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U.S. Retains The Option Of A Nuclear Response

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They started it; they invaded our smelly little rock!
'Axis of Evil'...the whole species is evil, for God's sake.
 
Inverurie Jones said:
They started it; they invaded our smelly little rock!
'Axis of Evil'...the whole species is evil, for God's sake.
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giggle












Just teasing, Jones. But, I must say the glare of your righteousness is hurting my eyes.



;)

Thank God y'all slaughter people for the right reasons. Welcome to the team.
 
We only slaughtered them until they got off our bloody rock, then we stopped. We never even considered nuking anyone.
 
Now, now. I'm sure the UK knew exactly where the button was during those unpleasant cold war years. I mean, what was NATO for than to repel a possible Soviet invasion? Nukes were an integral part of that deterrent.
 
I dont understand why we needed nukes at all, the US had so many parked in the UK, I'm sure we could have borrowed some of theirs if needed!:)
 
So was shooting Soviet traffic police. The Cold War was why we had nukes. It's over. Now they are just a drain on the resources of an already desperately underfunded MoD. What deterrent are nuclear weapons to muslim extremists who see them as a shortcut to paradise or a dictator who doesn't care if his own people live or die?
 
Minor Drag said:
Your points are well made and taken, Dashwood.

However, the above quote is simply not true. UNSCOM (sp?) found tons of chemical weapon material (and destroyed it) in the 90s.

If you're saying that none have been found lately and then jump to the conclusion that there might not be any to find, that's naive.
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So, tons of chemical weapon materials were found and destroyed in the 90s and lately they've been having trouble finding any more... Still, it's hardly a cause to go to war.

And when was the last time Iraq used a 'weapon of mass destruction' ? You'd have to go back to the gassing of the Kurds in the 1980s. A disgusting act of cruelty and one which bothered the West so much, we did nothing about it.
 
Good points, IJ.

Dashwood: yes, "national interest" is a bitch. Few countries have escaped the compromise inherent in "saving" some and letting others rot. Especially big, rich ones like mine. It's almost like people are (or should be) more scared of the US "wanting to help" than when our ire is raised...
 
Shadow said:
Wandering off-thread is certainly a time-honored tradition here[/b][1] - nearly as venerated as Bush-bashing or USA-ripping - but I have to say it is funny how so MANY on this thread are determined to have the "straw man"[2] argument they WANT, instead of the argument before them.

AGAIN... I believe the genesis of this thread was a Bush comment suggesting that if the USA / Western forces / citizens were subjected to chem/bio/nuke attack, a nuclear response was NOT off the table. Some seemed to find this simply horrifynig, and on this board quite a few seem unable to distinguish between this (we refuse to say we will NOT respond with nuclear weapons) and either a "first strike" proclamation or actual INTENT to use nuclear weapons. Bush is simply setting up the strongest possible deterrent. It may or may not work. But it is really that simple.[3]

Not nearly as fun for the Bush bashers as the usual talk of "puppet masters", oil conspiracies, Left-wing flack Michael Moore, and the like..so that is what we get. And lots of it. [4]

Also... I love the 9-11 logic used by many... here and elsewhere.... "If the USA does X, Y, or Z, it will be seen as justifying FURTHER terror attacks"[5]. What a recipe for paralysis! I have news for you... there is a big chunk of the Islamic world that NEEDS no additional justification. The mere existence of a free, open, Judeo-Christian-influenced West is affront ENOUGH![6] It is akin to cowering in your house, hoping you don't "offend" the criminals on your street, lest they violate you again. Sad.[7]
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[1] Most threads evolve into related topics, rather than wander off.

[2]:rolleyes: Now where have I heard that one before? I've yet to see a genuine use of a Straw Man Arguement on this forum. In most cases the so called "Straw Man" was just an element of an argument that the person making the claim couldn't counter.

[3]Yes and what if the Terrorists call his bluff?

[4]This is a Fortean message board, Shadow, of course we're more interested in Conspiricy Theories and the motivations of the Powers That Be. If you don't like it then, quite frankly I don't understand what you're you doing here.

If you don't like the so called 'AntiAmerican' tone of many of the posters then go join a forum which isn't dominated and run from the UK. We're just exercising our Free Speech, remember that? Or does that just apply to the topics you want discussed and the opinions you agree with?

As for Micahel Moore, yes he's left wing. He believes that civilians shooting each other is a bad thing, big business treating individuals like sh!t is wrong and that questioning your leaders is a corner stone of Democracy. If you disagree with him then you should ask yourself why; come up with decent arguements against him and share them with the rest of us. Personally I find him quite convincing.

