Roman Soldiers At The Treasurer's House, York

But some of them may have not wanted to be ghosts. Are they just being dragged along for the ride?
 
Analogue Boy said:
Not being sure about how ghosts work, I’ve been thinking about these Roman ghosts and how plausible the story is. At face value, the story is about a unit of well-drilled soldiers marching through the walls on the old road. But how did they all become ghosts? Did they choose to become ghosts? Why didn’t some say ‘Oh no, this isn’t for me thank you very much’, and make other arrangements? Would there then be gaps in the marching procession or would they organise themselves into a tight formation with the ghosts that remained? On what grounds or qualifications did the horse get to join them as a ghost?
When you think about it, bunches of ghosts like this don’t make much sense. Stone Tape makes for a better theory. Although tall tale fits a little better.
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I consider them more to be a stone tape recording than ghosts. It should be possible to see it more than once if they are a stone tape recording.
 
I can't remember if it was this case now, but I recall an account of Roman ghosts looking, well, knackered. So imagine that this bunch of Romans are utterly exhausted to the absolute limit of their endurance... maybe they just had a battle and are now marching off toward yet another uprising somewhere else. Completely fatigued, so their march is, in a very real sense, a waking nightmare with the dream state impinging on their consciousness as they endlessly march on, with no hope of rest. Then they are ambushed by a bunch of local lads and quickly wiped out, so quickly in fact, that in their extreme fatigue already overlain with nightmares, it all happens so fast that they have no idea what is going on. So, knackered, newly dead, already in an alternate state of consciousness even before they are rudely shoved into the afterlife. So the nightmare just continues, and they march on their awful way, in an unending nightmare from which there is no wakening.

It makes me shudder to think about it...
 
In ... 1953 in Great Britain Harry Martindale was working on a ladder in the cellar of the building when a group of Roman soldiers walked past him along the old Roman Road which ran through the basement. Harry was so shocked that he fell from his ladder.

https://ghostwalkbrighton.co.uk/legion-of-the-damned/
 
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catseye said:
Some people feel that he may have talked up his experience somewhat. Others say that it was pure invention. Others believe he saw what he says he saw. There are many different opinions.
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Odd though that he saw these 'soldiers' from the knees up, and then some time later that basement floor had to have some construction work and an old Roman road was found underneath the floor, about 18" down.
So it would appear that those 'soldiers' were still walking on that old road.
Creepy.........
 
Ronnie Jersey said:
Odd though that he saw these 'soldiers' from the knees up, and then some time later that basement floor had to have some construction work and an old Roman road was found underneath the floor, about 18" down.
So it would appear that those 'soldiers' were still walking on that old road.
Creepy.........
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I did read something somewhere that indicated that his sighting might not have been as accurate as the general public has been led to believe. Can't really comment as it's not a pet case of mine, although it is one of those things that got me interested in the paranormal in the first place!
 
Ronnie Jersey said:
Odd though that he saw these 'soldiers' from the knees up, and then some time later that basement floor had to have some construction work and an old Roman road was found underneath the floor, about 18" down.
So it would appear that those 'soldiers' were still walking on that old road.
Creepy.........
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He also related details of the soldiers’ uniforms that were deemed incorrect at that time but in later years were proven to be correct (or so the story goeS - can anyone provide evidence of this…?).

interesting that the cellar was in a liminal state (being worked on) when the sighting happened as it has been claimed that the paranormal is most active during such activity or state of being:

For example:

https://liminalnarratives.com/2017/06/24/ghost/
 
catseye said:
I live just outside York. There are an awful lot of stories about Harry's sightings...
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catseye said:
I did read something somewhere that indicated that his sighting might not have been as accurate as the general public has been led to believe. Can't really comment as it's not a pet case of mine, although it is one of those things that got me interested in the paranormal in the first place!
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I remember this story was reported on some early evening BBC show in the 1970s and it sparked my interest in ghosts! Did Harry only go public with it a couple of decades after the original sighting in the 50s? It was only many years later that I discovered it was the Treasurer's House in York. I tried to visit earlier this year but unfortunately the cellar was closed due to the pandemic.
 
