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Weird IHTM Tales From Reddit & Other Sites

Tunn11 said:
Tomato plants often referred to as vines (plant whose stem requires support) especially in older gardening books, maybe also because the fruit grows in clusters like grapes?

Here they are being grown in a strange vine like manner at West Dean Gardens in Sussex. (Also see FT 419 Fortean Traveller article)

View attachment 55665
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They'll go nearly as high as you let them, mine hit the lean-to roof at about 9 feet and then grown along the panels, if I let them.
 
BS3 said:
Fishing forums can be a good source of odd, if completely unverifiable, Fortean stories. Having done a bit of not-particularly-serious coarse fishing myself I guess that spending a lot of time sitting quietly in deserted places lends itself to experiencing odd stuff - plus fishing attracts quite a wide range of people.

Here's a good one posted to a carp fishing forum in 2008 - very much a 'yarn' but has a sort of understated M R James quality to it.
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Fisherman's tales are bad enough before they get onto this stuff, we're magical thinkers at the best of times. Quite a lot of them do appear to have a quality that might be to do with the kind of grey area between asleep and awake mixed in with an unfamiliar environment. I've been near panicked few times myself at night. It takes constant work to stop the limbic brain form taking over and launching into the full-on ‘orientation reflex loop’ panic, even when you know that's all it is.
 
Coal said:
Fisherman's tales are bad enough before they get onto this stuff, we're magical thinkers at the best of times. Quite a lot of them do appear to have a quality that might be to do with the kind of grey area between asleep and awake mixed in with an unfamiliar environment. I've been near panicked few times myself at night. It takes constant work to stop the limbic brain form taking over and launching into the full-on ‘orientation reflex loop’ panic, even when you know that's all it is.
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I suspect the nature of angling lends itself to a mild form of hypnosis - a dark environment, focusing intently and expectantly on a float (or an indicator light for the strange types who go in for carp fishing). It can certainly be very contemplative. There's probably an interesting study there into fishing as related to the states of consciousness under which people experience visions, hallucinations, etc.
 
BS3 said:
I suspect the nature of angling lends itself to a mild form of hypnosis - a dark environment, focusing intently and expectantly on a float (or an indicator light for the strange types who go in for carp fishing). It can certainly be very contemplative. There's probably an interesting study there into fishing as related to the states of consciousness under which people experience visions, hallucinations, etc.
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By a strange coincidence this will be covered in a chapter of my book on "fishing, weirdness, how it all came about and you're all wrong".*

I do think that watching a float can affect perception - kind of a hypnotic effect. If you watch the water beside a float intently the float can blink out of sight, I suspect it's a Troxler fade.

Certainly if there is a ripple on the water, switching gaze to dry land will tend to make the land ripple for a few moments until the eyes/ occipital lobe re-adjust. I'd have though a good ripple in twilight could easily have you jumping at presumed movements on the bank that were not there.

Then there's the vague certainly you're about to get a bite, particularly carp fishing. I put this down to smell, and possibly float and water movements that are near sub-liminal. I get an 'Oz effect' for that, had it witnessed, several times. Most odd.

* not the actual title.
 
Coal said:
By a strange coincidence this will be covered in a chapter of my book on "fishing, weirdness, how it all came about and you're all wrong".*

I do think that watching a float can affect perception - kind of a hypnotic effect. If you watch the water beside a float intently the float can blink out of sight, I suspect it's a Troxler fade.

Certainly if there is a ripple on the water, switching gaze to dry land will tend to make the land ripple for a few moments until the eyes/ occipital lobe re-adjust. I'd have though a good ripple in twilight could easily have you jumping at presumed movements on the bank that were not there.

Then there's the vague certainly you're about to get a bite, particularly carp fishing. I put this down to smell, and possibly float and water movements that are near sub-liminal. I get an 'Oz effect' for that, had it witnessed, several times. Most odd.

