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Novichok In Salisbury: Secret Agents & Nerve Agents In Britain

ramonmercado said:
So how do the marines ever get realistic training with such weapons? How do they know if their biohazard suits are functioning? They engage in live fire exercises to train for actual combat and deal with radioactive materials when engaging in nuclear incident simulations.
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The key word I think is simulation. I'll bet they don't actually shoot at each other with live rounds & would doubt they'd expose themselves to highly radioactive material either without the requisite protection, & a biohazard suit probably wouldn't be it. I'm not saying it hasn't happened in the past though, what with soldiers being marched into nuclear bomb sites after detonation.

As to actual nerve agents being used in the exercise, as I said, I'm doubtful, but prepared to be wrong. You can surely test a suit's impermeability, use in action, etc without using deadly chemicals.
 
ramonmercado said:
The front door where days later a policeman with zero protection was allowed to stand with his back to the same door covered in the most potent and deadly nerve agent ever created. Does anyone think that questions should be asked about the line we're being sold?

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That is more than a tad odd, isn't it?
 
ramonmercado said:
The front door where days later a policeman with zero protection was allowed to stand with his back to the same door covered in the most potent and deadly nerve agent ever created. Does anyone think that questions should be asked about the line we're being sold?

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The door does seem unlikely doesn't it. I don't think it was "covered in", the story is it's the place where they'd detected the most contamination up to now. Whereabouts on the door & how much I don't think has been released.

Whether you have to actually touch the stuff & it's absorbed into the bloodstream or you can be quite close as long as you don't touch it I don't know.
 
hunck said:
The door does seem unlikely doesn't it. I don't think it was "covered in", the story is it's the place where they'd detected the most contamination up to now. Whereabouts on the door & how much I don't think has been released.

Whether you have to actually touch the stuff & it's absorbed into the bloodstream or you can be quite close as long as you don't touch it I don't know.
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But surely if it could still be detected even days after the policeman stood there then there was some danger. Remember the table they ate at was destroyed as were the park benches. something does not add up.
 
hunck said:
The key word I think is simulation. I'll bet they don't actually shoot at each other with live rounds & would doubt they'd expose themselves to highly radioactive material either without the requisite protection, & a biohazard suit probably wouldn't be it. I'm not saying it hasn't happened in the past though, what with soldiers being marched into nuclear bomb sites after detonation.

As to actual nerve agents being used in the exercise, as I said, I'm doubtful, but prepared to be wrong. You can surely test a suit's impermeability, use in action, etc without using deadly chemicals.
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They actually use live ammunition and shells in training, they don't deliberately try to shoot each other but accidents happen.

My whole point is that the media are ignoring this and other things like the policeman at the "contaminated" door when it doesn't match the official narrative.
 
Just because they found residue on the front door doesn't mean it was at levels dangerous to the policeman. And besides, he was posted there before the residue had been found, wasn't he?
 
GNC said:
Just because they found residue on the front door doesn't mean it was at levels dangerous to the policeman. And besides, he was posted there before the residue had been found, wasn't he?
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So many things which don't add up. Some people all too ready to say:"nothing to see here, move along now". I thought Forteans would be a tad more curious when there are holes in an official narrative.
 
GNC said:
Just because they found residue on the front door doesn't mean it was at levels dangerous to the policeman. And besides, he was posted there before the residue had been found, wasn't he?
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You mean that the residue was placed there when he was on a tea break or something? Of course, I don't really think that is what you mean....you do seem to be clutching at straws here, and that surprises me coming from you.
 
Oh, we're not saying there's nothing to see, there's plenty to see, but wild speculation is unhelpful when we don't have the bigger picture. I'm not a toxicologist and neither are you, and this is an unfolding case, so personally I'd rather wait for some kind of conclusion from an expert (or even a so-called expert) first.

Edit: Sorry, Cavynaut, your post and mine were simultaneous, but I think the above applies to what you said too.
 
Cavynaut said:
You mean that the residue was placed there when he was on a tea break or something? Of course, I don't really think that is what you mean....you do seem to be clutching at straws here, and that surprises me coming from you.
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No, it's that the residue had not been discovered yet, so they placed a cop there as they would with any other investigation.
 
ramonmercado said:
But surely if it could still be detected even days after the policeman stood there then there was some danger. Remember the table they ate at was destroyed as were the park benches. something does not add up.
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Yes, they were reportedly destroyed early on. It's all a bit murky isn't it.
 
