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These events make me think that it is a more complex phenomenon since scientists were very interested in investigating Geller's supposed abilities.
Among the 'scientists' that were particularly interested in investigating Geller's 'abilities' were Hal Puthoff and Russel Targ; Geller, a well-known fraud, completely bamboozled these two gentlemen.

Puthoff is, of course, closely associated with Travis Taylor in the infamous Invisible College which (among other things) supports the fiasco at Skinwalker Ranch. My advice; don't believe one word these people say, even if it is obvious that they believe it themselves. It is a cult.
 
This program line of thought can be debated, but it seems the guest technology people do come from reputable companies and businesses.

I doubt that these guest techs would hurt their company by not telling the truth.

Also Travis’ group seems to use the best equipment available.
 
When my daughter and I stayed at a hotel near Port Arthur there was a night time ghost tour.
We didn't go because it was cold and wet.
Next day the tour guide said that a man who had gone insisted that he was followed back by one of the ghosts so we were glad we didn't go, given that we had felt tapped on the shoulders in other parts of Tasmania.

Your story is very interesting. It is very appropriate to exemplify that these types of links with the spiritual or paraphysical world should not be taken lightly. Likewise, any type of explicit invocation or call to this type of entities should be avoided.
 
We could probably discuss the veracity and scientific rigor of some of the experiments carried out at Sinwalker Ranch. However, according to my investigations, the phenomena reported there not only by the inhabitants of the ranch, the researchers and even the Navajos of the nearby reservations, have been repeated in numerous places. For example, I have mentioned the region of Monte Uritorco, in Argentina. Most of the phenomena that occurred at the Skinwalker Ranch have been reported there. Even the native inhabitants of the place have orally transmitted similar episodes, including the appearance of strange creatures and skinwalkers, or animal-men.
 
This program line of thought can be debated, but it seems the guest technology people do come from reputable companies and businesses.

I doubt that these guest techs would hurt their company by not telling the truth.

Also Travis’ group seems to use the best equipment available.
Yes but no but as they say!

Look if the tests are set up with proper independent scientific rigor we can't complain, but from what I have seen this is not the case
 
The tests and equipment are good; but we never get to see the full results. If this were a scientific enterprise we would get all the data - instead we get none of it. Sometimes we get to see some data on their screens, but it never matches up with what they are saying (this may be innocent, since the pieces to camera are presumably filmed at a different time, but it is not helpful if you want to check the results).

The programme is purely for entertainment.
 
I should, perhaps, repost the data I presented in post #961 0f this thread. The more I think about it, the more I come to realise that the bamboozlement on this show is deliberate.
-------------------
Don't be fooled by this particular graphic from the Skinwalker show;
img_1831-jpeg.60371

What they have done here is added a computer generated image to the LiDAR result, showing a graphical representation of a wormhole. It is not a real wormhole, just a simulation.
In fact it is a particular type of graphical representation known as an 'embedding diagram', which shows the way a wormhole would look if you
a/ reduce the three-dimensional space to a flat plane
and
b/ add an extra fourth dimension to represent space-time curvature.

An 'embedding diagram' does not represent what an ordinary three-dimensional observer would see.
Here's one I made earlier.
wormhole-png.60413

The Skinwalker crew really have abandoned real science to favour entertainment.
--------------
 
The problem is, they have to keep churning stuff out, in order to sell it and advertising space, it's a formula we are seeing more of (the oak island one springs to mind) to get a resolution or a definitive verdict would be to kill the golden goose
 
Also published in Edge Science Nº50, June 2022

The Pentagon's Secret UFO
Program, the Hitchhiker Effect,
and Models of Contagion

