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JerryB said:
...Not as weird as the time I swear I was watching a 'donuts on a rope' contrail being formed by something moving very fast, somewhere high to the south of London ;) But that's another story :D

Aren't those the ones that are suposed to be produced by the 'Aurora' aircraft?

I've heard that pulse jets can do something similar, though what anything powered by one of those would be doing over London in the late 20th/early 21st century is a puzzle.
 
Yep, I think such contrails have been linked to the Aurora. Make of that what you will. It was going very fast, with the contrail starting and stopping, as if the engine was being switched on or off. (I think the Aurora is assumed to have a pulse-detonation wave engine, based on an idea first used for the V1 engine of WWII). I don't think it was going over London itself - at the distance and height I saw it, it could've been out over the south somewhere, perhaps even off the coast (the weather was very fine and clear).
 
Stumbled across this. From our very own:

Debunking Chemtrail Debunkers -
The Government's Quisling Shills

Letters to the Editor
By Julian Penrod

Dear sirs:

As disreputable as it can be to engage in the unethical and underhanded, it can be as vile to know about the unscrupulous, and not acknowledge its existence.

The past few years has seen an unusual occurrence in the skies over the country.

Several or more times a month, jet planes, flying overhead, would start leaving unorthodox trails in the sky. Instead of the normal kind of contrails, usually accredited to jet aircraft, which stretch for a short distance behind the tail of the jet, and dissipate, as the sun warms and evaporates the ice crystals in the tails, these would stretch, generally, from horizon to horizon. Jets would fly overhead, spouting white, straight, thin clouds behind them, but, instead of disappearing quickly, they would persist stubbornly, forming a long path across the sky.

The lane of cloud laid, then, would start to spread, side to side. Over the space of up to several hours, it would hang in the air, expanding. As it spread, it would thin, but not enough to completely evaporate. Indeed, apparently, never does a chemtrail actually evaporate! Instead, it would form a haze, sometimes even oily in appearance, from one side of the sky to the other, marking the path the jet took, but many, many times wider.

As the substance left behind by the passing plane slowly spread across the sky, it would come to be joined by one, then another, then another, as other jets covered the same area of sky. Eventually - in a very short time, in fact! - the entire sky could be covered with a wispy haze, and what was once a crystal clear day, now wouldn,t show a single patch of blue! And what sun did manage to shine through could, often, be accompanied by an oily, multi-colored reflection from the substance now lying thickly overhead.

This has been a commonplace in the United States, and apparently, numerous other countries, as well, for about six years now! Those who examine these phenomena have termed them "chemtrails", to distinguish them from contrails, and to emphasize the evident presence of foreign substances in the clouds. Since about 1997, these tracks have been a constant presence in the skies of the country.

Sometimes, they can be in parallel lines.
Sometimes, there can be several.
Sometimes, there can be many, all at once.
Sometimes, they can be curved.
Sometimes, they can form "X",s.
Sometimes, they form "H",s.
Sometimes, they can form more elaborate patterns.
Sometimes, they will form the collections of lines called "spider webs" or "grids".
Sometimes, they will form what is called the "fan pattern".
And, often, strange and even abnormal and bizarre effects can also be observed.

And, when the trails appear, they can cause many different effects, besides ruining the appearance of a day...

Continued: http://www.rense.com/general30/deby.htm
 
Chemtrails over West Yorkshire

I have been watching the skies above my house in West Yorkshire UK for quite a few months now, and after reading and researching a lot of websites, and gaining much information on the subject, I'm sure there is cause for concern with chemtrails.
Being one of the few who is open minded enough to take such knowledge onboard I have decided to take some photo's as I have seen so many over my house in the last few months, (just to proove to myself that I'm not going mad or being sucked into the 'conspiracy' hysteria that is around and very common at the moment). I'm sure after viewing them you will also agree that something is not quite right

One of the theories (and there are a few, all of which have been written by well respected scientists) of what a chemtrail is and does, is to cool down the planet i.e weather modification. As we all know global warming is becoming more of a factor in our every day lives, so this would be a good thing surely. So why aren't the powers that be telling us so? this would definetly get votes in the coming election. Which leads me into thinking that if chemtrails are indeed 'real' then there must be a more sinsiter reason for not telling the public why these lines and cobwebs are appearing in the skies above.

