• We have updated the guidelines regarding posting political content: please see the stickied thread on Website Issues.

False Memory

Well, when there was first publicity of The Gruffalo being released as a television adaptation, I thought, 'I remember that book. We used to have it in primary school.' When I saw parts of it on TV, the plot seemed very familiar and the animations were a fair representation of the illustrations I remembered. I looked it up for some reason on wikipedia, only to discover the book had been released in 1999. I had been a removal man for a year by then, and was long out of school. My best guess is that I'd been exposed to the book some other way, and perhaps conflated it with memories of children's books from back in the day. Such things are a shock to ones sense of oneself. How many memories upon which our personalities feed are entirely false?
The pictures of the Gruffalo are very reminiscent of the monsters in Maurice Sendak's Where the Wild Things Are.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Where_the_Wild_Things_Are
Maybe that's what you remembered?
 
Memory Two: sitting down watching CBBC in the late eighties. In the middle of Newsround the picture cuts to a bizarre man in a zig-zag black and white suit, gibbering nonsense in a basic set - walls and desk - that's patterned the same. It then cuts back to Newsround, with no hint that anything strange just happened. A friend insists he also remembers this, and that it was a publicity stunt for a CBBC show, but it seems pretty unlikely. Possibly I'm misremembering the Max Headroom signal interruption, which I believe occurred around that time, but would that have been reported in the UK, let alone on Newsround?

1986 was the last year new episodes of Max Headroom's original show were broadcast in the UK. Later shows would have been US productions (possibly syndicated back in the UK). The Max Headroom intrusion event occurred in Chicago on 22 November 1987. Do these timeframes seem to correlate with your memory of it happening in the late eighties?

I suspect what you saw may have been a Max Headroom spoof or take-off rather than Max himself. This is because I don't recall, nor can I locate any images of, Max Headroom wearing a suit of zig-zag black and white matching the decor around him. Your mention of a desk also doesn't sound like Max Headroom. Max was consistently shown as a talking head / upper torso with a moving background. I don't recall seeing any desk, discernible walls, or any visuals of an enclosing room in any of the original Max broadcasts.
 
1986 was the last year new episodes of Max Headroom's original show were broadcast in the UK. Later shows would have been US productions (possibly syndicated back in the UK). The Max Headroom intrusion event occurred in Chicago on 22 November 1987. Do these timeframes seem to correlate with your memory of it happening in the late eighties?

I suspect what you saw may have been a Max Headroom spoof or take-off rather than Max himself. This is because I don't recall, nor can I locate any images of, Max Headroom wearing a suit of zig-zag black and white matching the decor around him. Your mention of a desk also doesn't sound like Max Headroom. Max was consistently shown as a talking head / upper torso with a moving background. I don't recall seeing any desk, discernible walls, or any visuals of an enclosing room in any of the original Max broadcasts.

The dates definitely correlate. I lighted on the Max Headroom intrusion event since it was the only thing I could think of that in any way resembled my 'memory', and happened in the right timeframe.

Max_Headroom_broadcast_signal_intrusion.jpg
(source: Wikipedia)

The background is corrugated metal, looking like monochrome stripes, with a wavy effect at the top likely due to the poor signal, and he was gibbering random nonsense, so is it out of the question my imagination took that and ran like crazy with it? Of course, that's still presuming it would have been reported, and shown, on Newsround.

I agree it couldn't have been Max himself, and you've actually highlighted something that counts against the MHIE: I certainly knew of Max at the time - he was pretty ubiquitous, after all - so if it was the MHIE I saw, surely I'd remember his highly distinctive face? Instead, I recall nothing at all of a face, just a man in a deranged outfit.
 
I don't think a failure to specifically recall the face rules out Max Headroom.

The bit that confuses me is your allusion to a patterned suit. I don't think I ever saw Max Headroom in a patterned suit - he always wore a solid colored jacket.

The closest thing to a Max takeoff in a patterned suit that comes to mind is the villain Vinnie from Mel Brooks' 1987 Spaceballs.

Vinnie.jpg
 
I don't think a failure to specifically recall the face rules out Max Headroom.

The bit that confuses me is your allusion to a patterned suit. I don't think I ever saw Max Headroom in a patterned suit - he always wore a solid colored jacket.

The closest thing to a Max takeoff in a patterned suit that comes to mind is the villain Vinnie from Mel Brooks' 1987 Spaceballs.


I think I should clarify - I was referring purely to the broadcast interruption that borrowed Max's likeness, not to Headroom himself. I'm 99.9% sure it couldn't have been him, or Pizza the Hut's main made man. Honestly, I'm increasingly tempted to stick this in the same children-see-the-damndest-things category as "And now, the penguin...". A random blurring of imagination and reality, if it ever even happened at all.
 
