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The Navajo Skinwalker & 'Skinwalker Ranch'

Sid said:
Unless maybe things as we know them to be (i.e. 'light' & 'matter') are changed somehow into something else, which might be able to exit in a different form?
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Yes, that is true. 'Light and Matter' become 'mass-energy' inside a black hole, and can exit via Hawking Radiation. This comes out at a specific rate which is related to the total mass of the black hole. However this 'leakage' is very slow, and in a stellar-mass black hole, the amount of leakage is actually slower than the amount of mass-energy the black hole gains from the universe. So stellar mass black holes actually get bigger, rather than shrinking. Eventually, in the far distant future when the universe is colder than it is now, this flow will become reversed, and stellar mass black holes will evaporate.

A stellar mass black hole will evaporate in about 10,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 years.
 
eburacum said:
Yes, that is true. 'Light and Matter' become 'mass-energy' inside a black hole, and can exit via Hawking Radiation. This comes out at a specific rate which is related to the total mass of the black hole. However this 'leakage' is very slow, and in a stellar-mass black hole, the amount of leakage is actually slower than the amount of mass-energy the black hole gains from the universe. So stellar mass black holes actually get bigger, rather than shrinking. Eventually, in the far distant future when the universe is colder than it is now, this flow will become reversed, and stellar mass black holes will evaporate.

A stellar mass black hole will evaporate in about 10,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 years.
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Just around the corner then! :)
 
So, whatever all this means, I assume, is that no way there can be a wormhole at Skinwalker Ranch.

But, over the years many floating orbs showing intelligent movement have been filmed.

I don’t think Skinwalker Ranch is so benevolent.
 
The crew has one particular video of an orb going down a path or small road at night when the orb backed tracked to look at two trees and then crossed over to look at trees on the other side.

Travis said he was totally dumbfounded and puzzled by this particular orb.
 
JahaRa said:
A worm hole is a science fiction device to get spaceships from one galaxy to another quickly. I don't know who proposed it first but all the popular science fiction movies and television use them. For now, it is a plot device, which may have come from some physicist's theory many decades ago (which is where the good science fiction writers get their ideas).
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Einstein and Rosen first proposed wormholes:

https://www.quantamagazine.org/phys...tedly created the,an extra dimension of space.

...then science fiction sent spaceships down them
 
charliebrown said:
The crew has one particular video of an orb going down a path or small road at night when the orb backed tracked to look at two trees and then crossed over to look at trees on the other side.

Travis said he was totally dumbfounded and puzzled by this particular orb.
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Almost certainly a fly. Insects have a very rudimentary form of intelligence, that causes them to wander about investigating trees and other vegetation for potential sources of food and other resources. I'd be a bit disappointed if extraterrestrials or extradimensional entities had the same level of intelligence as a fly.
 
eburacum said:
Almost certainly a fly. Insects have a very rudimentary form of intelligence, that causes them to wander about investigating trees and other vegetation for potential sources of food and other resources. I'd be a bit disappointed if extraterrestrials or extradimensional entities had the same level of intelligence as a fly.
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Another dumb question...but exactly how does a fly look like a bright orb and wouldn't they tell the difference with decent cameras?
 
My opinion is the reason I like Travis Taylor is because he not afraid to say when he does not know or does not understand.

He is man enough to be honest.
 
Many of these 'orbs' are nothing but flies or other insects illuminated by the lights near the camera. Most orbs in ordinary photos are nothing but dust motes caught in the photo flash, or illuminated by lights near or behind the cameraman; some of these 'motes' are insects, and in the case of the Skinwalker ranch videos, the orbs that behave like they are under 'intelligent' control are most likely to be insects, because (as I said earlier) insects do have a primitive form of smart behaviour associated with their own survival. Indeed, some insects (such as dragonflies) are very competent hunters, and some (like bees) have a rudimentary language.

Not all the 'orbs' on the Skinwalker show are insects, though. Two glowing, floating vertical lines seen inside the carriage house were probably spider-webs, and one 'orb' was an ordinary, distant plane seen via night vision. Nothing about these 'orbs' looks particularly interesting to me.
 
Here's a typical 'orb' image from the show;
in the clip, you can see the insect flitting backwards and forwards, between (and well in front of) the trees.
fly3.png
 
eburacum said:
That is correct. A black hole is exerting gravity in all directions, so there is no way out past the event horizon.
In order to be traversable, it is necessary for a wormhole to have no event horizon, so you can get both in and out. That's all part of the maths. A wormhole also exerts gravity, but has weaker gravity than a black hole, so you can get out. In theory a wormhole is traversable, so by definition you can exit.

If the wormhole develops an event horizon, you are trapped, and the wormhole has become a black hole.
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So the event horizon is a sphere, not a Toroid like I have seen depicted in relation to a black hole?
 
dr wu said:
.but exactly how does a fly look like a bright orb and wouldn't they tell the difference with decent cameras?
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Mainly reflection. Some do it internally - I'm thinking of glow worms! The ones that aren't reflecting (matte, angle of light) we don't see. The world is full of insects and we are mostly unaware of them.

Your second point, is to do with if something is in focus I think. And also no comment.
 
JahaRa said:
So the event horizon is a sphere, not a Toroid like I have seen depicted in relation to a black hole?
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You are probably thinking of the singularity, which is a ring-shaped object in a rotating black hole.

Nearly all black holes would rotate, so most singularities are ring-shaped.

Similarly, the event horizon of a rotating black hole is ovoid, rather than spherical.
 
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In this video, Steven Greenstreet tries to find out what on earth makes Taylor and the other Skinwalker investigators think that this light is paranormal,
... rather than an insect or maybe a spider on a web.
(starts at 32.34)
 
eburacum said:
You are probably thinking of the singularity, which is a ring-shaped object in a rotating black hole.

