with the cover - excellent article, by the way.
 
I really liked this issue. Still think the 'heirophant's apprentice' should shut up, or at least dress down his (her?) convoluted language, which is neither clever nor funny, but is a little tiring on the eyes.

Yes, I agree. I had to read it twice before I knew what he was talking about. He was complaining about debunkers who debunk his colleagues – I think?
I have no complaint about looking for the facts of a case and exposing the bunk – I do it myself all the time. What does irritate me is the kind of debunking with an agenda to discredit all of the other evidence and testimony. The “cronies of Clarke” certainly do this, although I’ve found Clarke himself to be not as bad as his cohorts.

On the positive side I think FT216 is good and I especially enjoyed the editorial. Well done David Sutton.
:D :D :D :D :D :D
 
Yes, I enjoyed this issue too - first one for a while I think I've read every piece in (was there no 'alien zoo' or have years of ignoring it meant I no longer even see it?). For some reason I especially liked the giant cabbages. The David Lynch thing almost had me sold on TM, heh, although I didn't quite get the point of the piece - it wasn't particularly about David Lynch and it wasn't a very full exploration of TM, which has A LOT of critics and is considered a cult by many. Still, I suppose he's a 'big name' scoop interviewee.

By 'hierophant's apprentice' are we talking about the 'dictionary of the damned' piece? If so I thought it was OK .... and there was that bit in there about 'my late master' or some such which I thought might have been some subtle clue in the ongoing saga of the hierophant's mysterious disappearance and transformation, which I seem to be about the only person to find amusing, heh.
 
Yes, I enjoyed this issue too - first one for a while I think I've read every piece in (was there no 'alien zoo' or have years of ignoring it meant I no longer even see it?). For some reason I especially liked the giant cabbages. David Lynch

You seem to have the same taste as myself although I haven’t read the David Lynch article yet. And no it wasn’t the Dictionary of the Damned; it was the other I was referring to. Which brings me to the DD piece: I would love to have a full article rant about this and destroy every paragraph, but for now a small post will have to do.
Code:
 
Newton said his ideas came with the help of the giants upon whose shoulders he was standing. The Hierophant appears to belong to a new school of thought that has as its agenda the destruction of the wisdom of the ages, to be replaced by quotes from dodgy science. If this ever takes off (and I don’t for one minute think it can) global warming as a threat to humanity will sink into obscurity in the face of its crass absurdity. This totally brainwashed scientistic mode of thinking is born of the media who place such utterers on a pedestal they don’t deserve and justify it with the untested excuse that they are being scientific.

This magazine is occasionally berated by a smattering of the deluded for taking all the wonder out of existence and fostering a tiresomely materialist, `linear' and grossly unimaginative campaign to sabotage all things bright and truly Fortean. Some readers may feel that they- have experienced something dangerously close to that caricature in this entry of our very fine Dictionary.

In like fashion, most of us gratefully ignore that band of obsessives who produce endless funny equations - all of them different - purporting to refute the theory of relativity. To mathematicians, they're meaningless; but to their creators they are infinitely important. Statisticians call this a `Type I error'- the mistake of discerning significance where none objectively exists. One of the characteristics of hypotheses based on Type I errors is their inability to predict anything. This is true too of Jung's concept of synchronicity.

The deluded are not completely happy with the second part of the quote as what it’s saying is that there is no need for new ideas because mathematicians have said so and he is prepared to dismiss the old master Jung with a wave of the hand. I wish to remind Mr. Hierophant that the *past* age of enlightenment was not built upon the rejection of new ideas.
http://www.ldolphin.org/vanFlandern/
Just a few silly ideas by van Flandern who is in a position of first hand knowledge about GPS etc.
Eds sorry for the cock-up
 
It really pains me to say this. As the handy stats on me to the left will unfortunately remind me, i'm not a young man anymore. For half of my twenty six years on this globe, I've been an FT reader. I've never thought this dark day would come. But...I was a bit disappointed with this issue.