Back in the day, I was born & bred in Ormskirk West Lancs. I think we always shopped locally and I recall regular trips to nearby supermarkets with my parents on Thursday evenings. However, I have a strange memory of very occasionally going to a huge supermarket in Wigan. In hindsight, this doesn’t make sense because the distance is excessive, I recall now that the mysterious supermarket had something to do with the “Makro” card, but this conflicts with all the memories I have of my snobbish parents muttering disparagingly about “where the shopkeepers went with their Makro cards”. So the possibility that my parents may have participated in the scheme, even secretly, seems unlikely.

However, it’s one detail that further mystifies me. I recollect toddling down the alcohol aisle and enjoying a very specific treat; one particular bottle of beverage, could’ve been wine, had a little brass goblet inset above the label on the front. Myself my brother and sister delighted in mischievously, prizing these goblets from the bottles and taking them away as keepsakes. Hence, going to this strange faraway supermarket was anticipated, eagerly for juvenile shoplifting exploits.
But I cannot now find any reference to these bottles with their little brass goblets set into them. Did they ever exist? Was there a supermarket in Wigan that was massive yet allowed the hoi polloi to visit? It’s all rather mystifying.
 
....Memory Three: comfortably the most vivid. I'd have been six or seven. I'd used the toilet, but as the handle was broken, I had to open the cistern and reach into the nest of sharp, unguarded metal rods - it was a 70s toilet - and push one down to flush it. My finger slipped, a flash of pain, blood flowing, panic. It takes me some time to understand why I can't simply lift my hand out - my finger's been impaled on one of the rods. I slide it off and, naturally, run bawling and bleeding downstairs to Mum. Unfortunately, she ignores me, dismisses me, even goes so far as to snap "Don't be ridiculous!" at me. I asked her about it, minus the last bit, a while back, and she vigorously insisted no such thing had happened, that it was just a dream.....

I am a bit confused by your description as 1970s toilets were almost always the old ballcock and siphon type , as below, and certainly contained no "sharp, unguarded metal rods" as such. The cisterns were made for ordinary people to maintain and replace bits if necessary so not really many sharp metal bits, unless parts had corroded and snapped, and then the toilet would not function.

I remember that if the handle was broken then you'd have to reach into the cistern and slightly lift the arm that connected the handle to the rest of the gubbins - the bit called 'trip lever' on this diagram below - and the flush would engage.

I think that maybe your Mum might be right for your memory #3 :)


Toilet Flush Mechanisms: Toilet Tanks - how they workHow Flush Toilets Work
 
There was a large, pretty basic supermarket, in an old mill in Wigan late 60s - early 70s. I don't remember it's name, but it sold multipacks of stuff, and we wanted to stock up for a holiday. Only went there a couple of times (I'm from Burscough btw). Can't help out with the wine though.
Back in the day, I was born & bred in Ormskirk West Lancs. I think we always shopped locally and I recall regular trips to nearby supermarkets with my parents on Thursday evenings. However, I have a strange memory of very occasionally going to a huge supermarket in Wigan. In hindsight, this doesn’t make sense because the distance is excessive, I recall now that the mysterious supermarket had something to do with the “Makro” card, but this conflicts with all the memories I have of my snobbish parents muttering disparagingly about “where the shopkeepers went with their Makro cards”. So the possibility that my parents may have participated in the scheme, even secretly, seems unlikely.

However, it’s one detail that further mystifies me. I recollect toddling down the alcohol aisle and enjoying a very specific treat; one particular bottle of beverage, could’ve been wine, had a little brass goblet inset above the label on the front. Myself my brother and sister delighted in mischievously, prizing these goblets from the bottles and taking them away as keepsakes. Hence, going to this strange faraway supermarket was anticipated, eagerly for juvenile shoplifting exploits.
But I cannot now find any reference to these bottles with their little brass goblets set into them. Did they ever exist? Was there a supermarket in Wigan that was massive yet allowed the hoi polloi to visit? It’s all rather mystifying.
 
There was a large, pretty basic supermarket, in an old mill in Wigan late 60s - early 70s. I don't remember it's name, but it sold multipacks of stuff, and we wanted to stock up for a holiday. Only went there a couple of times (I'm from Burscough btw). Can't help out with the wine though.
Interesting, that sounds a lot more like the Makro superstore I heard people went to. The supermarket I recall had low ceilings, was huge, modern (for the time) and brightly lit
It feels like half dream, apart from the fact, I definitely recall the little brass goblets.
I know Burscough well! Nice part of the world. I am 25 years in the north-east now, so have really lost touch with that part of the world. I heard there are ghost stories associated with Burscough airfield.
 
Interesting, that sounds a lot more like the Makro superstore I heard people went to. The supermarket I recall had low ceilings, was huge, modern (for the time) and brightly lit
It feels like half dream, apart from the fact, I definitely recall the little brass goblets.
I know Burscough well! Nice part of the world. I am 25 years in the north-east now, so have really lost touch with that part of the world. I heard there are ghost stories associated with Burscough airfield.
Do you still have the brass goblets? Do you remember any more details?
It doesn't ring a bell with me.
 
