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The UFO Community Still Believes—And Science Is Starting To Listen

They also appear to ignore gyroscopic effects.
They are sometimes seen to wobble when stationary, and the slight 15 degree cant is a dead giveaway too; many of them exhibit it:
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Another common feature of movement is quickly moving to left and right and up and down when in place; you can see it over and over again in the articles... and Nellis footage, too, I think.
 
In a late afternoon in March in Florida. How hot does it get during the day in that place at that time? You hear about the deep south of the USA being a place that gets hot and humid - a sort of meme is of people taking informal siestas (although they'd never use such a Mexican word for it, I'm guessing) as the most sensible thing to do in the days prior to air conditioning. You see the classic memtic picture of the hillbilly or the yokel curling up for a kip in the afternoon - torn bib-front dungarees and possibly bare feet, big hat to keep the sun off, probably because it gets too hot to do any useful work.

I'm wondering - if you're a resident of one of the Deep South states - Florida is kind of like a tropical eastward extention of the Deep South? - ad you weren't on the clock or had any deadlines to meet and you had an afternoon off. Would a modern, urban Floridan on a hot quiet afternoon be inclined just to do as her ancestors did, sit in her garden, let the world go by, and perhaps fall into a light sleep? Possibly without realising it?

She says she was "paralysed with fear" as a bizarre not-quite-human intruder into her garden contemplated her and then did a bizarre thing that contradicted the usual laws of reality.

Sleep paralysis? The "night terrors" thing where you are paralysed and unable to move, and the Hag arrives, the sinister figure that can take any form, usually a sinister one? You are lying in your bed apparently awake, but cannot move a muscle until the apparition passes and you can suddenly move again - a very specific sort of nightmare experience. No reason why this can't happen during the day in sunlight if you, for instance, fall asleep in your garden on a hot afternoon without realising that you fell asleep.
It would be nice to know if she was asleep or waking up then dream states might apply.
"Hypnagogic or hypnopompic hallucinations are visual, tactile, auditory, or other sensory events, usually brief but occasionally prolonged, that occur at the transition from wakefulness to sleep (hypnagogic) or from sleep to wakefulness (hypnopompic ."
But that still begs the question of why that particular hallucination? Why a weird ugly man in a tan suit climbing invisible stairs into his ship..?
That alone is worth a question or two.
:thought:
 
They are sometimes seen to wobble when stationary, and the slight 15 degree cant is a dead giveaway too; many of them exhibit it:
View attachment 26633
Please; this image is nothing to do with UFOs. The image in the sky in this image is a stock medieval icon called the Heavenly Vortex, representing a hole opening in the sky that leads to heaven. The hole is lined with tiers of angels arranged in their various ranks and potentials; larger versions of this image show this clearly. Often the images include a shepherd looking up in awe.

It is not a depiction of a flying saucer; it would be more accurate to call it a wormhole, if you really must compare it to modern concepts of speculative science.
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Please; this image is nothing to do with UFOs. The image in the sky in this image is a stock medieval icon called the Heavenly Vortex, representing a hole opening in the sky that leads to heaven. The hole is lined with tiers of angels arranged in their various ranks and potentials; larger versions of this image show this clearly. Often the images include a shepherd looking up in awe.

It is not a depiction of a flying saucer; it would be more accurate to call it a wormhole, if you really must compare it to modern concepts of speculative science.
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View attachment 26643View attachment 26644
I am aware of the iconography, and history of the symbolism. I think we've been over it before, I know over at the other forum I've discussed it. There is no reason they can't be both. The phenomenon has probably been given a religious interpretation in the past. again, ad Nauseum from RAND:
"Sightings of unidentified foreign objects (UFOs) have been reported throughout the centuries—most of them given a religious interpretation."
Wouldn't you if you saw something amazing and didn't have science? It would be a divine sign etc., etc. "Daughter! Look! See the pilgrim's hat watching us on our way to the pilgrimage!
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Natural phenomena get lumped in too. There is even an old meteorological books describing wht are clearly UFOs as special "meteors" I've posted it before. (disc-shaped, would leave and come back and emit showers of colored light).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Augsburg_Book_of_Miracles
 
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They also wobble, and turn on edge and sometimes move back and forth and up and down quickly. As described by witnesses. I do indulge in a lot of speculation --because I don't know, and it gnaws at one after one has seen these things. I would suggest one might find a LOT of speculation on this forum. And UFOs don't hang around to be interviwed or tested.
 
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The Heavenly Vortex is a completely different phenomenon from a flying saucer or any other kind of sky chariot. It is a funnel going back into the (presumably hemispherical) surface of the sky, connecting our realm to somewhere else. If it sometimes appears tilted, that is because the artist is trying to convey a hole in a hemispherical surface, so it would naturally appear tilted from the side.

If people use ancient iconography to back up the ET hypothesis, they need to understand what the original images depicted. The Heavenly Vortex is a fascinating attempt to depict multiply-connected space, on a par with Deep Space Nine for instance. Medieval SFX.
It is not a flying saucer.
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The Heavenly Vortex is a completely different phenomenon from a flying saucer or any other kind of sky chariot. It is a funnel going back into the (presumably hemispherical) surface of the sky, connecting our realm to somewhere else. If it sometimes appears tilted, that is because the artist is trying to convey a hole in a hemispherical surface, so it would naturally appear tilted from the side.