The blame falls in part on the damned Heirophant. After the discussion in this forum, my expectations put a bit more pressure on his column than in previous issues. Pressure it just couldn't take. The point of his article - which I take to be : Subjecting phenomena to critical analysis and finding flaws where there are flaws to find - or 'debunking' - is a good thing, but the term which he chooses to describe this has been mistaken, by both kinds of the uncritically minded, as the desire to find flaws consistently whether they were there or not - is fair enough. But why bother? We haven't even won 'sceptic' back yet, lets not open up another front. There isnt even an archaic spelling of debunker we can revert to in the meantime to distinguish good practice. There are worthwhile and interesting things to be said about the misuse of 'rational' terms to refer to a rather dull, unflexible worldview which imposes a presupposed limit on what an unknown quantity can be - whether the unimaginative 'Single vision and Newton's sleep' of Blake, or the Rabid Randi-ism of RAW's 'fundamentalist materialists'. This article doesn't really say much. The actual case in question doesn't get much look in. And he appears to say thae Charles Fort was full of sh*t. Which, of course, he was, and may our alien farmers harvest us all if he wouldn't be the first to say so. But, again: why bother?

From this, I flicked through until my eye was caught by a glorious announcement: a new release of Sir Henry at Rawlinson's End! No longer must I be cursed to annoy friends who haven't seen it with monologues from this film. Any good special features? I checked to see. To find a review which from the start announced its author's strong dislike of Viv Stanshall and all his works. Fair enough, some people just have a strange sense of humour. Some people even like My Family. But I complain when the editors of my student newspaper have just handed something to a reviewer who just isn't got to get it, and I complain even more when I've paid money to be told this. I'm not the market for this review - I know I love the film. Someone like RC Samson isn't either. The intended reader is surely someone who doesn't know if they'll like Stanshall or not, and they'll get no sense of whether they would from this paragraph. Unless, that is, they know the tastes of RCS. And I checked this by reading the other reviews. Time Bandits? yes, it is good -but 'Terry Gilliam's third feature - and what I've always thought of as a sort of prologue to the triptych of meditations on the human imagination represented by Brazil/Baron Munchausen/fisher King'...' What about the unfinished Quixote? What about Fear and Loathing? Even the brother's grimm, in a way... There's no need to limit Gillian's exploration of the twilight zone to a triptych, and there's certainly no need to humbly claim this observation as your own... Withnail and I's 'Twerpy student fans' . Fair comment.

From the film reviews to the music reviews. Music reviews? I didnt know FT had them. And it doesn't. What it has is the Forum, a place for the scouring of forteana and fortean opinion which has in the past turned up such classics as Ken Campbell on the Rev Fanthorpe and the pophetic outpourings of Doc Sheils. Or, in this issue, the obligatory piece by Karl Shuker,a couple of mildly interesting numbers and a page-hogging puff-piece rubberstamping the PR releases of a new age musician.

From this hat trick came a quickly gathering snowball of screaming apathy which saw me moan at the Weekly World Newsishness of "Marilyn Munro", remain unstirred by the Da Vinci cash-in self-promotion facing it, flick through the centeranian round up (yes, it has to be done, like the ABC reports - but if any of the material so recorded was in any way interesting, it would have found menton when it broke anyway) and pass my eyes over a pice on David Lynch (or was it on transcendental meditation) which told me little I didn't know about either. ..Even if I did like the deadpan cheek of his non-plot-spoiling admission "It's about a woman in trouble" . Y'see, I have this theory that Mulholland Drive, Blue Velvet and Twin Peaks: Fire Walk With me form a thematic triptych...


All in all. I didn't hate it. I quite enjoyed whiling away an afternoon with the FT. But there was nothing to make me go wow. Ho Hum.
 
It really pains me to say this. As the handy stats on me to the left will unfortunately remind me, i'm not a young man anymore. For half of my twenty six years on this globe, I've been an FT reader. I've never thought this dark day would come. But...I was a bit disappointed with this issue.

