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Fred & Rosemary West

escargot said:
This must be terrible for Miss Bastholm's family. They might be about to find her and lay her to rest after all these years but it's surely come too late for some of them.
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It mentioned on the news that her parents both died without knowing what happened to their daughter, the family (remainng) have asked for privacy at this time.
 
Souleater said:
It mentioned on the news that her parents both died without knowing what happened to their daughter, the family (remainng) have asked for privacy at this time.
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Yup, I know. Mary would have been nearly 70 now. She has a surviving brother who has adult children.
 
It’s so terribly sad. Didn’t the father of Cladia Lawrence die quite recently? And she’s never been found either. (Her mother is still alive).
 
Here is a page from Gloucester Live news page.

The reportage is intriguing but the comments are even more interesting. I wouldn't be surprised if they were deleted soon!
Some have already disappeared.

Allegations are made about the local police being stupid, turning a blind eye, protecting West and other abusers, deliberately bungling investigations and even being customers at West's brothel.

Gloucester man claims he reported seeing Mary Bastholm but says police didn't respond

Read it before it's gone!
 
I’m pretty sure I read in one of the West books that Fred West was a ‘grass’, and did have some kind of relationship with the local police, but that’s not quite the same as the police using his ‘brothel’ and covering up what he did. Mary Bastholm was very early on in his sordid life, and when everything fell to pieces for him it seemed to do so quite quickly, mainly due to the efforts of DC Hazel Savage, apparently, who pushed.

Mind you, Caroline Owens was treated abominably by authorities, apparently.
 
Fanari_Lloyd said:
I’m pretty sure I read in one of the West books that Fred West was a ‘grass’, and did have some kind of relationship with the local police, but that’s not quite the same as the police using his ‘brothel’ and covering up what he did. Mary Bastholm was very early on in his sordid life, and when everything fell to pieces for him it seemed to do so quite quickly, mainly due to the efforts of DC Hazel Savage, apparently, who pushed.

Mind you, Caroline Owens was treated abominably by authorities, apparently.
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On tonight's PM programme it was alleged that Fred West/the Wests might have killed dozens or scores of previously-unknown victims.
We might be at the start of a renewed investigation, a generation on from the original '90s cases.

A cynical person might wonder if enough senior police (and perhaps councillors, social workers and kids' home staff) have retired or died off now to leave the way clear without interference.

I’m pretty sure I read in one of the West books that Fred West was a ‘grass’, and did have some kind of relationship with the local police, but that’s not quite the same as the police using his ‘brothel’ and covering up what he did.
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This is exactly what is being alleged, and has been many times over the years.
 
escargot said:
On tonight's PM programme it was alleged that Fred West/the Wests might have killed dozens or scores of previously-unknown victims.
We might be at the start of a renewed investigation, a generation on from the original '90s cases.
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I think they did. They were pretty regular and there were ‘gaps’, apparently. And Fred West worked all over the place. I knew a guy with a small building firm who said he employed him, late 80’s —early ‘90’s here in Swindon and in the surrounding area, Gloucestershire, Wilts. And those were the days when you’d have people coming in the pub Friday afternoon with wads of cash because some of that kind of work was cash-in-hand, which were exactly the kind of jobs West liked.

escargot said:
A cynical person might wonder if enough senior police (and perhaps councillors, social workers and kids' home staff) have retired or died off now to leave the way clear without interference.
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Yes, it’s been enough years now.
 
Souleater said:
Police statement says they are going to start the excavation today

"Excavation work is to begin at a cafe where police have been searching for a teenager whose disappearance was linked to serial killer Fred West.

Mary Bastholm went missing in Gloucester in 1968 and police have been searching the cellar of the premises where she used to work.

Officers were called to The Clean Plate cafe on 7 May following suggestions a body may have been buried there."

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-gloucestershire-57152485
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The Trip Advisor reports for this cafe are going to now make for some interesting reading.
 
UPDATE

no human remains were found at the cafe excavation.

"No human remains have been found by police searching a cafe in Gloucester for a suspected victim of the serial killer Fred West.

