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Owzabout That Then? The Jimmy Savile Revelations & Aftermath

I saw Sooty naked on live TV. The incident was hushed up and never re-broadcast but the trauma lives on. :(
 
We having a bit of a laugh now, but there is a serious problem - so many theorists are out there adding 2 and 2 and coming up with 17 that it risks covering up the seriousness of the genuine allegations. I'm not talking the extreme theories that most would dismiss, more that the wild suggestions of who knew / who didn't know risks making the truth unobtainable.

Given everyone now seems to say that he was a creep, had boogly eyes whatever and they never trusted him, makes you wonder where the millions who watched 'Jim'll Fix It' came from. It was the highest ranked programme in the UK at one point.

I didn't watch it. Even before I heard rumours.
 
Cochise said:
We having a bit of a laugh now, but there is a serious problem - so many theorists are out there adding 2 and 2 and coming up with 17 that it risks covering up the seriousness of the genuine allegations. I'm not talking the extreme theories that most would dismiss, more that the wild suggestions of who knew / who didn't know risks making the truth unobtainable.
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Well, according to the Mail, plod is about to arrest half the country.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... p-him.html
 
I wish Plod'd get on with it so we'd know who's really involved. Dunno about you lot, but I've got half a dozen names in the work sweepstake! :lol:

Freddie Star has said that is happy to speak to the police about sex abuse allegations against him.
 
Freddie Starr was a regular on ITV, wasn't he? That is, not the Beeb.
 
Sergeant_Pluck said:
Cochise said:
We having a bit of a laugh now, but there is a serious problem - so many theorists are out there adding 2 and 2 and coming up with 17 that it risks covering up the seriousness of the genuine allegations. I'm not talking the extreme theories that most would dismiss, more that the wild suggestions of who knew / who didn't know risks making the truth unobtainable.
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Well, according to the Mail, plod is about to arrest half the country.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... p-him.html
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The Mail article is an example of what I'm saying. It conflates having consensual sex with a willing partner not known to be under-age with the deliberate abuse of unwilling victims, possibly with menaces. Both are wrong, but I would suggest the first is not in the same league as the second.
 
That's a good point. However, the matter under discussion is not whether a lad of 19 thought the girl he was seeing was just under or just over 16, which might be a defence. It's about grown men taking advantage of girls who were very likely to be underage and not caring if they were.

That's why the comment not showing a birth certificate is so telling. They KNEW they were up to no good, but they blamed the victims. All sex abusers do that.
 
Well, some of the DJ's / band members themselves might not be much more than 19. There obviously is a line where the older person should clearly know better - where is it? 18? 21? We used not to regard people as fully adult until they were 21 or even 25 and actually I think there is some sense in that.

I've said elsewhere I don't see a problem with big age gaps, but I see a huge difference between someone in say their 40's seducing a woman of 25 and a teenager of 16, even though they are both perfectly legal.

Still this is all quite different to someone setting out to deliberately target under age victims or interfere with helpless children in hospital and I think focussing on the 'consensual sex' cases will only act to muddy the waters.
 
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/journali...il.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter


The Sunday Telegraph has established that the civil servant behind Savile's appointment to take charge of Broadmoor, the high-security hospital, was subsequently prevented from working with children.

Allegations against Savile include sexual assaults of patients at Broadmoor, where he was initially an "honorary entertainments officer".

Brian McGinnis ran the mental health division of the Department of Health and Social Services in 1987, when plans were drawn up to appoint Savile to run a taskforce overseeing the hospital.

<snip>

Mr McGinnis, now 74, was prevented from working with children by Croydon Council in 2005, when he was stopped from running a children's church group.

Three years earlier Bromley Council ended his involvement with services for children with learning difficulties.

The interventions followed police investigations into his conduct during volunteer visits to children's homes.
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Pure concidence, I'm sure.
 
Do these people have some kind of 'Paedodar' with which they can find one another? I should have thought that your highest priority - were you intent on carrying out society's most loathed crime - would be secrecy and generally keeping the whole seedy business to yourself, but I'm seeing more and more simply incredible stories of paedophiles taking over schools, insinuating more of their kind into groups and organisations and meeting up for overseas jollies. How do they smell their own?