Previous Evidence of Transmissibility

In 1973, when noted illusionist and psychokinetic practitioner
Uri Geller was undergoing a series of tests of his psychic abilities
at the prestigious Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory
(LLNL), a series of bizarre events began to unfold both in the
lab itself and at the homes of the scientists who were conducting
the studies. As with Skinwalker Ranch visitors, many of
the researchers involved had the highest level of security clearances,
including Special Access Program (SAP) clearances that
necessitated polygraph testing as well as frequent personality
evaluations.
Author Jim Schnabel, in his engaging history of American
psychic spies (Schnabel, 1997), recounts the bizarre series of
events that unfolded at the lab when scientists began to “measure”
Uri Geller’s alleged psychic abilities. Writes Schnabel:
“Peter Crane and some of the others in the Livermore group
quickly found themselves involved in more strangeness than
they could handle. In the days and weeks that followed, they
began to feel that they were collectively possessed by some kind
of tormenting, teasing, hallucination-inducing spirit. They all
would be in a laboratory together, setting up some experiment,
or one of the fellows and his wife and children would be at
home, just sitting around, when suddenly there in the middle
of the room would be a weird, hovering, almost comically stereotypical
image of a flying saucer… On the other hand, the
flying saucer wasn’t the only form the Livermore visions took.
There were sometimes animals—fantastic animals from the
ecstatic lore of shamans—such as the large raven-like birds that
were seen traipsing through the yards of several members of
the group. One of them appeared briefly to a physicist named
Mike Russo and his terrified wife. The two were lying around
one morning when suddenly there was this giant bird staring
at them from the foot of their bed. After a few weeks of this,
Russo and some of the others began seriously to wonder if they
were losing their sanity.” Other scientists and their families saw
orbs and black shadowy forms in their homes.
There are some interesting overlaps between the events
at Lawrence Livermore in 1973 and those that occurred at
the Axelrod’s residence and at the homes of other Skinwalker
Ranch visitors some 37 years later.

These events make me think that it is a more complex phenomenon since scientists were very interested in investigating Geller's supposed abilities. Apparently there is some type of link that causes the entire "package of phenomena, let's call them paranormal" to move with the person who captured them due to their vibrational affinity.
I have to say that ever since I got interested in Time Slips I have had an increasing number of glitches and at least two likely time slips myself. Once you get interested in phenomena, they start to take an interest in you. There are obviously different factors involved in individual cases, though. The moral has to be that if you don't want to get these experiences, then don't get too active in your studies.
 
Among the 'scientists' that were particularly interested in investigating Geller's 'abilities' were Hal Puthoff and Russel Targ; Geller, a well-known fraud, completely bamboozled these two gentlemen.

Puthoff is, of course, closely associated with Travis Taylor in the infamous Invisible College which (among other things) supports the fiasco at Skinwalker Ranch. My advice; don't believe one word these people say, even if it is obvious that they believe it themselves. It is a cult.
I think your attitude towards such phenomena is so obviously negative that even when Geller did produce effects under controlled conditions you wouldn't accept it. Describing Geller as "a well known fraud" is over the top. I think he does have genuine abilities, but likely had to supplement his stage act with some fakery on occasions when he couldn't use them to order.
 
I have to say that ever since I got interested in Time Slips I have had an increasing number of glitches and at least two likely time slips myself. Once you get interested in phenomena, they start to take an interest in you. There are obviously different factors involved in individual cases, though. The moral has to be that if you don't want to get these experiences, then don't get too active in your studies.
Or is it because you are focused of them like the coin experiment in Robert Anton Wilsons wonderful book Prometheus Rising, if you tell yourself you are going to find small coins your mind will focus on finding small coins and most of the time it operates in the background with you hardly noticing it, but coins you will find

Now that begs the question, are strange happenings happening all around us without us even noticing them ? A sceptic may never experience a haunting (although some do I know but for example) where as someone who is focused on it will see spooks around every corner (and many of them will be imagined spooks) but again to quote from Prometheus Rising," what the thinker thinks the prover proves"
 
Or is it because you are focused of them like the coin experiment in Robert Anton Wilsons wonderful book Prometheus Rising, if you tell yourself you are going to find small coins your mind will focus on finding small coins and most of the time it operates in the background with you hardly noticing it, but coins you will find

Now that begs the question, are strange happenings happening all around us without us even noticing them ? A sceptic may never experience a haunting (although some do I know but for example) where as someone who is focused on it will see spooks around every corner (and many of them will be imagined spooks) but again to quote from Prometheus Rising," what the thinker thinks the prover proves"
That's a good point. I have personally observed very strange things happen right in front of ordinary people and some of them don't even appear to notice. The sceptical mind knows how to protect itself. At the other extreme you have the "true believers" who will get excited over totally minor things. We have to aim at objectivity always. Unfortunately this is something that usually isn't taught in the home or the school.
 
Describing Geller as "a well known fraud" is over the top. I think he does have genuine abilities, but likely had to supplement his stage act with some fakery on occasions when he couldn't use them to order.
So you admit he is a fraud, then? Pity that Puthoff didn't realise this.
 