What do you think ?
http://gravity2k.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/
 
I think we've had a discussion on this before. I can't understand why ordinary vapour trails have suddenly become chemtrails. They are just the water vapour trails left by aircraft, nothing more IMO.
 
Sorry, those are bog-standard clouds and contrails.

Don't people ever look at the sky until someone claims there's a conspiracy?
 
Grruff said:

This is hardly proof of any systematic conspiracy to spray nasty things over an unsuspecting population. After all the they can hardly be called secret if they publish details of what they are doing on the web.

All it shows is that on a limited basis government agencies and private companies do spray stuff. Whether this is a good thing or not is open to question but it hardly adds up to the grand theories of chemtrail fans.
 
Grruff said:
Hmm still though, I can't just dismiss what I've witnessed myself, coupled with the staggering evidence I have come across on the web..... Have you read this before? http://www.jackblood.com/index/id1.html

and this ? http://www.jackblood.com/index/id38.html :rolleyes:

Don't mistake the wealth of 'evidence' on the internet as indicative anything that's actually real.

Aside from that, the second link is discussing weather modification, a known and quite well-used process which doesn't smack of any conspiracy. It's simply used to promote the development of larger water droplets within clouds - which in turn creates rain ;)

Have a look at the chemtrails thread I linked to above. I think that adresses alot of the salient points.
 
Yep, normal clouds and contrails.

If you selected your days, you could equally prove that aircraft flying over cause clouds to dissipate. Or for it to rain. Or snow. Or whatever....
 
These are all very valid points indeed, but if you were a body of pepole controlling the who where and why's knowing you needed an 80% world reduction in population this is one sure way of doing it....
link
 
I bumped into an interesting article recently on my webly-wanderings...

Excerpts here;-

Over the past year, the Combat Diaries team have conducted a special investigation of chemtrails over Britain. With the help of specialists (some ex Royal Air Force), we conducted a 16 hour period of observation by web, telephone, and amateur radio of the skies over America and Central Europe, from first light to last light, taking into account time differences. The results were quite disturbing. It was obvious that simultaneous operation by large numbers of quite visible aircraft were being mounted over continental areas on both sides of the Atlantic. Through contacts, we managed also to get reports on this selected same day from the civilian staff of merchant and cruise ships crossing the Atlantic. They reported that sky trails were visible in whilst sailing in mid Atlantic.

Thus we concluded that chemtrails represent a continuous operation of incredible magnitude. The aircraft involved show remarkably similar characteristic and performance, though their profile we have yet to find in any book of aircraft recognition. Roughly, they resemble in shape and size the Boeing 757 (the type that crashed into the Pentagon on 9/11), but carried no markings. This is remarkable in itself, because technically it is illegal.

Illegal too?! :p

It's a fairly long piece, but I found it intriguing...

Measured by range theodolite and ex-service hand-held rangefinders, they were doing approximately the same speed at the same height. The speed was steady, quite precisely maintained, being 1200 –1400 mph. This is somewhat high for an outmoded passenger aircraft type, meant for inland short/medium range commuter flights at a top speed of 450 mph!

These things are wonders in themselves, but it is the sheer number of these pseudo 757-type aircraft that is beyond belief. On this chosen sample day, our reporters in France, Germany and Holland, Spain, Italy and Israel alone reported at noon the sky trails of no less that 234 almost identical aircraft at between 40-50,00 feet Since this hourly rate continued during the day it represented some 2340 sorties over ten hours. Worldwide, multiplying the quite reasonable factor of 10, we have 23,400 sorties per day by planes of a non-military non-supersonic configuration, travelling at speeds equivalent to the combat speed of F16 or Typhoon Euro-fighter.

