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Kchoo Experience

humanoidlord said:
simply fun, messing with the heads of inferior beings is a interesting pasttime
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Really....an interesting pastime for who...? Do you honestly think that an intelligent being would bother to do such a thing...?
This idea that trickster beings exist to only fudge with us always struck me as silly.
 
dr wu said:
Really....an interesting pastime for who...? Do you honestly think that an intelligent being would bother to do such a thing...?
This idea that trickster beings exist to only fudge with us always struck me as silly.
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That thinking shows the influence of too many Star Trek episodes, not alien intelligence which may or may not be there. I think the effect of popular science fiction is underestimated in most alien narratives.
 
dr wu said:
Really....an interesting pastime for who...? Do you honestly think that an intelligent being would bother to do such a thing...?
This idea that trickster beings exist to only fudge with us always struck me as silly.
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how can we understand the mind of a extradimensional entity wich is way more advanced than us?
 
GNC said:
That thinking shows the influence of too many Star Trek episodes, not alien intelligence which may or may not be there. I think the effect of popular science fiction is underestimated in most alien narratives.
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Who are you replying to...? How does thinking that trickster aliens are silly refer to Star Trek..?
 
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humanoidlord said:
how can we understand the mind of a extradimensional entity wich is way more advanced than us?
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First you are assuming an extradimensional entity exists and then you are assuming that it's so different from us that it wants to fudge with our minds.
You do see the problem here..?
 
Scribbles said:
Like people who've been "saved" by Jesus. Once, a friend who had only recently converted told me that she was really excited about "Judgement Day"! Yeah! Eff you, my atheist friend! Enjoy eternity burning in Hell! I'm off to see Jesus!
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:rollingw:
 
markrkingston1 said:
I get the sense that you are a tad cynical. ;)

If I may play devil's advocate for a moment, aliens are, if nothing else, alien, so what makes sense to them might well seem bizarrely nosensical to us. It's a bit cliché but perhaps they (if we assume that they exist, for the sake of argument) just don't feel that the majority of us are 'ready'. Who knows.



The planet is not even remotely "on its knees" with climate change. Maybe it will be in future but, as things currently stand, we're coping fine. And humanity has so far proven its ability to not turn the planet into a nuclear wasteland. This is all quite positive, to my mind.



This is pointless speculation but perhaps that's just no their way. They;d rather we do learn to do ourselves or, more realistically, to learn to cope well with change ourselves.
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Yeah give it a few more years and then we'll see Regarding climate change, try visiting Australia at the moment. Also, I said we have the nukes to finish off the planet just because we haven't yet doesn't mean we won't. Aliens would understand risk analysis and understand the risk we pose to ourselves.

While we are at it didn't many alien visitors warn us of our impending doom?
 
Naughty_Felid said:
Yeah give it a few more years and then we'll see Regarding climate change, try visiting Australia at the moment. Also, I said we have the nukes to finish off the planet just because we haven't yet doesn't mean we won't. Aliens would understand risk analysis and understand the risk we pose to ourselves.

While we are at it didn't many alien visitors warn us of our impending doom?
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Let's just say that I take a more positive view of things in general than you. :)
 
dr wu said:
Really....an interesting pastime for who...? Do you honestly think that an intelligent being would bother to do such a thing...?
This idea that trickster beings exist to only fudge with us always struck me as silly.
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But why not? Aliens are surely alien. They need not conform to our ideas of rational behaviour.
 
markrkingston1 said:
But why not? Aliens are surely alien. They need not conform to our ideas of rational behaviour.
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I think that any intelligent being capable of interstellar travel or interdimensional travel would act rationally on at least some level or aspect we would probably understand......the idea that they wouldn't (and still understand science, etc..) is even harder to believe or justify imho.
 
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humanoidlord said:
the conclusions of both vallee and keel make that very plausible
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Keel was a writer...and not really a scientific investigator..we should bear that in mind ,and Dr Vallee never said they were 'extradimensional ' beings (he cited that as one possibility) nor that they were trying 'to trick us'. Those are misinterpretations of his ideas...at least imo.
His 7 reasons against the ETH was an explanation of why he felt that that idea didn't explain all the 'facts' (as few as they are..)but he never committed to saying that the entities were from another reality...only a possibility.
 
dr wu said:
Who are you replying to...? How does thinking that trickster aliens are silly refer to Star Trek..?
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I was agreeing with your train of thought, trickster aliens are all over Star Trek and I struggle to think of any who showed up in UFO accounts before science fiction started using them. The faerie folk are another matter, too.
 
GNC said:
I was agreeing with your train of thought, trickster aliens are all over Star Trek and I struggle to think of any who showed up in UFO accounts before science fiction started using them. The faerie folk are another matter, too.
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Ok..I understand your reference now.....I'm getting slow in my old age.
Yes...Q.. and other 'aliens' have often been used in that way in Star Trek.....and I thought it was silly then also. Great entertainment value but I sincerely doubt that any advanced alien would act quite like Q.
 
dr wu said:
I think that any intelligent being capable of interstellar travel or interdimensional travel would act rationally on at least some level or aspect we would probably understand......the idea that they wouldn't (and still understand science, etc..) is even harder to believe or justify imho.
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I just don't think we can safely make such an assumption. Only time will tell.
 