So you admit he is a fraud, then? Pity that Puthoff didn't realise this.
I think that Targ and Puthoff were well aware of the fact that Geller had sleight of hand capabilities, and they obviously used controls to deal with them. But some of the effects that Geller could achieve were beyond any kind of control! Moreover, Targ himself had been an expert conjurer when younger and was well aware of all the possible tricks that Geller might try. They visited Uri at his home and initially he did try to dominate the proceedings but they managed to get him to agree to some controls. In one very interesting experiment they surprised him by producing a new pack of cards which he shuffled rather awkwardly before dropping them onto the table. They appeared to partially penetrate the table, and five cards had large pieces (about 25%) missing. Targ did some investigating and found that it was possible, although very rare, for the production line at the card factory to slice a card twice in error. They asked many professional conjurers if they had ever experienced such a thing and none had. So, to quote him, "we consider this the most likely solution. But it's still a very improbable occurrence for those cards to travel through time and space to find themselves in Uri's hands at just the moment he needed them." As Targ and Puthoff left Uri's house they found that a street sign outside had become twisted so much that it was now only 4 feet tall. Only heavy machinery could have been used to create such a bizarre effect and they had heard nothing. As everyone knows, Geller continued to produce strange happenings even in laboratory conditions, e.g. changing the weight of a one-gram weight inside a sealed jar, which he did by producing one-gram pulses of a fifth of a second. I won't go into more details but he certainly demonstrated telepathy and other more conventional psi talents. He could identify small objects hidden from him and his telepathic skills were very good. If you haven't read Targ and Puthoff's book Mind-Reach, get a copy and decide then.
 
Targ and Puthoff's 'precautions' were laughable.
David Marks replicated Geller's perception of a drawing through a sealed envelope. Several other non-psychic subjects tried the same experiment, with the same results as Geller, and making the same mistakes. This indicated that Geller could see the outline through the envelope, like all the other subjects; but did he admit this? No, he did not; he continued to pretend to be psychic. This is the mark of an opportunistic fraud, who fooled Targ and Puthoff, but failed to impress Marks.

marks.png

https://cdn.centerforinquiry.org/wp-content/uploads/sites/29/1977/04/22165508/p11.pdf

Randi could do everything Geller could do, and more; Geller never accepted Randi's challenge, of course. I see no evidence that Geller was ever willing to point out the shortcomings of an experiment, although he would take advantage of them; the exact opposite of Randi, who would show exactly what the fraudulent psychics were doing.
 
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Seems not terribly convincing. Surely a properly controlled experiment should have used envelopes that would be completely opaque? Then if Geller and the controls all performed at a chance level you would have been able to show that (at least in this specific case) Geller had no special abilities. I also note you didn't respond to the detailed account that I painstakingly wrote out for you.
 
The account of a mangled sign and faulty playing cards? Neither of those have anything to do with Geller's supposed psychic abilities; they are just weird stuff that happened at random. It's not as if Geller even predicted that they would happen in advance.

According to Paul Kurtz, the conditions of Targ and Puthoff's experiments were chaotic; at one point Geller could see the test images by peeking through a hole, which Targ and Puthoff eventually plugged with cotton wool.
"The sealed room in which Uri was placed had an aperture from which he could have peeked out, and his confederate Shipi was in and about the laboratory and could have conveyed signals to him. The same was true in another test of clairvoyance, where Geller passed twice but surprisingly guessed eight out of ten times the top face of a die that was placed in a closed metal box. The probability of this happening by chance alone was, we are told, one in a million. Critics maintained that the protocol of this experiment was, again, poorly designed, that Geller could have peeked into the box, and that dozens of other tests from which there were no positive results were not reported."
 
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Since Geller was ready and willing to use trickery in his 'psychic' activities, that makes it impossible to do useful science with him as the subject. A scientist who used such trickery would be roundly repudiated. Nothing I've read about Puthoff's theories and experiments give me any confidence in his discrimination between fact and fantasy; not the Geller experiments, not the remote viewing garbage, not the nonsense about ZPE and inertia, not the nonsense about UAPs/UFOs, and especially not the Skinwalker stuff.