By comparison, NATO figures for annual full-scale exercises amount to something like 300 (jet supersonic) combat sorties at full stretch for the same time period, involving some no more than 150 aircraft. Again, the absence of reported noise is strange. Even a single Tornado on afterburner over central London would shake the population up considerably.

Since our observers at military and civilian airfields reported no such activity by any such aircraft, we have here a modern mystery in our skies visible to all on a clear day. National airspace regulations don’t appear to be a problem at all with any country as far as these infringements are concerned.

This vast number of aircraft appear to have no detectable bases, they have no apparent air-refuelling needs, they do not carry drop tanks, and the routes appear to stretch across the sky from all compass points, often crossing one another on a pretty random basis. They appear also to have no detectible manufacturers, support base, or refuelling facilities. And they don’t appear to land or take off! Again, since no air force in the world (not even the United States Air Force) has any supersonic transport aircraft, the presence of many hundreds of supersonic transport aircraft is rather strange!



And then he get's all Fortean... :)


Our collective “not-seeing” is unusual if only because chemtrails are much more visible and more frequent than UFO visitations. We are forced to consider the idea that levels of conscious acceptance and recognition within a culture have often nothing to do with how much “evidence” is available. All anomalistic structures have this common peculiarity. Somehow, like a bioelectric switch, as a society we turn most anomalies “off” as far as social cognition is concerned. This is a most common effect. The phenomenon may be large or small, fantastic or mundane, it makes no difference. We cannot see the kitchen matchbox in front of us, say, because we are have been diverted into thinking about something else. We don’t have enough RAM to hold all our files open at the same time!

From a Fortean point of view, the phenomenon of chemtrails might enable us to construct a new and healthier definition of what we mean by “skepticism.” We might see skepticism not a revealing of mundane truth, so much as an automated control mechanism by means of which maintain a kind of wonder-management rather than differentiate fact from fiction. This was Charles Fort’s original view of the function of skepticism. It puts “doubt” in a new dynamic context rather than it being seen as a depressing semi-automated denial of all that is wondrous and magical in the world.




Full article by Colin Bennett: HERE
 
On wonders how they can tell such aircraft carry no markings when they're being observed at such high altitudes. Also, dispensing dubious chemicals over the population below would be singularly pointless at the altitudes claimed in that article.
 
"it is the sheer number of these pseudo 757-type aircraft that is beyond belief" Yup, that just about sums it up.

Though a bigger question is how you can get a plane of that size and shape to travel at "1200 –1400 mph"
Concorde could only manage 1350 mph, and that at high altitude abover 60k feet where there is less air resistance.
Now they're saying that someone has secretly built hundreds of aircraft without the benefit of streamlined aerodynamics that can manage similar speed in the thick air at 40- 50k feet - and without deafening sonic booms (Concorde couldn't fly supersonic over land because of this).

And how can they tell these are chemtrails rather than contrails?
 
Wembley said:
...

Though a bigger question is how you can get a plane of that size and shape to travel at "1200 –1400 mph" ...
For the same reason that all the air traffic controllers around the World can't see them on their radar screens, or through their binoculars.



Because they're magic! :)
 
THE WORST CHEMZ IN WEST YORKSHIRE UK

I wonder what kind of a christmas we are going to have as last month had to be the worst month of the year, we have been constantly sprayed upon day and night, I only had the chance to shoot some images over a couple of days at my friends house and a few at mine, but every morning around day break, all day long and well into the evening (it gets dark at the moment around 4.30 in the afternoon), I could see a barrage of lines in the sky, the most I have ever witnessed... see for yourself (New Images)

SITE UPDATE

http://gravity2k.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/

Will we have a Merry Chemzmas?
Click for image
Grruff
 
Contrails. Nothing dangerous there as far as 'spraying' is concerned.



(Can't this all be merged with the Chemtrails thread...?)
 