[5]Actually I said that they'd be used to justify all attacks, including the previous ones: "Look America really is the Great Satan! We were right all along!". I think the BS people come up with to justify their questionable actions is a Fortean Phenomina in and of itself.

[6] Downloaded from the Antimatter Universe:
"I have news for you... there is a big chunk of the Judeo-Christian world that NEEDS no additional justification. The mere existence of a free, open, Islam-influenced East is affront ENOUGH! " The above could also read Aryan/Jewish or White/Black.

Furthermore (talking about BS used to justify questionable activities) the VAST MAJORITY of Muslims are pacifists, much like the early Christians. I have heard arguments to the effect that the likes of UBL aren't Muslims but infidels trying to discredit Islam, their followers misguided youngsters led astray.

[7]No, what the Bush Administration is currently doing is equivilent to going up to the local shop keeper (who once and still may deal drugs) and going "I've told the law that you have drugs in your shop and they've come round to search for them. If you do then I'll beat you and your family up and run your shop. Even if you don't then I'll do it anyway and if you try to stop me I'll shoot you."
 
hope i'm not wandering too much off thread...

1) if wmd are used as a deterrent,surely it should be iraq saying to the US"look if you declare war or invade us we will use wmd against you" but this would then be a declaration of having wmd thus giving the US a reason to go in in the first place.

2)if any country unilaterally declares war on another country to further it's own interests,then that country should be prepared to face attacks.War is a conflict and any country attacked would be within it's rights to defend itself.What if for instance the US attacks Iraq against the will of the UN,and several retaliatory attacks on the scale of 9/11 were to occur against the US?
Or is war now supposed to be a corporate demonstration for the big defense contractors?

3)i know this may be a ridiculous idea but shouldn't every last opportunity be given to find a peaceful solution to any given situation?On the news today we here of troop deployments,Turkey getting ready to storm in against the kurds,everything just seems to be concentrated on military action.This is why when people such as GW are spoken of as great world leaders you have to laugh(or more likely cry).
 
Niles Calder said:
If you don't like it then, quite frankly I don't understand what you're you doing here.
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The "love it or leave it" mantra is a generally despised aspect of Americana; apparently it's moderator approved here!

:rolleyes: I mean :)
 
don't mean a thing to me

the libs can rant and rave all they want ( and this american will stay and watch and participate) the brits and american troops and military will bomb the crap out of Iraq "soon" in any case and the Brits and yanks will nuke who ever they chose to nuke (that deserves to be nuked) and I will suport my country in what ever they decide (cause you should always go with the winners or get smushed) cause we are Big , mean and bad --and we got our selves some big 'ol bommbs just a waitinng to use. Im done..merry christmas!! shadow !! and all you right wing republicans!! we will have another 4 years in the white house yeah!! cause Gore knowns hes a looooser!! and merry christmas Tony Blair thanks for your suport!!
 
Minor Drag said:
The "love it or leave it" mantra is a generally despised aspect of Americana; apparently it's moderator approved here!

:rolleyes: I mean :)
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MD: What I meant was "What is someone who objects to people discussing Conspiracy Theories doing in a Fortean Forum?" not "Either you let us discuss Conspiracy Theories or we hurt you." (which is what the "Love it or Leave it" phrase beloved of American Extremists is usually used to mean). But you knew that anyway, you old rogue. :rolleyes:

I mean if it was you; if it was you you'd be sitting there going "Well shrub might be a weird fuck but he's our weird fuck and the only president we currently have so we might as well sit tight and hope for the best because nothing we say or do here will make a blind bit of difference". That's why I like you. :D
 
Re: don't mean a thing to me

ruffready said:
the libs can rant and rave all they want ( and this american will stay and watch and participate) the brits and american troops and military will bomb the crap out of Iraq "soon" in any case and the Brits and yanks will nuke who ever they chose to nuke (that deserves to be nuked) and I will suport my country in what ever they decide (cause you should always go with the winners or get smushed) cause we are Big , mean and bad --and we got our selves some big 'ol bommbs just a waitinng to use. Im done..merry christmas!! shadow !! and all you right wing republicans!! we will have another 4 years in the white house yeah!! cause Gore knowns hes a looooser!! and merry christmas Tony Blair thanks for your suport!!
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HOLY SHIT!