* not the actual title.
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I find I have to look away from the float every so often or I lose the sense of what I'm looking at. Choosing the right colour float tip for the conditions helps a bit.

I suppose it's a little like 'road hypnosis' in that focus leads to a dissociated state. If you then imagine some unusual, or at least unexpected, stimulus introduced into that state, who knows what might happen? I've always wondered about the fact the witnesses in the Pascagoula abduction case were fishing at night.
 
Lord Lucan said:
Another good thread to lose yourself in...

https://www.reddit.com/r/AskReddit/comments/v4euvx
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Personally, I think the creepiest unsolved mystery (and the most disturbing) here are the Lizzie Borden murders -
I don't know if you guys are aware of it, but her stepmother and father were found hatcheted to death inside the house in 1892.
Lizzie stood trial and was acquitted.
Whenever I look at that case online, I see a man committed the murders.
 
Ronnie Jersey said:
Personally, I think the creepiest unsolved mystery (and the most disturbing) here are the Lizzie Borden murders -
I don't know if you guys are aware of it, but her stepmother and father were found hatcheted to death inside the house in 1892.
Lizzie stood trial and was acquitted.
Whenever I look at that case online, I see a man committed the murders.
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You can even stay in the house now as it's a bed & breakfast (assuming you're not murdered through the night). If fact, the murder room itself is available as a cozy room for two!

https://lizzie-borden.com/
 
Ronnie Jersey said:
Personally, I think the creepiest unsolved mystery (and the most disturbing) here are the Lizzie Borden murders -
I don't know if you guys are aware of it, but her stepmother and father were found hatcheted to death inside the house in 1892.
Lizzie stood trial and was acquitted.
Whenever I look at that case online, I see a man committed the murders.
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I thought everyone was brought up with the rhyme
'Lizzie Borden took an axe,
Gave her father forty whacks.
When she saw what she had done,
She gave her mother forty one.'

It's an interesting case and I'm still on the fence about whether she did it or not.
 
Lord Lucan said:
You can even stay in the house now as it's a bed & breakfast (assuming you're not murdered through the night). If fact, the murder room itself is available as a cozy room for two!

https://lizzie-borden.com/
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I know, it's been open as a bed and breakfast since the 1990's.
I don't think I would want to stay in such a 'cozy' house overnight, LOL - but they do also give daily tours of the house, and I do want to see the inside of that house. I want to put my hands on the wall right next to where Mr. Borden was hacked on the sofa, in the living room, to see what I feel.
I do believe it was a man who committed the murders, and that Lizzie was aware of what was going on.
I also 'see' that Lizzie was downstairs in the basement, the night before the morning of the murders, (the basement has an unfinished ceiling) and she heard her Uncle John Morse discussing money matters and a will with her father.
That is why she went outside to the barn, and to 'eat pears' in the backyard, while her father was being murdered, she was told to.
Just my feeling on what happened.
 
BS3 said:
I find I have to look away from the float every so often or I lose the sense of what I'm looking at. Choosing the right colour float tip for the conditions helps a bit.

I suppose it's a little like 'road hypnosis' in that focus leads to a dissociated state. If you then imagine some unusual, or at least unexpected, stimulus introduced into that state, who knows what might happen? I've always wondered about the fact the witnesses in the Pascagoula abduction case were fishing at night.
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Good point on the float. I used to coarse fish on the River Shannon and would feel that trance like state as you almost willed the float to bob and sink under. Its probably why you feel so relaxed while fishing. Also same with ledgering you are so focused on the tip you enter a trance particularly on evenings near dusk with the water gently lapping against the seatbox and the distant sound of birds.
 