Nearly all black holes would rotate, so most singularities are ring-shaped.

Similarly, the event horizon of a rotating black hole is ovoid, rather than spherical.
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No, I have seen depictions of the event horizon to a black hole and it is depicted as a toroid. OK, well I am not sure if it being oviod make sense to me but if the rotation is such that the event horizon is thicker on one side than the other, I don't get why, even with rotation, because the rotation would be constant. I guess when I have time I will research it and see if I can understand what you are saying.

P.S. since you mentioned it, what is your definition of a singularity?
 
Ah; the ergosphere of a spinning black hole is also a kind of toroid, or rather a lenticular shape similar to a red blood vessel.
main-qimg-2b573414a38d51a0ab993038c5e29471-pjlq


You can escape from the ergosphere, although it is difficult.

Here's the Wiki article on ergospheres, with a diagram showing a 'pumpkin-shaped' ergosphere.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ergosphere
Ergosphere_and_event_horizon_of_a_rotating_black_hole_%28no_animation%29.gif
 
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The singularity is a location where spacetime has collapsed into a point or ring. All the mass of the black hole is considered to exist inside this point or ring, although the singularity lies inside the event horizon, so no-one can ever see one and come out to describe it.
 
eburacum said:
Ah; the ergosphere of a spinning black hole is also a kind of toroid, or rather a lenticular shape similar to a red blood vessel.
main-qimg-2b573414a38d51a0ab993038c5e29471-pjlq


You can escape from the ergosphere, although it is difficult.

Here's the Wiki article on ergospheres, with a diagram showing a 'pumpkin-shaped' ergosphere.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ergosphere
Ergosphere_and_event_horizon_of_a_rotating_black_hole_%28no_animation%29.gif
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But why is it lenticular/toridal if there is 3 dimensional movement into the black hole? It seems to me that there would be a spherical layer that the closer you get to the black hole the denser the gravitaional pull. What is the explanation for the two holes at top and bottome (or one side and another since in space there isn't really a top and bottom, just convienient to pretend like ther is).
 
The ergosphere is formed by 'frame-dragging'; it is bit like twisted space-time wrapped around the black hole. Something like a vortex around the outside of the event horizon, where particles can get trapped. Roger Penrose has a scheme to extract rotational energy from this zone; if we did this, the ergosphere would shrink and the hole would stop spinning. The end result would be a non-rotating, spherical black hole with no ergosphere and (presumably) a point-like singularity.
 
eburacum said:
Ah; the ergosphere of a spinning black hole is also a kind of toroid, or rather a lenticular shape similar to a red blood vessel.
You can escape from the ergosphere, although it is difficult.
Here's the Wiki article on ergospheres, with a diagram showing a 'pumpkin-shaped' ergosphere.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ergosphere
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Seems to suggest that there are outward forces (gravitational inward pushes & outward pulls) that are working to cause the ergo sphere to exhibit this shape?
1690276917535.png
 
charliebrown said:
Since this physics is above my “ grade level “, I am sure you are right.
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Ok. After rereading this, it sounds as though I am berating @charliebrown, but that is not my intent. This is only me encouraging all to not think they are beyond understanding new ideas nor learning. I never liked how education is taught ie by people who were fairly knowledgeable and obviously did well in school. And because they did well in this venue, they stayed at school teaching and never looked beyond how others might learn things. And, often people's reluctance to ask questions to better understand comes from being centred out at school when asking a question the teacher thought was something that all should know the answer. That is poor teaching.

I learn something new here every day. Long since I was in school. The more you ask questions and are curious the more you can learn. I don't always understand what people are explaining here but most times they are happy to answer your questions and do try to put the explanation into terms we can all understand.

Never put yourself down. We learn, and can learn every day of our lives. Your school grade and education did not reflect where your interests are. Now you have freedom to follow and expand your interests:)
 
brownmane said:
Ok. After rereading this, it sounds as though I am berating @charliebrown, but that is not my intent. This is only me encouraging all to not think they are beyond understanding new ideas nor learning. I never liked how education is taught ie by people who were fairly knowledgeable and obviously did well in school. And because they did well in this venue, they stayed at school teaching and never looked beyond how others might learn things. And, often people's reluctance to ask questions to better understand comes from being centred out at school when asking a question the teacher thought was something that all should know the answer. That is poor teaching.

I learn something new here every day. Long since I was in school. The more you ask questions and are curious the more you can learn. I don't always understand what people are explaining here but most times they are happy to answer your questions and do try to put the explanation into terms we can all understand.

Never put yourself down. We learn, and can learn every day of our lives. Your school grade and education did not reflect where your interests are. Now you have freedom to follow and expand your interests:)
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Well said 'brownmane,' and very true. . . especially on the Fortean Forum platform, a good way to learn and pick up knowledge as you go.
And, in fact it's a good example of the difference between AI and 'us.' AI has to wait until somebody inputs the information for it to function, whereas, 'we' have the choice to pick and choose what ever takes our fancy - like having a nice cup of Coffee while we're advancing with a bit more knowledge, instead of just shutting down when someone accidentally pulls the plug out!
 
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When I was in school in the 1950s and early 1960s Watson and Crick was just discovering that the DNA molecule was a double helix twisted.

I think over the years I have kept up with the science world fairly well.

I never could do the algebraic train problems of distance and speed in algebra.

I do learn from this web site all the time.
 
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In the latest episode a multitude of experiments were lined up but the gremlins had their way.

Fully charged batteries suddenly dead, wires suddenly short out, the 1.6 gigahertz signal interfering with everything, and small rockets that would not launch.

The positive side was one of the state’s senator would look into the unknown helicopters.
 
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