GNC said:
Oh, we're not saying there's nothing to see, there's plenty to see, but wild speculation is unhelpful when we don't have the bigger picture. I'm not a toxicologist and neither are you, and this is an unfolding case, so personally I'd rather wait for some kind of conclusion from an expert (or even a so-called expert) first.

Edit: Sorry, Cavynaut, your post and mine were simultaneous, but I think the above applies to what you said too.
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Pointing out that (1) a bio-chemical exercise was held in the locality days before the incident, (2) that a policeman without protective gear was stationed outside the Skirpal's door AFTER a restaurant table had been destroyed, is hardly wild speculation. I'm just asking questions as any Fortean should when an official narrative has more holes than colander.
 
GNC said:
No, it's that the residue had not been discovered yet, so they placed a cop there as they would with any other investigation.
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So, we have a not very lethal nerve agent in concentrations high enough to be detected days later ( after it's been washed off a bit by rain) which kills no-one , but it's enough evidence to allow the west to take diplomatic action against a foreign power. Wassamatter....ISIS not providing enough threat at the moment?

Nah...not convinced.
 
ramonmercado said:
Pointing out that (1) a bio-chemical exercise was held in the locality days before the incident, (2) that a policeman without protective gear was stationed outside the Skirpal's door AFTER a restaurant table had been destroyed, is hardly wild speculation. I'm just asking questions as any Fortean should when an official narrative has more holes than colander.
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As I say the investigation is still taking place, so expect more revelations over the next few weeks. Maybe I'm still smarting from the WTC conspiracy theories, but I'd still exercise caution over the sadly all-too-natural mistrust of all authority these days.
 
Cavynaut said:
So, we have a not very lethal nerve agent in concentrations high enough to be detected days later ( after it's been washed off a bit by rain) which kills no-one , but it's enough evidence to allow the west to take diplomatic action against a foreign power. Wassamatter....ISIS not providing enough threat at the moment?

Nah...not convinced.
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What can I say? I'm not an expert investigating the case, but then, neither are you.
 
GNC said:
What can I say? I'm not an expert investigating the case, but then, neither are you.
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That's fair enough....but then why do they bother telling us anything? I mean, do we really need to know?
 
GNC said:
As I say the investigation is still taking place, so expect more revelations over the next few weeks. Maybe I'm still smarting from the WTC conspiracy theories, but I'd still exercise caution over the sadly all-too-natural mistrust of all authority these days.
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Oh, I fought the WTC conspiracy theorists years ago. I went to the bother of showing that there was steel in the Towers. So much that it temporarily brought down the price of scrap iron. I do believe there are still questions to answered about the slow response by the USAF.
 
According to The Daily Mail, the Skripal poisoning might be due to a breakfast cereal that Yulia had a friend bring over from Russia.

That would be embarrassing...it wasn't the door wot done it, it was ergot.
 
Cavynaut said:
According to The Daily Mail, the Skripal poisoning might be due to a breakfast cereal that Yulia had a friend bring over from Russia.

That would be embarrassing...it wasn't the door wot done it, it was ergot.
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Far be it from me to dis the mail & I couldn't be arsed to look it up there, but are they saying it was ergot naturally occurring in the cereal or someone spiked that one box with a heavy dose? If it was naturally occurring it'd be unlikely to happen in one box out of a whole batch. I'd expect to hear of mass ergot poisoning in Russia.

Also ergot is more of a hallucinogen with similarities to LSD - it can be fatal but rarely it seems. It has been used in the past for women having trouble giving birth as it provokes muscle contractions, but was abandoned due to it's unpredictable side effects!

Sounds even more unlikely than Novichok on the front door.

I wonder if Yulia will agree to meet with Russian officials as per their request - she is still a Russian citizen.
 
hunck said:
Far be it from me to dis the mail & I couldn't be arsed to look it up there, but are they saying it was ergot naturally occurring in the cereal or someone spiked that one box with a heavy dose? If it was naturally occurring it'd be unlikely to happen in one box out of a whole batch. I'd expect to hear of mass ergot poisoning in Russia.

Also ergot is more of a hallucinogen with similarities to LSD - it can be fatal but rarely it seems. It has been used in the past for women having trouble giving birth as it provokes muscle contractions, but was abandoned due to it's unpredictable side effects!

Sounds even more unlikely than Novichok on the front door.

I wonder if Yulia will agree to meet with Russian officials as per their request - she is still a Russian citizen.
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Ergot would only affect people who'd ingested it. How would the policeman be affected?
 
Kinda odd that the daughter would ask a friend to bring over foodstuffs that are readily obtainable over here.
 
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