Since Bigelow sold the ranch, Puthoff's influence at SWR may have declined, but I'm sure he still has some influence on the program, however indirect.
Puthoff next started a new venture with his friend, hotel billionaire Robert Bigelow, who was funding a guy named Budd Hopkins to do alien abduction research, along with his girlfriend Leslie Kean. Bigelow, Puthoff, Vallee, and others started Skinwalker Ranch in Utah, and with their influence, got the FAA to forward all pilots' UFO reports to them.
They brought in Bigelow's friend, US Senator Harry Reid. Reid used his influence to secure $22 million in Pentagon funding, which was given to Bigelow's Skinwalker Ranch, and was mostly spent having Puthoff write a bunch of weird reports detailing his UFO beliefs and possible designs for science fiction spacecraft systems.
When that money ran out, Bigelow used his own money to hire fellow UFOlogist Lue Elizondo. They called themselves AATIP and represented it to the press as a continuation of the defunct Pentagon programs. Its purpose was to take three videos provided by Chris Mellon, and break their existence to the world in a New York Times article specially crafted by Leslie Kean. And the rest is history.
Where are they now? Bigelow, Kean, and Puthoff have started a new consciousness institute to study life after death.
https://infactvideo.com.skeptoid.com/episode/04/13/
 
Once you get interested in phenomena, they start to take an interest in you.
I have found that to be very true, more than once. I'll give, as an example, something that happened to me after I began to take a serious interest in UFOs. Like many other people, I decided that if I put some effort into finding out what was really going on, I'd learn enough to form a useful opinion. (Of course, that seems like a silly notion to me now.) I had had a casual interest in all things weird and wonderful, UFOs among them, but had never really done any sort of systematic study of the various phenomena reported by UFO witnesses. I knew the reports varied a lot, but had some definite and obvious patterns. I had seen some weird things myself, but they mainly amounted to odd lights in the sky. Some were very odd indeed, and hard to rationalize as anything one would consider "normal", but I never saw spaceships or aliens.

Being a voracious reader, my approach was pretty much to just read everything I could find on the subject that looked reasonably credible, then evaluate what I read based on my experience with how the world works and what other things I had read and heard. I lived about a mile from the Topeka Public Library, which helped a lot. It quickly became obvious that there was a ton of crap to be found in the literature, and the well reasoned and well written stuff was hard to judge, if for no other reason than it was pretty far out. If I was looking for "rules" governing the behavior of the various phenomena, I wasn't finding any.

After several months and many, many books and magazines having been devoured and considered, I began having anomalous experiences myself. It started as far too many weird lights at night, in places where there should not be lights and doing things that airplanes and helicopters don't do. Then there was some poltergeist-type stuff; odd noises and such. I wasn't just noticing things that I hadn't noticed before. I certainly wasn't looking for weird stuff. My "research" was along the lines of reading about the experiences and the investigations of others. At first, I did the typical human thing and tried to rationalize the weird shit, but it got harder and harder to ignore. Then the "amber globe" began stalking me. At least, that's what it seemed like.

Late one night, I was driving along US Highway 24, on my way home. It was a dark nigh. There was little traffic on the road. I noticed an amber colored light directly behind me on the highway. I took it, at first, as a railroad signal on the tracks that the highway closely parallels on that stretch. One would occasionally see them, but they were never in view for long because of all the utility poles, vegetation, and terrain between the road and the signals. This was directly behind me on the highway, and it was pacing me about a quarter mile back. I slowed down to 20 mph or so, and it kept its distance. Finally, I pulled over and stopped to see what might pass me on the road. I don't recall for sure, but I think it disappeared. After I got underway again, it was back. It followed me until I came to the next little town, and I didn't see it any more that night.

I think it was about a week later, when I awoke at 2:00 am or something, with the bathroom lit up in orange light. I lived alone, in a small apartment, and the bathroom was just off the bedroom. I was too chicken to go see what was going on. I just wanted the nonsense to stop. After the light left and a few noises started up, I got up and went to the living room and sat in my recliner. I was not in a good mood. The weirdness was mostly annoying because it seemed so pointless and absurd. I was considering what approach I might take to petitioning whatever agency was responsible to leave me the hell alone, when it occurred to me that what it reminded me of was my own juvenile harassment of the family cat years prior. The cat was fun to tease, and I enjoyed watching its overwrought reactions, at least for a while. Eventually, I figured out I was being a jerk, and stopped teasing the poor creature. From that moment of that realization on, the weirdness stopped. I never experienced any of it again.