Those are some dramatic photographs, although some of the alleged chemtrails look like pretty ordinary cirrus clouds to my untrained eye. It seems to me that, as in UFO flaps, once people start believing in chemtrails they start seeing them everywhere: even, it seems, on prime-time game shows: Chemtrail Subliminals. I quote:

"After the news I thought I was going to enjoy Jeopardy but I was so distracted by the chemtrails and smeary cloudlike formations in the blue squares behind the contestants that I couldn't concentrate on the show. Wheel of Fortune followed Jeopardy. At least this show used some imagination and portrayed the chemtrail streaks as moving around in a kind of spotlight fashion"

Personally, I find that the skies look pretty much the same as they've always looked. As do tacky gameshows...
 
Am I speaking to the Government?

Guys I really don't know which skies your looking at when you say "Contrails. Nothing dangerous there" or "the alleged chemtrails look like pretty ordinary cirrus clouds to my untrained eye" c'mon... :roll: I see the media mind control is working Did you know there is a game coming out after xmas for all you Gamers...called...yes you guessed it CHEMTRAILS just to keep the divide between us belivers and you non's, can you imagine how convenient that is..how confusing its making it...Forgive my brashness but It seems to me that you really need to know the facts as then you would be a lot more concerned... This kind of spraying of heavy metals is not good for us.
 
Re: Am I speaking to the Government?

Grruff said:
Forgive my brashness but It seems to me that you really need to know the facts as then you would be a lot more concerned... This kind of spraying of heavy metals is not good for us.

Uh... forgive my ignorance on all things Chemtrail but why are they spraying heavy metals on the general public?

Oh and who are *they*?


edit- cos me grammar is horrendous
 
Re: Am I speaking to the Government?

Grruff said:
Guys I really don't know which skies your looking at when you say "Contrails. Nothing dangerous there" or "the alleged chemtrails look like pretty ordinary cirrus clouds to my untrained eye" c'mon... :roll: I see the media mind control is working Did you know there is a game coming out after xmas for all you Gamers...called...yes you guessed it CHEMTRAILS just to keep the divide between us belivers and you non's, can you imagine how convenient that is..how confusing its making it...Forgive my brashness but It seems to me that you really need to know the facts as then you would be a lot more concerned... This kind of spraying of heavy metals is not good for us.

The ol' 'if you don't agree with me you must be part of the cover-up/are being controlled' line of argument will not suffice. If you go back and read the various arguments against 'chemtrails' in this thread, it becomes pretty obvious as to why they are a useless means of dispensing any sort of chemical over the populace - especially when other, simpler, methods would be much easier :roll:
 
just fuel burn with induced drag - nothing to do with engine rotation - everything to do with exhausted gasses being fashioned by wing tip vortices .. . err that`s it really. :roll:
 
Re: Am I speaking to the Government?

Grruff said:
Guys I really don't know which skies your looking at when you say "Contrails. Nothing dangerous there" or "the alleged chemtrails look like pretty ordinary cirrus clouds to my untrained eye" c'mon... :roll: I see the media mind control is working Did you know there is a game coming out after xmas for all you Gamers...called...yes you guessed it CHEMTRAILS just to keep the divide between us belivers and you non's, can you imagine how convenient that is..how confusing its making it...Forgive my brashness but It seems to me that you really need to know the facts as then you would be a lot more concerned... This kind of spraying of heavy metals is not good for us.

Yet another conspiracy. Bah..... :roll:
 
Re: Am I speaking to the Government?

Grruff said:
I see the media mind control is working!
Nope! It aint! My television told me it wasn't!
Did you know there is a game coming out after xmas for all you Gamers...called...yes you guessed it CHEMTRAILS
Now, lemmie see ... ah, yes. It's called exploitation of a genre of paranormal interest by selling a computer game based on it. Sorry to disappoint you but it's a GAME! not reality, not mind-control - well, not for evil purposes - it's a game!

I suppose you'd take a game involving Nessie as definite proof that the Loch Ness monster is a living result of government genetic manipulation which was incidentally revealed in the film Jurassic Park.
 
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