The blame falls in part on the damned Heirophant. After the discussion in this forum, my expectations put a bit more pressure on his column than in previous issues. Pressure it just couldn't take. The point of his article - which I take to be : Subjecting phenomena to critical analysis and finding flaws where there are flaws to find - or 'debunking' - is a good thing, but the term which he chooses to describe this has been mistaken, by both kinds of the uncritically minded, as the desire to find flaws consistently whether they were there or not - is fair enough. But why bother? We haven't even won 'sceptic' back yet, lets not open up another front. There isnt even an archaic spelling of debunker we can revert to in the meantime to distinguish good practice. There are worthwhile and interesting things to be said about the misuse of 'rational' terms to refer to a rather dull, unflexible worldview which imposes a presupposed limit on what an unknown quantity can be - whether the unimaginative 'Single vision and Newton's sleep' of Blake, or the Rabid Randi-ism of RAW's 'fundamentalist materialists'. This article doesn't really say much. The actual case in question doesn't get much look in. And he appears to say thae Charles Fort was full of sh*t. Which, of course, he was, and may our alien farmers harvest us all if he wouldn't be the first to say so. But, again: why bother?

From this, I flicked through until my eye was caught by a glorious announcement: a new release of Sir Henry at Rawlinson's End! No longer must I be cursed to annoy friends who haven't seen it with monologues from this film. Any good special features? I checked to see. To find a review which from the start announced its author's strong dislike of Viv Stanshall and all his works. Fair enough, some people just have a strange sense of humour. Some people even like My Family. But I complain when the editors of my student newspaper have just handed something to a reviewer who just isn't got to get it, and I complain even more when I've paid money to be told this. I'm not the market for this review - I know I love the film. Someone like RC Samson isn't either. The intended reader is surely someone who doesn't know if they'll like Stanshall or not, and they'll get no sense of whether they would from this paragraph. Unless, that is, they know the tastes of RCS. And I checked this by reading the other reviews. Time Bandits? yes, it is good -but 'Terry Gilliam's third feature - and what I've always thought of as a sort of prologue to the triptych of meditations on the human imagination represented by Brazil/Baron Munchausen/fisher King'...' What about the unfinished Quixote? What about Fear and Loathing? Even the brother's grimm, in a way... There's no need to limit Gillian's exploration of the twilight zone to a triptych, and there's certainly no need to humbly claim this observation as your own... Withnail and I's 'Twerpy student fans' . Fair comment.

From the film reviews to the music reviews. Music reviews? I didnt know FT had them. And it doesn't. What it has is the Forum, a place for the scouring of forteana and fortean opinion which has in the past turned up such classics as Ken Campbell on the Rev Fanthorpe and the pophetic outpourings of Doc Sheils. Or, in this issue, the obligatory piece by Karl Shuker,a couple of mildly interesting numbers and a page-hogging puff-piece rubberstamping the PR releases of a new age musician.

From this hat trick came a quickly gathering snowball of screaming apathy which saw me moan at the Weekly World Newsishness of "Marilyn Munro", remain unstirred by the Da Vinci cash-in self-promotion facing it, flick through the centeranian round up (yes, it has to be done, like the ABC reports - but if any of the material so recorded was in any way interesting, it would have found menton when it broke anyway) and pass my eyes over a pice on David Lynch (or was it on transcendental meditation) which told me little I didn't know about either. ..Even if I did like the deadpan cheek of his non-plot-spoiling admission "It's about a woman in trouble" . Y'see, I have this theory that Mulholland Drive, Blue Velvet and Twin Peaks: Fire Walk With me form a thematic triptych...


All in all. I didn't hate it. I quite enjoyed whiling away an afternoon with the FT. But there was nothing to make me go wow. Ho Hum.
 
:confused:

Lanark_And_Rima, why have you posted the same thing twice, 7 hours apart from each other??
 
Lanark_And_Rima said:
The blame falls in part on the damned Heirophant. After the discussion in this forum, my expectations put a bit more pressure on his column than in previous issues. Pressure it just couldn't take. The point of his article - which I take to be : Subjecting phenomena to critical analysis and finding flaws where there are flaws to find - or 'debunking' - is a good thing, but the term which he chooses to describe this has been mistaken, by both kinds of the uncritically minded, as the desire to find flaws consistently whether they were there or not - is fair enough. But why bother? We haven't even won 'sceptic' back yet, lets not open up another front. There isnt even an archaic spelling of debunker we can revert to in the meantime to distinguish good practice. There are worthwhile and interesting things to be said about the misuse of 'rational' terms to refer to a rather dull, unflexible worldview which imposes a presupposed limit on what an unknown quantity can be - whether the unimaginative 'Single vision and Newton's sleep' of Blake, or the Rabid Randi-ism of RAW's 'fundamentalist materialists'. This article doesn't really say much. The actual case in question doesn't get much look in. And he appears to say thae Charles Fort was full of sh*t. Which, of course, he was, and may our alien farmers harvest us all if he wouldn't be the first to say so. But, again: why bother?