OrsonSwells said:
I remember this story was reported on some early evening BBC show in the 1970s and it sparked my interest in ghosts! Did Harry only go public with it a couple of decades after the original sighting in the 50s? It was only many years later that I discovered it was the Treasurer's House in York. I tried to visit earlier this year but unfortunately the cellar was closed due to the pandemic.
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I think he went public with the story at the time, but it's one of these that bubbles away in the background, getting raised every few years as 'proof' of ghosts, or when York fancies another go at being 'Most Haunted City in Britain' or the like. Nationwide used to do bits like this, was that where you saw it?
WeirdExeter said:
He also related details of the soldiers’ uniforms that were deemed incorrect at that time but in later years were proven to be correct (or so the story goeS - can anyone provide evidence of this…?).
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I think the details of the uniforms (and also the level at which the soliders were marching) was deemed to be incorrect, but I really can't remember where I saw or read this! I think it was a programme, where they raised the fact that Harry had been interested in the Romans in York for a long time - of course this could all be false information that I got from some scurrilous source, but I wish I could remember.
 
catseye said:
I think he went public with the story at the time, but it's one of these that bubbles away in the background, getting raised every few years as 'proof' of ghosts, or when York fancies another go at being 'Most Haunted City in Britain' or the like. Nationwide used to do bits like this, was that where you saw it?

I think the details of the uniforms (and also the level at which the soliders were marching) was deemed to be incorrect, but I really can't remember where I saw or read this! I think it was a programme, where they raised the fact that Harry had been interested in the Romans in York for a long time - of course this could all be false information that I got from some scurrilous source, but I wish I could remember.
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Some detail here:

https://www.nationaltrust.org.uk/features/by-the-look-of-you-youve-seen-the-romans

“Interestingly, Henry’s account of the men carrying round shields was at odds with contemporary ideas about how Roman soldiers were equipped. They were generally believed to have only used rectangular shields and some used this ‘fact' to discredit his story.

However, later research has revealed that during the fourth century AD the Sixth Legion was withdrawn from York and replaced by troops that carried distinctive, round shields.

In addition, later archaeological research revealed evidence of a Roman road – 18 inches below the current cellar floor.”

Also, it seems he was not the only witness to this haunting
 
WeirdExeter said:
“Interestingly, Henry’s account of the men carrying round shields was at odds with contemporary ideas about how Roman soldiers were equipped. They were generally believed to have only used rectangular shields and some used this ‘fact' to discredit his story.

However, later research has revealed that during the fourth century AD the Sixth Legion was withdrawn from York and replaced by troops that carried distinctive, round shields.
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4th-century-roman-soldier-5.jpg



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Images courtesy of Pinterest.

The York history page below depicts a similar soldier, though it won’t let me pinch the picture:

http://www.historyofyork.org.uk/themes/the-end-of-roman-york

maximus otter
 
catseye said:
I think he went public with the story at the time, but it's one of these that bubbles away in the background, getting raised every few years as 'proof' of ghosts, or when York fancies another go at being 'Most Haunted City in Britain' or the like. Nationwide used to do bits like this, was that where you saw it?

I think the details of the uniforms (and also the level at which the soliders were marching) was deemed to be incorrect, but I really can't remember where I saw or read this! I think it was a programme, where they raised the fact that Harry had been interested in the Romans in York for a long time - of course this could all be false information that I got from some scurrilous source, but I wish I could remember.
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I think the details of the uniform (shield shape? Something else too? LOL Oops just saw maximus's post) he described were at the time thought to be inaccurate and later archaeology has proved he was in fact, bang on... Forget the details. Husband's the military historian will ask if he recalls.

Also live down the road from York (hello neighbour!) and have as I think I posted on here, in the past couple of years started hearing of accounts of other sightings - multiple people - down Stonegate, at cellar level which are not widely reported. Yet. Cos I intend to write about it when I can get to the people to interview. Relative works in a Stonegate shop so she is going to have to link me up with the various people who told her the story. This is people in more than one shop, btw, with the same experiences.

There is the ghost of a little girl in the shop where she works - think she's had several encounters as have other workers and customers. Her shop stores stock on the top floor, nobody goes in the cellars of many Stonegate shops, apparently - some shops even pay to store stock elsewhere so workers don't have to go down there. I think my relative is one of the few people happy to go to their attic stockroom, alone, as well!