There was a large, pretty basic supermarket, in an old mill in Wigan late 60s - early 70s. I don't remember it's name, but it sold multipacks of stuff, and we wanted to stock up for a holiday. Only went there a couple of times (I'm from Burscough btw). Can't help out with the wine though.
Do you still have the brass goblets? Do you remember any more details?
It doesn't ring a bell with me.
No sadly not. They were placed in a recess where a very old wine bottle might have a glass seal, on the shoulder of the bottle I suppose. There may have been some sort of cork plug in the recess, and the goblets were pressed into that. I recall, eager little fingers could prize them out for easily From memory the goblets were only 15 mm - 20 mm high.
 
No sadly not. They were placed in a recess where a very old wine bottle might have a glass seal, on the shoulder of the bottle I suppose. There may have been some sort of cork plug in the recess, and the goblets were pressed into that. I recall, eager little fingers could prize them out for easily From memory the goblets were only 15 mm - 20 mm high.

Date? Decade? Any more info?

maximus otter
 
However, it’s one detail that further mystifies me. I recollect toddling down the alcohol aisle and enjoying a very specific treat; one particular bottle of beverage, could’ve been wine, had a little brass goblet inset above the label on the front. Myself my brother and sister delighted in mischievously, prizing these goblets from the bottles and taking them away as keepsakes.
Could this have been Bull's Blood wine? I used to buy that in the '70s because of the little goblets. They were wedged into a round wooden panel that was set into the bottle above the label.

A relation might have them now so I'll see about getting a photo.
 
Could this have been Bull's Blood wine? I used to buy that in the '70s because of the little goblets. They were wedged into a round wooden panel that was set into the bottle above the label.

A relation might have them now so I'll see about getting a photo.
Aha! That sounds exactly right, yes. Wow, my memory was not faulty after all, even down to the recollection of the little wooden insert that they were fitted into. Thank you very much!
 
Aha! That sounds exactly right, yes. Wow, my memory was not faulty after all, even down to the recollection of the little wooden insert that they were fitted into. Thank you very much!
My work here is done. :cool:

Sadly though I can't find an image online. There was a dramatic TV advert for it but that's not on YouTube as far as I can see.

However, I've messaged the relation who has the goblets and hope to hear back.
 
My work here is done. :cool:

Sadly though I can't find an image online. There was a dramatic TV advert for it but that's not on YouTube as far as I can see.

However, I've messaged the relation who has the goblets and hope to hear back.
Yes I did a quick Google scan and couldn’t find it. Seems there is “Bull’s Blood” Hungarian wine (very 1970s) and “Torres Sangre de Toro” which sometimes has a little black plastic bull attached to it nowadays.
 
Yes I did a quick Google scan and couldn’t find it. Seems there is “Bull’s Blood” Hungarian wine (very 1970s) and “Torres Sangre de Toro” which sometimes has a little black plastic bull attached to it nowadays.
Little plastic bull, pah. We want our brass goblet. :chuckle:

“Bull’s Blood” Hungarian wine (very 1970s) - the very beast.

We thought we were terribly sophisticated. I tried hard to find the blood-savour in the wine as I did actually believe it was supposed to taste like blood. I failed miserably, not surprisingly. :dunno:
 
Little plastic bull, pah. We want our brass goblet. :chuckle:

“Bull’s Blood” Hungarian wine (very 1970s) - the very beast.

We thought we were terribly sophisticated. I tried hard to find the blood-savour in the wine as I did actually believe it was supposed to taste like blood. I failed miserably, not surprisingly. :dunno:
Hehe! Yes indeed the brass goblets were the business. The plastic bull is more like a Christmas cracker toy
 
Hehe! Yes indeed the brass goblets were the business. The plastic bull is more like a Christmas cracker toy
Some kid will choke on one of those plastic bulls. :(
People collect them! You can buy a set on eBay.

Actually, I'm surprised adults choked on the miniature brass goblet.
Surely EVERYBODY was drunkenly tempted to pour some wine in one and drink it? :dunno:

Just me then.
 
Some kid will choke on one of those plastic bulls. :(
People collect them! You can buy a set on eBay.

Actually, I'm surprised adults choked on the miniature brass goblet.
Surely EVERYBODY was drunkenly tempted to pour some wine in one and drink it? :dunno:

Just me then.
Ha! Good point!
 
Could this have been Bull's Blood wine? I used to buy that in the '70s because of the little goblets. They were wedged into a round wooden panel that was set into the bottle above the label.

A relation might have them now so I'll see about getting a photo.
I remember drinking Bulls Blood wine in the late 90s (although in a standard bottle).
 