If one were to have developed these nasty urges (and I'm especially thinking before the advent of the Internet), how would one have found accomplices, facilitators and partners in crime? Personally, I wouldn't have a clue how to find a paedophile without some kind of tip-off (jokes about the local church and scout group notwithstanding). Is this crime really lurking so nearby, on the flip-side of regular prostitution/strip-clubs/pornography perhaps? The few people I know in the wings of the 'normal' sex-industry seem every bit as intolerant of the crime as 'regular' people are - partly because they realise how toxic any association would be and how negatively it could affect their business to have a lynch mob or a public demonstration outside their pub/club/bookshop/brothel/sex-shop.

One troubling conclusion seems that these people must (however obliquely) broach the subject of interfering with children with non-paedophiles, in error, a number of times, and yet still manage to go uncaught for years. It does, as the saying goes, beggar belief. They can't all be furtive geniuses!

If this article is to be believed, the ratio of what we hear and what goes on is truly the tip-of-the-iceberg:

http://www.nickdavies.net/1998/04/01/th ... n-britain/

[Warning: perfectly respectable site, very graphic information]
 
Mob1138 said:
JamesWhitehead said:
IIRC the notorious Chris Morris show did not feature Savile, though a number of DJs were among those fooled into making ridiculous claims about paedophiles sharing the same genetic code as crabs etc!

Morris did, however, prophetically announce the death of Savile on a radio show in 1994:

That soundclip here

Savile sued, maybe sensing the danger of being dead! :)
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He didn't sue, but he threatened to proceed with legal action so Radio One refused to renew his contract. Effectively Morris was sacked
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I hope you aren't suggesting that the BBC acted in a spineless and self-serving fashion - because I just can't believe that.
 
theyithian said:
Do these people have some kind of 'Paedodar' with which they can find one another? I should have thought that your highest priority - were you intent on carrying out society's most loathed crime - would be secrecy and generally keeping the whole seedy business to yourself, but I'm seeing more and more simply incredible stories of paedophiles taking over schools, insinuating more of their kind into groups and organisations and meeting up for overseas jollies. How do they smell their own?
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Some answers here. (PDF)
 
garrick92 said:
Some answers here. (PDF)
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I thought that was a joke - y'know, Peedy F. :lol:

Sorry, can't help being so mature. ;)
 
Like rats in London, apparently Margaret Thatcher was never more than a few steps from a paedophile, during her time as Prime Minister.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...paedophile-preyed-boys-home--Hague-known.html


..... ..... .....


theyithian said:
Do these people have some kind of 'Paedodar' with which they can find one another? I should have thought that your highest priority - were you intent on carrying out society's most loathed crime - would be secrecy and generally keeping the whole seedy business to yourself, but I'm seeing more and more simply incredible stories of paedophiles taking over schools, insinuating more of their kind into groups and organisations and meeting up for overseas jollies. How do they smell their own?
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Paedar? Old School Tie network? Freemasons? Alien Reptilian Shape-Changer Conspiracy?
 
escargot1 said:
garrick92 said:
Some answers here. (PDF)
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I thought that was a joke - y'know, Peedy F. :lol:

Sorry, can't help being so mature. ;)
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Ha ha! That went through my tiny mind too! :lol:
It's a P.D. File...
 
Once at work a chap said to me he found Chloe Moretz sexy when she was playing that superhero girl in Kick Ass. Are statements like this tentative feelers? Or is it quite normal to find some kids sexy? What is the boundary - can it even be so clear?
 
tonylovell said:
Once at work a chap said to me he found Chloe Moretz sexy when she was playing that superhero girl in Kick Ass. Are statements like this tentative feelers? Or is it quite normal to find some kids sexy? What is the boundary - can it even be so clear?
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Probably says a lot more about the way young people are portrayed by the entertainment industry, these days. Portraying young kids as sexualised, swearing, ass-kicking, premature adults. Long way from the adventures of, The Famous Five. People can get easily confused, but under age, is under age.

Former child actor, Cory Feldman has had some interesting stuff to say on his experiences of being a child actor in Hollywood.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=njaniu_hshE

I doubt if he was alone in his experiences.
 
From Yith's link:

Earlier last year, the Guardian revealed the international police hunt for two unidentified men who had made the “Bjorn tape”, a chilling video which recorded their relentless sexual assault on an adolescent Dutch boy who was carried in front of the camera, limp and hooded, before being strapped into a chair where he was defenceless against the indulgence of his two attackers.