I kept up my inquiries, and eventually had a real sighting of something, definitely something, but all the weird little lights and half assed poltergeist stuff stayed away.
 
I have to say that ever since I got interested in Time Slips I have had an increasing number of glitches and at least two likely time slips myself. Once you get interested in phenomena, they start to take an interest in you. There are obviously different factors involved in individual cases, though. The moral has to be that if you don't want to get these experiences, then don't get too active in your studies.
I believe that in most of the events that happen in our reality there is a bidirectional component between phenomenon and protagonist. With which I propose that each episode is UNIQUE and UNREPEATABLE. As a matter of affinity, if one has an interest in certain phenomena, one will probably have greater possibilities of being an actor in it. In cases of contact with entities, affinity is expressed as a form of calling towards them, so the probability that they will appear in our reality would be greater.
 
I have found that to be very true, more than once. I'll give, as an example, something that happened to me after I began to take a serious interest in UFOs. Like many other people, I decided that if I put some effort into finding out what was really going on, I'd learn enough to form a useful opinion. (Of course, that seems like a silly notion to me now.) I had had a casual interest in all things weird and wonderful, UFOs among them, but had never really done any sort of systematic study of the various phenomena reported by UFO witnesses. I knew the reports varied a lot, but had some definite and obvious patterns. I had seen some weird things myself, but they mainly amounted to odd lights in the sky. Some were very odd indeed, and hard to rationalize as anything one would consider "normal", but I never saw spaceships or aliens.

Being a voracious reader, my approach was pretty much to just read everything I could find on the subject that looked reasonably credible, then evaluate what I read based on my experience with how the world works and what other things I had read and heard. I lived about a mile from the Topeka Public Library, which helped a lot. It quickly became obvious that there was a ton of crap to be found in the literature, and the well reasoned and well written stuff was hard to judge, if for no other reason than it was pretty far out. If I was looking for "rules" governing the behavior of the various phenomena, I wasn't finding any.

After several months and many, many books and magazines having been devoured and considered, I began having anomalous experiences myself. It started as far too many weird lights at night, in places where there should not be lights and doing things that airplanes and helicopters don't do. Then there was some poltergeist-type stuff; odd noises and such. I wasn't just noticing things that I hadn't noticed before. I certainly wasn't looking for weird stuff. My "research" was along the lines of reading about the experiences and the investigations of others. At first, I did the typical human thing and tried to rationalize the weird shit, but it got harder and harder to ignore. Then the "amber globe" began stalking me. At least, that's what it seemed like.

Late one night, I was driving along US Highway 24, on my way home. It was a dark nigh. There was little traffic on the road. I noticed an amber colored light directly behind me on the highway. I took it, at first, as a railroad signal on the tracks that the highway closely parallels on that stretch. One would occasionally see them, but they were never in view for long because of all the utility poles, vegetation, and terrain between the road and the signals. This was directly behind me on the highway, and it was pacing me about a quarter mile back. I slowed down to 20 mph or so, and it kept its distance. Finally, I pulled over and stopped to see what might pass me on the road. I don't recall for sure, but I think it disappeared. After I got underway again, it was back. It followed me until I came to the next little town, and I didn't see it any more that night.

I think it was about a week later, when I awoke at 2:00 am or something, with the bathroom lit up in orange light. I lived alone, in a small apartment, and the bathroom was just off the bedroom. I was too chicken to go see what was going on. I just wanted the nonsense to stop. After the light left and a few noises started up, I got up and went to the living room and sat in my recliner. I was not in a good mood. The weirdness was mostly annoying because it seemed so pointless and absurd. I was considering what approach I might take to petitioning whatever agency was responsible to leave me the hell alone, when it occurred to me that what it reminded me of was my own juvenile harassment of the family cat years prior. The cat was fun to tease, and I enjoyed watching its overwrought reactions, at least for a while. Eventually, I figured out I was being a jerk, and stopped teasing the poor creature. From that moment of that realization on, the weirdness stopped. I never experienced any of it again.

I kept up my inquiries, and eventually had a real sighting of something, definitely something, but all the weird little lights and half assed poltergeist stuff stayed away.
That is another aspect of the other reality, if you want to call it that. Once you start getting involved it's already too late. I started getting involved in UFOs in my teens, and that led to a couple of odd experiences (not seeing UFOs but indirectly connected). Then when I started studying Sufism I came across the quote (from memory): "It is better if most men avoided higher studies completely because when you do you are at the mercy of the supreme force." By then, of course, it was already too late!
 