Feech23 said:
Good point on the float. I used to coarse fish on the River Shannon and would feel that trance like state as you almost willed the float to bob and sink under. Its probably why you feel so relaxed while fishing. Also same with ledgering you are so focused on the tip you enter a trance particularly on evenings near dusk with the water gently lapping against the seatbox and the distant sound of birds.
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I'm more of a float man and can get completely lost in the movements of the float and untangling wave/wind/fish induced movements. It's trance like, I prefer to think of it as a fugue state.

dscf4885_s.jpg
 
I've found a handful of fishing-related ones on the www.worldseafishing.com forum like this one. It includes this striking story posted by :
Hi,
A good thread. I fish mostly at night and very often on my own. Have never had any ghostly experiences whilst fishing, but have often jumped at the sudden close appearance of a fox, or once, when a small mouse jumped out of a rucksack as I went to retrieve some gear...

I've always been open to the idea of ghosts though, and used to think that if I ever saw one, I'd try to make contact...

Back in my late teens - I'm 51 now, I had passed my car test but had no car temporarily - it was off the road - and had a good mate that was a learner, so I would sit in with him, and we'd go off into Bournemouth, clubbing. Most times, we would get back to his place at 2am ish and I'd start the 1.5 mile walk home...

This particular night, it was extremely bright - full moon and clear sky, and as still as still - the sort of night where it is so quiet, it is deafening - only people that spend a lot of time out at night will know what I mean by this...

I walked down the hill, and turned into a side road - the pavement I was walking on had houses to the right, and the other side of the road was wooded for a short distance, leading to an open grassy area about 1/4 mile long, and 30 yrds wide with a stream at the edge. The other side of the stream were a few trees and then the back gardens of some large houses that were well fenced and out of view generally.

As I came to the end of the trees, I looked along the open grassy area, through the odd trees that were on the grassy side, to the far end. I became aware of a strange white shape at the far end that appeared to be moving my way. I assumed it was a patch of mist at first, but there was no wind and this was moving. Brain searching for an explanation, I reasoned that it was a couple of swans making their way back to the lake on the oposite side of the main road that I had just turned off. Unusual yes, but not impossible due to the very clear and bright night. Trouble was that swans make a lot of noise when flying and I was hearing nothing. I started to get concerned as I was running out of explanations which was making me strangely uneasy and I felt very alone....
The white shape continued to come my way, and was almost incandescent - a very bright white hazy effect. It was holding a line about 10 yrds my side of the stream and once nearer, i could see it was the shape of a person in full cloak, including hood - no features, but unmistakenly the shape of a woman - the exact negative of the old scottish widows woman in the old advert. By this time I was absolutely struck with fear and couldn't move - I was pinned up against a wooden fence about 20 yrds past the wooded area, and watched as the figure went past me. It was floating about 4 ft off the ground, making it appear to be about 12ft tall, and just vanished into thin air when it got to the trees.

I suddenly found the strength to move again, and didn't stop running until I got home - it was a really unsettling experience and one I wouldn't want to repeat again.

Because I was sitting in with my mate, there was no alcohol involved by the way...

I've thought about this many, many times since, and there is absolutely no doubt in my mind that I saw a ghost that night.

Regards,

Mart.
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There are a couple of other threads - if they're any good I'll ETA them here (I actually thought that I posted this yesterday!).

Here's another thread from the same forum.
 
catseye said:
I thought everyone was brought up with the rhyme
'Lizzie Borden took an axe,
Gave her father forty whacks.
When she saw what she had done,
She gave her mother forty one.'

It's an interesting case and I'm still on the fence about whether she did it or not.
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I don't have a lot of doubt she did do it. She was a big strong lady, had motive, had opportunity. I think she got off precisely because people couldn't get their head around a female doing something like that, although even back then there was plenty of evidence that females can be murderers too. She may have had an accomplice in the maid, though.
 
Andrew Borden was a tightwad businessman, who was worth millions in today's money.
He had mistreated people over the years and had some enemies, and he was unkind to his own family.
There is also evidence that Uncle John Morse was a con artist businessman, he was from out west and was visiting the Bordens while involved in selling horses in Massachusetts, a transaction which didn't go well.
Add to that the fact that Mark Chase saw from his business down the street the morning of the murders, a strange horse and buggy and man parked outside the Borden home for some time, also seen by others.