Speaking of old rogues; an American using sarcasm and irony! :D That's the best Christmas present I've had in a long time! Thanks Ruff. :)
 
Niles Calder said:
I mean if it was you; if it was you you'd be sitting there going "Well shrub might be a weird fuck but he's our weird fuck and the only president we currently have so we might as well sit tight and hope for the best because nothing we say or do here will make a blind bit of difference". That's why I like you. :D
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Niles, I honestly can't tell if actually do like me, but that mystery is what I like about you. :D

TBH, I really wish Shrub was your weird fuck, instead of just your problem. I mean our problem. In all honesty, I have nothing nice to say about the man. I do know that he's not as stupid as he looks. And sounds. Seriously. Also, if y'all have heard the latest polls, Americans (as in We The People--still hangin' in there) are resolutely against unilateral action. Moreover, polls show that Americans think that, although Iraq posseses WMD, need to see irrefutable proof from the gov't before any kind of offensive takes place.

As for nukes: as I've said before, if we use 'em (unless only in the most dire of circumstances [read: nuke attack stateside and then only retaliation against an identifiable state]), I believe there will be a revolution in the streets. I also believe, if that happens, my great nation will finally become the pariah a lot of people already think it is.

Remember, those Enlightenment ideals you espouse are what this country is founded upon, the latest folly notwithstanding.

Lastly, I think ruff "doth protest too much." How much are you paying him to be a mole? ;)*











*Disclaimer: Minor Drag is not, nor has he ever, nor does he ever intend to, speculate on the identity of "ruffready," a "right-winger" from "florida" or any other member of this MB. Furthermore, when Minor Drag is characterized as a "he" it in no way should be construed as a gender-specific signifier. Whether or not "Niles Calder" likes Minor Drag is not a material fact to this thread and should be stricken from the minds of those reading it. Any amount(s) actually paid to "ruffready" are likewise immaterial, as is the very mention of any possible payoff. Sorry.
 
well , Niles..I guess the gigs up!! he knows!!

well then...ALL TOGETHER NOW!!!!Give Peace a Chance (Beatles)

C
Everbodys talking about Bagism, Shagism, Dragism, Madism, Ragism, Tagism
This-ism, That-ism, Isn't it the most?

C G C
All we are saying is give peace a chance
C G C
All we are saying is give peace a chance
C G C
All we are saying is give peace a chance

C
Everbodys talkin about Ministers, Sinisters, Banisters, Canisters, Bishops
and Fishops, Rabbits and popeyes, Bye-bye Bye-byes

C G C
All we are saying is give peace a chance
C G C
All we are saying is give peace a chance

C
Let me tell you now, Everybodys talking about Revolution, Evolution,
Mastication, Flagellation, Regulations, Integregations,
Meditation, Unitied Nations, Congratulations

C G C

All we are saying is give peace a chance

C G C

All we are saying is give peace a chance

C
Ok lets stick to it, Everybodys talkink about John and Yoko, Timmy Leary
Rosemary, Tommy Smothers, Bobby Dylan, Tommy Cooper, Derek Taylor
Norman Mailer, Alan Ginsberg, Hare Krishna,Hare Hare Krishna

C G C
All we are saying is give peace a chance
C G C
All we are saying is give peace a chance
C G C
All we are saying is give peace a chance
C G C
All we are saying is give peace a chance




--
 
Make Love not War dudes! (A sentiment 'Amanda' and I intend to act upon as soon as I'm finished moderating)
 
Wow. Don't let us detain you, tiger!

Uh oh, here come the Off Thread Police. Run for it!
 
Niles Calder said:
Make Love not War dudes! (A sentiment 'Amanda' and I intend to act upon as soon as I'm finished moderating)
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TMI, Niles.

Anyway, it's all a bunch of tree-hugging hippie crap.

:laughing: ;)

'Amanda'
 
'Amanda' said:
TMI, Niles.

Anyway, it's all a bunch of tree-hugging hippie crap.

:laughing: ;)

'Amanda'
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Yes Hunny Bunny

Of course Hunny Bunny

I'll be over to change your opinion in a moment Hunny Bunny

:devil:
 
hey synth..thats great!!! ha ha ha

Dana Klugh
Homemaker

"It's about time we had a president who's not afraid to step up to the plate and make the biggest mistake in the history of world civilization."
:D
 
he'll never use nukes because that would be defeating himself. who would want radioactive oil?
 
I actually liked Larry the Gardener.

"it's like the 80 all over again..."
:rolleyes:
 
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