If people use ancient iconography to back up the ET hypothesis, they need to understand what the original images depicted. The Heavenly Vortex is a fascinating attempt to depict multiply-connected space, on a par with Deep Space Nine for instance. Medieval SFX.
It is not a flying saucer.
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Then they should make it look like a vortex and not a tilted glowing object hanging in sky in daylight! :)
So, if a person living in the 12th century witnessed the phenomenon that approached the train in Monon, do you think they would attibute that to god or angels... or demons? I do. Do you think a pharaoh or army that was approached by the phenomenon at Monon (or countless other examples of the phenomenon) would attribute that phenomenon to the gods? I do. Would they also think lightning and earthquakes and meteors were divine signs? Yes.
 
And yes, there are depictions of vortices with little Putti etc. and they are also part of the religions iconoraphy associated with these depictions, but that's okay, it doesn't preclude the possibility that the phenomenon was conceived of as part of the imagery of the divine, just as natural phenomena were.
 
Man, the lists are littered with broken lances on the UFO subject. Never ends.
images
 
Just try to stick to the facts rather than shoehorning wrong interpretations onto these icons. I think it is fascinating that the medieval artists devised a way of depicting an interface between Earth and Heaven, and that it resembles very closely the wormhole imagery used by modern SF.
 
Natural phenomena get lumped in too. There is even an old meteorological books describing wht are clearly UFOs as special "meteors" I've posted it before. (disc-shaped, would leave and come back and emit showers of colored light).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Augsburg_Book_of_Miracles
The most interesting images in that book of miracles are the 'flesh-falls', which sound like good old Fortean 'fish-falls' and 'rains of frogs'. Something was going on in those days that seems to have continued into recent times. Not sure what, though.
 
The most interesting images in that book of miracles are the 'flesh-falls', which sound like good old Fortean 'fish-falls' and 'rains of frogs'. Something was going on in those days that seems to have continued into recent times. Not sure what, though.
That has got to be a treasure trove for you --decoding what those things might be. Some of the depictions of atmospheric phenomena are quite good. Its a beautiful book, up there with alchemical manuscripts.
 
BTW, have you folks ever posted bios of yourselves here on the forum? I'd love to know what drives you and some of the mods, and what others have been up to and what your background has been. Sharp folks.
 
That has got to be a treasure trove for you --decoding what those things might be. Some of the depictions of atmospheric phenomena are quite good. Its a beautiful book, up there with alchemical manuscripts.

Also, when you’re considering old manuscripts and illustrations, a lot of imagery was based around the principles of alchemy. Sun=heat and so on.
I’ve got a really good alchemy book printed by Taschen somewhere. Must dig it out.

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/1489997.Alchemy_Mysticism
 
BTW, have you folks ever posted bios of yourselves here on the forum? I'd love to know what drives you and some of the mods, and what others have been up to and what your background has been. Sharp folks.

No. Nobody needs to know or is sufficiently interested in what I’m about.
 
I am aware of the iconography, and history of the symbolism. I think we've been over it before, I know over at the other forum I've discussed it. There is no reason they can't be both. The phenomenon has probably been given a religious interpretation in the past. again, ad Nauseum from RAND:
"Sightings of unidentified foreign objects (UFOs) have been reported throughout the centuries—most of them given a religious interpretation."
Wouldn't you if you saw something amazing and didn't have science? It would be a divine sign etc., etc. "Daughter! Look! See the pilgrim's hat watching us on our way to the pilgrimage!
View attachment 26652

Natural phenomena get lumped in too. There is even an old meteorological books describing wht are clearly UFOs as special "meteors" I've posted it before. (disc-shaped, would leave and come back and emit showers of colored light).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Augsburg_Book_of_Miracles
Must admit I’ve never heard of RAND... apart from Ayn Rand. Looking at the site I see a potential promotion of complete bullshit.

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So there we have it. More muddy water.
 
According to the 2005 annual report, "about one-half of RAND's research involves national security issues". Many of the events in which RAND plays a part are based on assumptions which are hard to verify because of the lack of detail on RAND's highly classified work for defense and intelligence agencies. The RAND Corporation posts all of its unclassified reports in full on its website.
 
Isn’t there a more efficient and higher-developed form of proper scientific analysis than a rectal probe? And I am aware of anal-ysis.
That's what the implants are for. They monitor everything.
 
The ufo community actually appears to be getting rather jaded with the whole thing.

Essentially giving it up as a lost cause.

This is the impression I am getting from the sites I monitor.
 
The ufo community actually appears to be getting rather jaded with the whole thing.

Essentially giving it up as a lost cause.

This is the impression I am getting from the sites I monitor.
Does seem like interest is heading down to baseline again..
https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?q=ufo&geo=US
Without prolonged repeated incontrovertible proof like a bunch of clear intercept videos and more military encounters or a mass sighting for days again, it will always do that for folks who haven't had a convincing experience with them because they are so strange and relatively rare. Mainstream scientists will be the last to be dragged along, and this will continue to be a source of great amusement to many of us. . Everyone has already forgotten about the UFO events in the 40's (or even WWII generally for that matter), or put them in the back of their minds like my elderly friend(s) who know things or saw things. I feel sorry for folks like Schmidt and Carey and Friedman who worked so hard over the years on the subject but never ge(o)t to see one.
 
I don't think we are ready for prolonged repeated incontrovertible proof. We can barely deal with each other. Elizondo mentioned that some high-up folks had it stuck in their heads that UFOs were demonic manifestations. They're too weird and many people try to forget about seeing them. Perhaps it is unwise to go about blowing the cover on things, but it's probably put of out of our control anyway.
 
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