I was wondering about the skeptic/sceptic thing too and why it wasn't addressed. There was also something almost Sub-Sub-Genius about the whole 'True Disbeliever' thing. It's a shame, but that's probably going to be the last Direophant I'll read and, in the past, it was one of the things I turned to when I read FT.

Again, I think the Direophant is actually a FTMB regular.

From this, I flicked through until my eye was caught by a glorious announcement: a new release of Sir Henry at Rawlinson's End! No longer must I be cursed to annoy friends who haven't seen it with monologues from this film. Any good special features? I checked to see. To find a review which from the start announced its author's strong dislike of Viv Stanshall and all his works. Fair enough, some people just have a strange sense of humour. Some people even like My Family. But I complain when the editors of my student newspaper have just handed something to a reviewer who just isn't got to get it, and I complain even more when I've paid money to be told this. I'm not the market for this review - I know I love the film. Someone like RC Samson isn't either. The intended reader is surely someone who doesn't know if they'll like Stanshall or not, and they'll get no sense of whether they would from this paragraph. Unless, that is, they know the tastes of RCS.

Again, I agree. The reviewer was biased from the start. So, as you asked about the Direophant: "why bother?"
 
jefflovestone said:
Again, I think the Direophant is actually a FTMB regular.
(steeples fingers) Really now?

Personally, I think the Hierophant made good points but perhaps phrased them badly (I would say that - much of what he said is stuff a few on here, myself included, have been saying for ages in one way or another.) Debunking has become a pejorative term for blanket dismissal of anything on no greater grounds than disagreement, whereas in fact it should merely mean the extraction of bunk prior to refinement of the essence that's left. Gold mining produces a lot of rubble and iron pyrites along with the rare and not always present gold: debunking should serve to remove the rubble at the outset, carefully extract the pyrites,and then examine the gold. Unfortunately, in the minds of many, it's become synonymous with skepticism. Skepticism doesn't even bother to dig in the first place, as it believes that gold doesn't exist. Presented with gold, they'll dub it pyrites (and no-one knows a rod of iron like Randi ;).)

I think the Hierophant said it because there are a lot of people who are still unaware that the discussion even exists. It needed saying - the way he said it was I agree a trifle unclear.
jefflovestone said:
Lanark_And_Rima said:
From this, I flicked through until my eye was caught by a glorious announcement: a new release of Sir Henry at Rawlinson's End ...a review which from the start announced its author's strong dislike of Viv Stanshall and all his works. The intended reader is surely someone who doesn't know if they'll like Stanshall or not, and they'll get no sense of whether they would from this paragraph. Unless, that is, they know the tastes of RCS.

Again, I agree. The reviewer was biased from the start. So, as you asked about the Direophant: "why bother?"
Well, believe it or not I'm a Sir Henry fan too (and was ecstatic at the news of the DVD release), and was somewhat amazed at the review: not that RC Samson doesn't like Viv, because he isn't to all tastes and that's cool, but that it's so.. well, vindictive almost. Which set me to wondering about the other reviews in FTs passim: on this one we can triangulate, because a lot of us will have seen it, but how many other films have been passed over by how many readers based solely on a "this is rubbish, don't bother" review, when it's entirely possible they were undiscovered gems?
 
stuneville said:
...

Personally, I think the Hierophant made good points but perhaps phrased them badly ...
But, isn't that the point? Best part of 3/4's of a page to spout near incoherent bile, the few points worth making lost in a malodorous stomach load of skeptical machismo and ideological muscle flexing.

And as for the twerpish RC Samson, what a pity. Could the Hierophant, the Apprentice and their monkey all, perhaps, be related?

The real Viv Stanshall:
http://www.vivarchive.org.uk/articles/playscript.htm
 
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