An interesting take on the case:

https://phayemuss.wordpress.com/2010/12/04/arthur-sherman-philips-lizzie-didnt-do-it/
 
Ronnie Jersey said:
Andrew Borden was a tightwad businessman, who was worth millions in today's money.
He had mistreated people over the years and had some enemies, and he was unkind to his own family.
There is also evidence that Uncle John Morse was a con artist businessman, he was from out west and was visiting the Bordens while involved in selling horses in Massachusetts, a transaction which didn't go well.
Add to that the fact that Mark Chase saw from his business down the street the morning of the murders, a strange horse and buggy and man parked outside the Borden home for some time, also seen by others.

An interesting take on the case:

https://phayemuss.wordpress.com/2010/12/04/arthur-sherman-philips-lizzie-didnt-do-it/
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I don't find it likely that someone with a business dispute would kill the wife first, or use that amount of overkill. If only they could have got a hold of Lizzie's dress! It's a case I'm sure modern forensics would have solved very quickly. But as it is, we'll never know for sure. At least unlike Jack the Ripper we have genuine suspects.
 
The point is that the murderer may have been looking for John Morse, got inside the house and went into his room, and who should show up but Mrs. Borden. She was cleaning Morse's room for him and making the bed when she was murdered.
This is a house with no hallways, one room leads to another. The murderer may have been looking for a hiding place also until Mr. Borden came home. He was the president of a Bank downtown, and would go out in the morning and return home later on.
Even Emma Borden, Lizzie's sister, vouched for the fact that Lizzie could never do something of this nature.
Emma was a very religious, quiet woman, and was away at the time of the murders.
The night before the murders, a disturbance was heard by neighbors at the back fence, and that basement door at the back of the house was often left unlocked.
There is also much talk about an illegitimate son Andrew Borden had, looking for money.
 
Cochise said:
I don't find it likely that someone with a business dispute would kill the wife first, or use that amount of overkill. If only they could have got a hold of Lizzie's dress! It's a case I'm sure modern forensics would have solved very quickly. But as it is, we'll never know for sure. At least unlike Jack the Ripper we have genuine suspects.
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So true, and there is even dispute over which dress Lizzie was wearing that morning.
There is also speculation about Mr. Borden's jacket, which was bundled up as a pillow under his head, that perhaps the murderer put that on, murdered him, and then took off the jacket and folded it up and stuck it under his head - but there is seemingly no information about that jacket - and if it was bloody or not. Perhaps no one thought to look at it, and the evidence it might contain.
Yes, modern forensics would have picked up hairs, dna, etc. and known who was present. LOL - back then, people were wandering all over the yard and hundreds of curiousity seekers may have destroyed valuable clues - for instance, Lizzie stated she ate pears out in the garden as her father was murdered - were those pears found on the ground? We'll never know.
 
Plenty of small vineyards in UK, we have nearly 2000 years of grape growing history! One near me just been set up and whilst the owner says rabbits can be a problem, deer are worse because a covenant on the land prevents him shooting them. Which apparently is a real frustration as he is aiming for a vintage that would work really well with venison.

maybe a fortean experience combined with wine tasting trip is in order.
 
Eyespy said:
Plenty of small vineyards in UK, we have nearly 2000 years of grape growing history! One near me just been set up and whilst the owner says rabbits can be a problem, deer are worse because a covenant on the land prevents him shooting them. Which apparently is a real frustration as he is aiming for a vintage that would work really well with venison.

maybe a fortean experience combined with wine tasting trip is in order.
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Trap them rather than shoot them?
 
Mythopoeika said:
Trap them rather than shoot them?
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Might just work with roe, although traumatic for them.

Reds? Forget it: they’re solid muscle.

If they trap muntjac or Chinese water deer, they are legally prohibited from releasing them back into the wild (they’re invasive foreign species under s.14 Wildlife and Countryside Act 1981), so what are they to do with them?

maximus otter
 
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