Following the story in the Guardian, which was linked to an ITV documentary, Dutch police traced Bjorn’s accent to an area in the north of Holland, where they combed through files of reported child abuse – and found him. It turned out that he had contacted the authorities a year earlier to complain that a Dutch man, whom he named, had been drugging and raping him since he was only three years old, most recently with the assistance of an English man. The Dutch man had been tried and – in the absence of the video – he had been acquitted. He had then sued Bjorn for making a malicious complaint against him. Bjorn had collapsed into mental illness and been given refuge in an orphanage.
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That really is completely f*cking evil. It wasn;t enough to violate his body, he had to go after his reality as well.
 
Some answers here. (PDF)
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I honestly gave up on that at about page 7... there's some sort of theistic agenda to it? The way it's not just dragging morality into this but also suggesting that single parents and couples where both partners work are factors?
 
With regard to what Cory Feldman had to say in the interview at the link above, that he (like fellow child actor and friend, the late Cory Haim), discovered himself at a certain stage in his career, 'surrounded by paedophiles', more from the BBC and why at least one BBC Governor had heard the rumours about Savile and made sure that Savile was kept well away from the, Children in Need appeal.
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...n-in-need-by-former-bbc-governor-8231198.html

Why Savile was barred from Children in Need, by former BBC governor

Independent. Ian Burrell Author Biography. 29 October 2012

A former head of Children in Need revealed today that paedophiles targeted the annual charity appeal “just like flies around the honey pot” and that Jimmy Savile was banned from association with the telethon.

Sir Roger Jones, a former Chairman of Children in Need and a former BBC Governor for Wales and, said he refused to let Savile “anywhere near” the appeal after being told rumours by BBC colleagues in London. “I think we all recognised he was a pretty creepy sort of character,” he said.

“When I was with Children in Need we took the decision that we didn't want him anywhere near the charity and we just stepped up our child protection policies which again would have put him at risk if he tried anything.”

The news is likely to provoke further criticism of the BBC over its failure to alert the authorities to Savile’s activities, although Sir Roger said he could do no more because “hard evidence” against the presenter “simply wasn’t there”.

His revelations that Children in Need has been targeted by paedophiles is damaging to the BBC’s charity which raises around £40m a year for disadvantaged children and young people in the United Kingdom. The annual event is only two weeks away.

“We knew that the biggest thing to guard against was the paedophiles,” Sir Roger told BBC Wales. “They were just like flies around the honey pot. Not just in the fundraising but also in the distribution of funds.”

The former governor also criticised the Director General George Entwistle for failing to ascertain details of a Newsnight investigation into allegations of child abuse by Savile, before giving the go ahead to broadcast tribute programmes to the presenter late last year. “He didn’t ask the question ‘why?’ I find that extraordinary,” said Sir Roger. “It wouldn’t have happened in my day because the guy would have been at a governors’ meeting and he would have been asked by people like me ‘why?’”

Operation Yewtree, the Metropolitan Police’s investigation into sex abuse by Savile, is looking at 400 lines of inquiry and around 300 alleged victims. At the weekend officers arrested the former Seventies pop star Gary Glitter, on suspicion of sexual offences, which he denies.

A BBC Trust spokesperson said: “The Trust shares the horror felt by the wider public about the appalling allegations of child abuse at the BBC and we are determined to get to the bottom of what happened.”

Children in Need said it was looking into the comments made by Sir Roger, a former chairman of the Welsh Development Agency, is currently pro chancellor and chair of council at Swansea University.

“Child protection is of paramount importance to the charity and is implicit in everything that we do,” said a spokesperson.
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Emphasis mine

So, the question of 'how do paedophiles recognise each other?', may be missing the point. Perhaps, it's more the case that there may be higher concentrations of paedophiles in situations and places where children are more vulnerable: “just like flies around the honey pot”. Whether it be child actors in Hollywood, immobilised patients in long stay hospitals, wayward girls isolated in institutions, or needy children who become the focus of charity appeals.
 
When you want to find predators, just look at where the best prey is. :(

I'm told they still do have some way of identifying each other... it is not well understood but they do seem to manage it pretty good in any context.
 
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