ETA: One of my kids worked for a while in a shop on The Shambles and he saw a few weird things there, too. Currently works a street away where he's not experienced anything - yet.
 
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Ghost In The Machine said:
I think the details of the uniform (shield shape? Something else too? LOL Oops just saw maximus's post) he described were at the time thought to be inaccurate and later archaeology has proved he was in fact, bang on... Forget the details. Husband's the military historian will ask if he recalls.

Also live down the road from York (hello neighbour!) and have as I think I posted on here, in the past couple of years started hearing of accounts of other sightings - multiple people - down Stonegate, at cellar level which are not widely reported. Yet. Cos I intend to write about it when I can get to the people to interview. Relative works in a Stonegate shop so she is going to have to link me up with the various people who told her the story. This is people in more than one shop, btw, with the same experiences.

There is the ghost of a little girl in the shop where she works - think she's had several encounters as have other workers and customers. Her shop stores stock on the top floor, nobody goes in the cellars of many Stonegate shops, apparently - some shops even pay to store stock elsewhere so workers don't have to go down there. I think my relative is one of the few people happy to go to their attic stockroom, alone, as well!

ETA: One of my kids worked for a while in a shop on The Shambles and he saw a few weird things there, too. Currently works a street away where he's not experienced anything - yet.
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Yep, lots of ghosts in York! My eldest son actually used to do one of the Ghost Walks - he subbed the regular guy when he was on holiday, so I got to go along and hear some of the stories!
 
catseye said:
Y

Yep, lots of ghosts in York! My eldest son actually used to do one of the Ghost Walks - he subbed the regular guy when he was on holiday, so I got to go along and hear some of the stories!
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We used to walk dog at night through town centre esp in winter as it has street lights unlike Back of Beyond - and we were always walking into the different ghost walks. Have lived back here 20 years now and still not done a ghost walk! Really want to.
 
Morning catseye I’m with eponastill on this one spill the beans.
I read a short story many decades ago about a roman legion that was supposed to March along a certain road and some people observing it would get carried along with it.
Anywhoo the (hero) dotty professor did the same and was missing for years and then his family saw the same legion and him with it.
 
How come ghosts get stuck to the planet? The Earth has moved through space trillions of miles and is in a different astronomical location since the romans were around.
 
Analogue Boy said:
How come ghosts get stuck to the planet? The Earth has moved through space trillions of miles and is in a different astronomical location since the romans were around.
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Because ghosts seem to be drawn to or tied to a precise location meaningful to them when alive - walls of an abbey where they spent their lives, fuselage of a doomed aeroplane, railway tracks, Roman Road, battlefield terrain etc. The fact that the Earth moves through space is irrelevant to such locations and their ghostly hangers-on.
 
blessmycottonsocks said:
Because ghosts seem to be drawn to or tied to a precise location meaningful to them when alive - walls of an abbey where they spent their lives, fuselage of a doomed aeroplane, railway tracks, Roman Road, battlefield terrain etc. The fact that the Earth moves through space is irrelevant to such locations and their ghostly hangers-on.
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As it is irrelevant, to all intents and purposes, for us as individuals (unless you have a job plotting courses for NASA or something).
 
DrPaulLee said:
Yes, lots of ghosts in York....
....but try getting the proprietors of those premises to talk about them.
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The workers will talk.:) Ah no actually, years ago I knew someone - who I met via an arcane group that met in York - whose parents owned a restaurant close by the Minster. She told me they often opened up every day to find things like the chairs had all been moved from the previous night - either from on top of the tables to the floor, or vice versa, I forget. The family were the only keyholders and no way anyone else could get in there overnight. Is still a restaurant but now owned by someone else. I know another former business owner who told me lots of similar stories and her business only survived a year or two but was in a very well known (medieval) building - now I think of it, less than a 5 minute walk from the restaurant - she had lots of similar stories. Maybe depends how well people know you - if they trust you, they'll talk. (Also ghosts = bums on seats for businesses in a tourist trap, to some extent?) In both cases these were people I knew fairly well by the time they told me their ghost stories. People we've been hearing from are workers, not business owners, though.
 
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