Officers have been searching for Mary Bastholm, 15, who worked at the Pop-In Cafe - now called The Clean Plate. She was last seen in 1968.

Gloucestershire Police began excavating the cafe cellar in Southgate Street on 19 May and said it had finished.

Miss Bastholm's family said they were sad but hoped she would yet be found."

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-gloucestershire-57266871
 
Souleater said:
UPDATE

no human remains were found at the cafe excavation.

"No human remains have been found by police searching a cafe in Gloucester for a suspected victim of the serial killer Fred West.

Officers have been searching for Mary Bastholm, 15, who worked at the Pop-In Cafe - now called The Clean Plate. She was last seen in 1968.

Gloucestershire Police began excavating the cafe cellar in Southgate Street on 19 May and said it had finished.

Miss Bastholm's family said they were sad but hoped she would yet be found."

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-gloucestershire-57266871
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That must be so disheartening and difficult for her family.
 
Souleater said:
UPDATE

no human remains were found at the cafe excavation.

"No human remains have been found by police searching a cafe in Gloucester for a suspected victim of the serial killer Fred West.

Officers have been searching for Mary Bastholm, 15, who worked at the Pop-In Cafe - now called The Clean Plate. She was last seen in 1968.

Gloucestershire Police began excavating the cafe cellar in Southgate Street on 19 May and said it had finished.

Miss Bastholm's family said they were sad but hoped she would yet be found."

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-gloucestershire-57266871
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It didn't really make sense that they were investigating based on "blue material", with Mary Bastholm wearing blue when she disappeared... The Wests' victims were buried without any personal items of clothing.
 
It's a cafe associated with a women's refuge I think I saw somewhere. So I doubt they will be cashing in on it somehow but I also think if that's true then they will probably be unaffected because they might not be quite so dependent on good news stories for custom.

I am fascinated by the hint that there might be archaeological grave sites @escargot! It might be the site of a forgotten medieval church graveyard or something!
 
staticgirl said:
It's a cafe associated with a women's refuge I think I saw somewhere. So I doubt they will be cashing in on it somehow but I also think if that's true then they will probably be unaffected because they might not be quite so dependent on good news stories for custom.

I am fascinated by the hint that there might be archaeological grave sites @escargot! It might be the site of a forgotten medieval church graveyard or something!
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Maybe the inadvertent archaeological find what ever it turns out to be will see something positive come out of situation but still our hearts must go out to those who still have no answers about their loved ones.
 
escargot said:
and even being customers at West's brothel.
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This is effectively fact now - police were customers at Fred's brothel.

People might be suprised how it isn't uncommon for police to have "relationships", working relationships. with dodgy people. There is an argument about keeping your friends close and enemies closer. This accepted and there is a very thin line there that can be, and is, crossed. You might also want to look at Thomas Hamilton. There were allegations about his conduct with children for years before Dunblane. None of these got anywhere. There was eventually a police investigation. It decided he should have his gun license revokes and should be not able to run children's summer camps. When they went higher-up to be signed off they disappeared, no action taken.
 
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Coastaljames said:
This is effectively fact now - police were customers at Fred's brothel.

People might be suprised how it isn't uncommon for police to have "relationships", working relationships. with dodgy people. There is an argument about keeping your friends close and enemies closer. This accepted and there is a very thin line there that can be, and is, crossed. You might also want to look at Thomas Hamilton. There were allegations about his conduct with children for years before Dunblane. None of these got anywhere. There was eventually a police investigation. It decided he should have his gun license revokes and should be not able to run children's summer camps. When they went higher-up to be signed off they disappeared, no action taken.
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Police officers are human too. A number of them use to indulge in the sex club at a local hotel. A friend told me (honestly it was a friend, honest, it was). This friend indulged with his wife, but how he knew they were police I didn't like to ask.
 
PeteS said:
Police officers are human too. A number of them use to indulge in the sex club at a local hotel. A friend told me (honestly it was a friend, honest, it was). This friend indulged with his wife, but how he knew they were police I didn't like to ask.
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‘Forensics are having a field day in there!’
 
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