I once got so drunk on it I slid off the sofa and landed on the open fire, and had to go to hospital. :omg:
Potent stuff! No wonder they gave away the little goblets, perhaps that was the recommended measure?
 
Little plastic bull, pah. We want our brass goblet. :chuckle:

“Bull’s Blood” Hungarian wine (very 1970s) - the very beast.

We thought we were terribly sophisticated. I tried hard to find the blood-savour in the wine as I did actually believe it was supposed to taste like blood. I failed miserably, not surprisingly. :dunno:
"Bulls Blood" was my go to wine in student days (73 - 76), it was relatively cheap and fairly robust (I don't have a subtle palate) I must have missed the little goblets promotion. Not so much hangovers on it, more a general overall ache and feeling like you were on another planet.
 
I am a bit confused by your description as 1970s toilets were almost always the old ballcock and siphon type , as below, and certainly contained no "sharp, unguarded metal rods" as such. The cisterns were made for ordinary people to maintain and replace bits if necessary so not really many sharp metal bits, unless parts had corroded and snapped, and then the toilet would not function.

I remember that if the handle was broken then you'd have to reach into the cistern and slightly lift the arm that connected the handle to the rest of the gubbins - the bit called 'trip lever' on this diagram below - and the flush would engage.

I think that maybe your Mum might be right for your memory #3 :)


Toilet Flush Mechanisms: Toilet Tanks - how they workHow Flush Toilets Work
I was making an assumption it was a 70s toilet because my parents moved into that house in the beginning of that decade, before any of us kids were born, and heavily overhauled the place, but it's certainly possible it was an earlier model. Still, that diagram is giving tingles of familiarity, and a couple of possibilities have occurred as a result.

One: a broken lift rod was what I impaled my finger on. Two, much more likely: a breakage that necessitated reaching inside to activate the flush, amongst all those moving parts, engendered enough anxiety in sensitive little me it resulted in a vivid nightmare that's stuck with me, and over time natural conflation of memories has blended it all together.

Thanks for the input and info. :)
 
I was making an assumption it was a 70s toilet because my parents moved into that house in the beginning of that decade, before any of us kids were born, and heavily overhauled the place, but it's certainly possible it was an earlier model. Still, that diagram is giving tingles of familiarity, and a couple of possibilities have occurred as a result.

One: a broken lift rod was what I impaled my finger on. Two, much more likely: a breakage that necessitated reaching inside to activate the flush, amongst all those moving parts, engendered enough anxiety in sensitive little me it resulted in a vivid nightmare that's stuck with me, and over time natural conflation of memories has blended it all together.

Thanks for the input and info. :)
I've been spending a lot of time with my head in a cistern lately (it's an old toilet, but with a high level flush rather than low level, so it might be different). There's nothing narrow enough to impale a finger, most of the workings are quite thick and robust, the only wire that you could impale yourself on is where the handle attaches through the loop to hold it on. In my toilet, at least. And it's fairly innocuous, it would be less of an 'impale' and more of a 'sticking your finger with a bit of wire'. Is there any chance that you might, in your nighttime panic, have seen some blood and built the case up in your mind into being a bit more of a drastic incident than it was?
 
I've been spending a lot of time with my head in a cistern lately (it's an old toilet, but with a high level flush rather than low level, so it might be different). There's nothing narrow enough to impale a finger, most of the workings are quite thick and robust, the only wire that you could impale yourself on is where the handle attaches through the loop to hold it on. In my toilet, at least. And it's fairly innocuous, it would be less of an 'impale' and more of a 'sticking your finger with a bit of wire'. Is there any chance that you might, in your nighttime panic, have seen some blood and built the case up in your mind into being a bit more of a drastic incident than it was?
A good chance. Anxiety has been a lifelong problem, and only relatively recently have I grasped enough of its mechanisms to even start to live with it. As a kid, escalation was highly likely; after all, you're talking about someone who'd hide under tables when things got too much for him.
 
Could someone have repaired the cistern mechanism with a piece of wire (old coathanger?) If they left a sharp end sticking up you may have stuck a finger on it. I have done a temporary fix like this to hold the ballcock and stop the thing flooding pending buying new bits. Could a guilty parent have decided - "No never happened."?
 
Could someone have repaired the cistern mechanism with a piece of wire (old coathanger?) If they left a sharp end sticking up you may have stuck a finger on it. I have done a temporary fix like this to hold the ballcock and stop the thing flooding pending buying new bits. Could a guilty parent have decided - "No never happened."?
A possibility I've been considering for a long time. Dad, to this day, prefers to do as much himself as possible, and temp fixes that end up lasting way longer than intended were not uncommmon. Also, both parents have difficulties with taking responsibility for their words and actions, Mum especially. These are prime reasons I've never been entirely able to dismiss the memory as false.
 
Back
Top