Since Geller was ready and willing to use trickery in his 'psychic' activities, that makes it impossible to do useful science with him as the subject. A scientist who used such trickery would be roundly repudiated. Nothing I've read about Puthoff's theories and experiments give me any confidence in his discrimination between fact and fantasy; not the Geller experiments, not the remote viewing garbage, not the nonsense about ZPE and inertia, not the nonsense about UAPs/UFOs, and especially not the Skinwalker stuff.

Since Bigelow sold the ranch, Puthoff's influence at SWR may have declined, but I'm sure he still has some influence on the program, however indirect.

https://infactvideo.com.skeptoid.com/episode/04/13/
The remote viewing garbage? You would have have to be totally unaware of the evidence to say that. But if you rely on "sceptical debunking" sites to get info you are bound to get a distorted picture.
 
I am confident that remote viewing is complete garbage, and also confident that nothing Puthoff has ever proposed in this regardwill ever result in usable or useful science or technology.

I am completely aware of the evidence, and the way Puthoff and Targ failed to remove clues to the nature of the images used in test runs, thereby skewing the results. The vague and subjective nature of this alleged ability make the data received completely unusable, even assuming there is any data transferred at all (which there almost certainly isn't). The CIA has abandoned this process as useless,
https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP96-00791R000200180005-5.pdf
which is presumably why Puthoff is now looking into life-after-death studies rather than inertia or RV. I have every confidence that he will fail there, too.
 
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I am confident that remote viewing is complete garbage, and also confident that nothing Puthoff has ever proposed in this regardwill ever result in usable or useful science or technology.

I am completely aware of the evidence, and the way Puthoff and Targ failed to remove clues to the nature of the images used in test runs, thereby skewing the results. The vague and subjective nature of this alleged ability make the data received completely unusable, even assuming there is any data transferred at all (which there almost certainly isn't). The CIA has abandoned this process as useless,
https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/docs/CIA-RDP96-00791R000200180005-5.pdf
which is presumably why Puthoff is now looking into life-after-death studies rather than inertia or RV. I have every confidence that he will fail there, too.
You are obviously unaware of research into RV since Puthoff and Targ's pioneering studies. Not only is it effective but many of the client agencies using it considered it extremely valuable. Good survey here:

https://psi-encyclopedia.spr.ac.uk/search/node/remote viewing

From my viewpoint the problem is that it is clear from the early documents released by the CIA that none of the researchers nor their remote viewers had the slightest background knowledge on the use (or in this case, misuse) of such capabilities. Using such abilities as weapons in the Cold War would definitely not be a suitable use for such capacities and it is obvious that nobody ever questioned the morality of the whole operation.
 
I really like the Skinwalker Ranch program with Travis Taylor, but in this coming season five, I really hope the gang does attack the mysterious mesa.

Why did Bigelow blow up the face of the mesa to begin with unless he wanted to trap something like the “ Kraken “.

Release the Kraken—-1981 move Clash of the Titans
 
Taylor will never use real scientific methods to discover the truth, or employ independent, properly skeptical scientists, or release the data he has supposedly accumulated, while he relies on the income from this entertainment show. It is the Oak Island fiasco all over again.
 
The problem is, they have to keep churning stuff out, in order to sell it and advertising space, it's a formula we are seeing more of (the oak island one springs to mind) to get a resolution or a definitive verdict would be to kill the golden goose
If they were to find something definitive and mysterious, whether aliens or wormholes or whatever, the US government would step in with the big $. They'd have giant dollar federal contracts.
 
But they won't find anything definitive and mysterious, so this TV programme is the only option.
 
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That is another aspect of the other reality, if you want to call it that. Once you start getting involved it's already too late. I started getting involved in UFOs in my teens, and that led to a couple of odd experiences (not seeing UFOs but indirectly connected). Then when I started studying Sufism I came across the quote (from memory): "It is better if most men avoided higher studies completely because when you do you are at the mercy of the supreme force." By then, of course, it was already too late!
45 years ago I started studying UFOs but I have never experienced this type of situation, however with paranormal themes I have. Perhaps not all phenomena work for all people in the same way or with similar affinity.
 
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