I'll add this in here, as it seems appropriate, It is edging on political, but I have no wish for it to be pursued as such.

I have just finished reading Bob Woodward's book 'Fear in the Trump White House'.

And it gives an account of Trump discussing the Afghanistan situation with his advisers. The discussion was about the mineral wealth of Afghanistan. Trump wanted to know 'why can't we just go in and take it' ? This argument was based on the money America has spent there.

His advisers told him that you can't do that. Afghanistan is a Sovereign country.

My point with this is that surely this is the thinking any powerful Alien nation would apply. If they were here simply for resources of the Planet they would simply take them.
If we do not have the capability to resist them, why would they not ?

If they exist at all, Aliens do not appear to be holding Davos type meeting to discuss the distribution of wealth.

Please, no political follow ups to this.

INT21.
 
INT21 said:
My point with this is that surely this is the thinking any powerful Alien nation would apply. If they were here simply for resources of the Planet they would simply take them.
If we do not have the capability to resist them, why would they not ?

If they exist at all, Aliens do not appear to be holding Davos type meeting to discuss the distribution of wealth.
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Maybe for the same reasons that the USA did not just take the mineral wealth of Afghanistan: It wasn't morally acceptable[1] (at least not without some kind of legally defensible cover).

As discussed in other contexts, aliens are likely to be, if anything, alien. So it's difficult for us to second-guess what their decisioin making criteria might be. We don't even know for sure that they exist!



Footnote:-
1: Like you, I don't want to get into political debate about whether trump would really have liked to take Afghanistan's mineral wealth or was just asking the question to see what the responses would be. For what it's worth, in business debates with contentious contexts in the past, I have intentionally mooted various 'nuclear options', not because I was necessarily serious but because I wanted to see how people would respond.
 
Markrkingston1 (may I call you Mark ? it is so much easier)

It is a pity there is no place on here where some political aspects can be discussed. Moderated with a rod of iron, of course.
I can see a few situations where 'nuclear options' would be beneficial.

As for the morality aspect. Can one assume that an Alien nation would have the same moral code as (most of ) us do ?
Maybe they would just see us as being in the way.
INT21.
 
INT21 said:
Markrkingston1 (may I call you Mark ? it is so much easier)
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Yup, call me Mark. :)

INT21 said:
It is a pity there is no place on here where some political aspects can be discussed. Moderated with a rod of iron, of course.
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I suspect it's better to keep the political stuff off a generally good-natured forum like this one. The problems with strict moderation are that it is hard work for the moderators and it would be very difficult for them to always be seen as unbiased. Better just to keep the politics out of it.

INT21 said:
As for the morality aspect. Can one assume that an Alien nation would have the same moral code as (most of ) us do ?
Maybe they would just see us as being in the way.
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No, I don't think we can assume that they would have the same moral standards as we purport to have. But then again we could not assume that they would have different moral standards either.

If they haven't taken our resources by force it could be because they think it immoral to do so, because they don't need them, because of some other reason(s) we can't guess at, or because they aren't even here.

In general, I think we can assume nothing about the moral standards, motivations or thinking processes of aliens, whom we have no way of knowing anything about as things stand (including that they even exist in the here and now).
 
Mark,

..In general, I think we can assume nothing about the moral standards, motivations or thinking processes of aliens, whom we have no way of knowing anything about as things stand (including that they even exist in the here and now). ..

Got to agree. Logically (at least my version of logic) as a species advances it should be more 'moral'. But if we take the case of the Conquistadors, one must question that.

It would be nice to know for definite that 'they' were there, or not there.

Kchoo, it's your thread. Where are you ?

INT21.
 
INT21 said:
It would be nice to know for definite that 'they' were there, or not there.
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Yes, it would settle a great deal to have some kind of objective evidence that they were here.

I suspect (but cannot prove) that such objective evidence does exist but that those who possess it do not wish to share it. Also the 'Prime Directive' hypothesis seems plausible but, again, there is inadequate evidence to prove it.

INT21 said:
Kchoo, it's your thread. Where are you ?
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Kchoo is lucky: He seems to have personally satisfactory evidence that aliens (of some sort) are here. It is sad that his evidence cannot be objectively extrapolated in general.
 
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...It is sad that his evidence cannot be objectively extrapolated in general. ..

Indeed. But I am hesitant to be too critical. At least on the subject of them existing and appearing, or not.

For me the problem boils down to the ufo phenomena. And having seen two apparitions in the past. Very weird experiences. But real enough to me.


Having seen, back in the eighties, what has come to be know as the 'Dudley Dorito' object. And having been able to rule out to a good degree of certainty that I wasn't looking at 'one of ours', I can't just deny the whole thing.

My problem with it is that if these objects do exist, then they have to come from somewhere, and return to somewhere. Whatever they are.

Also I have a couple of serious colleagues on other related sits who swear blind that they have had some kind of experience. They do not come over as the usual ' bleevers' and their account are not too weird. So what to believe ?

If the ufo is a machine, it either has a crew or is a 'drone' of sorts. Or it isn't there as a hard reality.

If it is a psychological entity then we are into a whole different game. A very deep game indeed.

INT21.
 
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