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Is This A Particular Badge Or Group?

Frideswide

Frideswide

Fortea Morgana :) PeteByrdie certificated Princess
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The title says it all really :) Help! Help! Help!
 

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Thank you both. I'd wondered about masonic - but that would still be a particular group or level or something wouldn't it?

This is really bugging me :rollingw:
 
Yithian said:
Is that the Castle of Gibraltar?

As seen inn the Essex Regiment cap badge and many other places.

It very often has a key hanging beneath it.

Edit: not convinced. Find a Masonic lodge based in a castle!
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It looks a bit like it but the position of the door and windows are different.

I had a look for "castle triple towered or" but didn't find anything quite like it.

Are there any clues at all about where it came from @Frideswide ?
 
Min Bannister said:
Are there any clues at all about where it came from @Frideswide ?
Click to expand...

it's in a Brooches For Sale group I belong to :) (Life in the fast lane in this household I assure you!) but there aren't further details. If it sells I might be able to ask for background info, but at the moment anything will look like I intend to buy it.
 
It's for the more interesting of this forum, so that we may recognise each other, and without all that silly secret handshake nonsense. @Tigerhawk and I have one, as do five others I could mention.....
 
So! Fired up my art package and cut out the castle and surrounding blue - no 'ribbon' or anything. Used the saved image with search engine and got some results that look quite similar either with a castle or with similar looking background and 'ribbon'.

I thought that the '19TH TILE BY RAMOS REJANO OF SEVILLE HERALDIC MOTIQUE WITH CASTLE' had a similar looking castle all be it has a yellow background.

Other badges / pins / tiles with similar imagery included such as sweet heart pins, navy 'boat' pins, town badges from the UK and, mainly, France.

To me, the 'ribbon' actually looks like a rope that suggests a naval connexion or like lots of tiny hammers in line and maybe something to do with builders or masons.

Hope you find out more and let us know.


badge.png
 
Frideswide said:
The title says it all really :) Help! Help! Help!
Click to expand...

So... cropping down the image thus, and starting on reverse searches

pin.jpg


Brought up a selection of images which when whittled down began to resemble Royal Navy ships's badges (similar to Army regimental badges)

No photo description available.


But, crucially, RN badges seem to all be surrounded by a rope pattern design (which makes sense). I then added into my search terms the castle motif.

The distinctive castle design with a centre tower higher than the outer seems to match the arms and badges of the Royal Burgh of Rothesay, and that of HMS Rothesay:

Heraldry: More Royal Burgh Heraldry



HMS Rothesay, Royal Navy Pin Badge | eBay


But the star, crescent and crown are absent in your pin/badge -although some street furniture in Rothesay does feature the castle without these.

Also in the running are the arms of the Royal Burgh of Kinghorn (triple tower castle with blue background, centre tower highest) and the badge of the Royal Anglian regiment of the British army (although this features a key). As mentioned upthread this badge also pictures the castle of Gibraltar.

013200002_900x.jpg


In fact Gibraltar castle crops up in regimental and naval insignia surprisingly often. I think your badge/brooch does indeed feature it!

If you are so inclined I have found out during my detecting tonight is that there is a specialised British Military Badge Forum at https://www.britishbadgeforum.com/forums/index.php where they may be able to apply their talents or help on your quest :)
 
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AnonyJ said:
But, crucially, RN badges seem to all be surrounded by a rope pattern design
Click to expand...

@AnonyJ - your logic is impeccable (and I had meant to comment upon this earlier).

Another close-but-not-quite match is this famous badge:
61waD5-DlFL._AC_UL1500_.jpg
Now: here is some partially-informed conjecture on my part....the rope surrounding naval ship badges can indeed either be round or sharply-straight.

I had always lazily-believed this to perhaps be linked in some way to the differences (now largely historic) in British naval officer uniform rank-braid, worn in gold thread near the cuff or on the shoulder.

This is presented in an increasing quantity of 'rings', such that eg a Commander wears three, and a Captain wears four: very similar to the derivative rank arrangements worn by the RAF, many other of the world's air forces, and also of course civil aviation.

But military nautical forces have varied their 'rank rings', to the extent that naval formations such as the old Royal Naval Volunteer Reserve was known as the "wavy navy", because it's braid (including importantly, the top "executive curl" which is a simple circular ring for regular Royal Navy and now the active Royal Naval Reserve) became replaced by various geometric rope-like shape combinations, for different hierarchies of non-regular/part-time military seafarers in the Commonwealth's navies.

Aha...I've had a possible Eureka moment: I shall post this, and return here when I can....

EDIT....hmm, yes, just as I suddenly remembered. The different rank-braid badges originally worn by 'Wrens' (or, more correctly, officers in the WRNS, W
omens' Royal Naval Service, and their Commonwealth fellow equivalents)...for their 'executive curl' or top-knot:
Screenshot_20230911_043203_Chrome.jpg


Which is therefore making me wonder: the badge could be to mark female military nautical Service on board something like HMCS or HMAS Edinburgh? (nb I have no idea if these ships ever existed under under Canadian or Australian flags) If so, it might be some form of military naval 'sweetheart' badge (a military-themed badge, sometimes created from multiple source elements on an unofficial basis, worn by associated Civilians and veterans, to mark Service or affiliation)
 
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The triple towered castle is a very common element in heraldry. If the badge has a heraldic reference then the fact of the three towers matters, as does the ground colour - but I'm not sure that window or door positioning and style has any significance at all (I think maybe not).

There's a page of examples here.

Fill yer boots.
 
Apropos of the suggestion the badge has Masonic connections, and the tentative ID of Gibraltar Castle, it's interesting to note that for a small enclave Gibraltar has a large following of Freemasonry http://royallodgeoffriendship.org/aboutus.php

It also might be worth contacting the various lodges to enquire about the provenance of the badge/brooch?
 
Spookdaddy said:
The triple towered castle is a very common element in heraldry. If the badge has a heraldic reference then the fact of the three towers matters, as does the ground colour - but I'm not sure that window or door positioning and style has any significance at all (I think maybe not).

There's a page of examples here.

Fill yer boots.
Click to expand...

If the badge does have any heraldic reference at all (and of course it may not - we may all just be trying to catch steam in a sieve) then the yellow/gold castle on a blue background appears to be most common in French family arms (as well as a few Spanish). Quite a few examples if you scroll through this page.
 
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