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Owzabout That Then? The Jimmy Savile Revelations & Aftermath

Analogue Boy said:
No they weren’t. A lot of women found Savile creepy even from the remote viewing on TV. There was also a joke going around back then about a young girl given a lift in his car and a ‘microphone’ punchline.
As kids we were warned about the local ’funny men’ in the area, who knew that in a mining town, they’d get the living shit kicked out of them if they tried anything.
I’ve said this before but when we used to see Savile endlessly running on TV, my mum would usually say ‘It looks like he’s doing that as a penance’.
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See, I'd argue. I don't think it was 'a lot' though certainly there were some. Savile and most certainly Harris were in 'National Treasure' category back then.
 
Cochise said:
See, I'd argue. I don't think it was 'a lot' though certainly there were some. Savile and most certainly Harris were in 'National Treasure' category back then.
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As a female who was sexually pestered by men from an age of barely puberty right through my teens, I can assure you that 'a lot' of adult women wouldn't need much convincing about rumours around any famous man.

We can spot that special soothing, grooming manner a mile off, which along with the readiness to turn any conversation around to sex guarantees he's a sleaze. Pretend chivalry like calling women lovely ladies or trying to kiss their hands is also a giveaway.

Savile taught generations of men to behave like this.
 
escargot said:
As a female who was sexually pestered by men from an age of barely puberty right through my teens, I can assure you that 'a lot' of adult women wouldn't need much convincing about rumours around any famous man.

We can spot that special soothing, grooming manner a mile off, which along with the readiness to turn any conversation around to sex guarantees he's a sleaze. Pretend chivalry like calling women lovely ladies or trying to kiss their hands is also a giveaway.

Savile taught generations of men to behave like this.
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Yes, I understand that women are much more aware of the signs than men. But I also know women (my mum for one) who thought both Savile and Harris were wonderful. In the circles I then moved that was the norm.

There's another famous man from the same era (I won't name him, he's never been charged with anything) who I've thought for decades was obviously creepy and behaves in the way you describe but again most women seem to dote on him.

Maybe it would depend on how much harassment a woman has personally been subjected to to raise the antenna, as it were? I'm only more sensitive to these issues than the average bloke because of being molested in childhood.
 
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Yup, a hand kisser for sure.

Always raises my hackles when I see that in a family friendly show; To me its shorthand for sleaze.

Anyone try that on me, they will get punched.

(Not that any would dare with me)
 
escargot said:
As a female who was sexually pestered by men from an age of barely puberty right through my teens, I can assure you that 'a lot' of adult women wouldn't need much convincing about rumours around any famous man.

We can spot that special soothing, grooming manner a mile off, which along with the readiness to turn any conversation around to sex guarantees he's a sleaze. Pretend chivalry like calling women lovely ladies or trying to kiss their hands is also a giveaway.

Savile taught generations of men to behave like this.
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Oleaginous is an apt word for this behaviour.
 
Cochise said:
..Maybe it would depend on how much harassment a woman has personally been subjected to to raise the antenna, as it were? I'm only more sensitive to these issues than the average bloke because of being molested in childhood.
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I would agree with this. My mom is someone who wouldn't have a clue about a person's real intentions if they play the game right. Though, i can't see her being impressed with someone who touches and does hand kisses:slapd:
 
Perhaps it was the perception of the different women. I'm not saying that victims of creeps were mistaken.
Perhaps the women who were fooled by the hand-kissing and faux chivalry weren't his type? In the 70's, I recall there was a compliment used by some women ... "He's got such old-fashioned/gentlemanly manners!" and were charmed by it, when most others thought it was at least odd behaviour.
Watching now TV appearances of Saville doing his 'schtick', kissing women's hands then 'jokingly' kissing up the arm, you can see all the targets are discomforted ... but they could never object because this was "Jimmy Saville" and "It's all a bit of fun!"
This last phrase, along with "It's only banter!" makes my skin crawl because it's putting the guilt of offensive behaviour onto the offended.

"It's your behaviour that's at fault, not mine!"
 
brownmane said:
I would agree with this. My mom is someone who wouldn't have a clue about a person's real intentions if they play the game right. Though, i can't see her being impressed with someone who touches and does hand kisses:slapd:
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My mother was the same, had no perception of someone's intentions, except she couldn't stand JS. I only just stopped her being scammed in her nursing home by a "real gentleman" who was so obviously up to no good it was a joke. He showed her a magazine feature of a country house in a fancy magazine and said it was his. When I pointed out it belonged to a famous person she still wouldn't believe it. But JS - wouldn't hear anything about him.
 
I remember an episode of Have I got News For You from several years before the pandemic, where Bruce Forsyth was hosting and was singing as part of the game. Part way through he touched the hair of the female guest Laura Solon, and she looked uncomfortable about it. Bruce, as far as I know, has never been accused of anything wrong, but it just gave me the creeps.
 
Tigerhawk said:
I remember an episode of Have I got News For You from several years before the pandemic, where Bruce Forsyth was hosting and was singing as part of the game. Part way through he touched the hair of the female guest Laura Solon, and she looked uncomfortable about it. Bruce, as far as I know, has never been accused of anything wrong, but it just gave me the creeps.
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Anyone nowadays should know that you don't touch anyone without their permission. The woman, on public tv, would definitely be uncomfortable about the touch, but again, how is she to call him on it in public?

He may not have thought anything about it, but his ignorance and arrogance doesn't make an excuse. Touching people without permission gives the message that you are the one in control.

As much as I hate the word, his behaviour comes from a place of entitlement, thinking that he can touch a woman's hair. He needs to update himself on how to behave in public. If not, he will set himself up for possible complaints of improper conduct.
 
brownmane said:
Anyone nowadays should know that you don't touch anyone without their permission. The woman, on public tv, would definitely be uncomfortable about the touch, but again, how is she to call him on it in public?

He may not have thought anything about it, but his ignorance and arrogance doesn't make an excuse. Touching people without permission gives the message that you are the one in control.

As much as I hate the word, his behaviour comes from a place of entitlement, thinking that he can touch a woman's hair. He needs to update himself on how to behave in public. If not, he will set himself up for possible complaints of improper conduct.
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Bruce has been dead for a few years now, and it's doubtful he behaved like Saville, the hair touching may have been harmless, but it came across as creepy.
 
I've mentioned on these boards before that my mum used to work on the main reception at St James hospital, and she had quite a lot of interaction with Saville, though she never picked up on the creepy vibes.

When I was clearing through some of my late dad's things over Christmas, I came across a rather natty brushed stainless steel candle holder, with a gift tag attached signed by none other than Sir Jingle himself...

Asked mum about it, and she told me won it in a raffle Saville held to raise money for disadvantaged kids...

Still not entirely sure what to do with it.
 
BaronHardacre said:
Still not entirely sure what to do with it.
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Tricky. I mean Saville didn't make it, and I presume the money raised actually went to charity (he was careful like that - he wanted sex not money). I mean, no one ever suggested that all the money he raised should be returned.
You could always remove the label, give it to a local raffle/charity and let its 'taint' be removed by anonymity.
 
Stormkhan said:
Tricky. I mean Saville didn't make it, and I presume the money raised actually went to charity (he was careful like that - he wanted sex not money). I mean, no one ever suggested that all the money he raised should be returned.
You could always remove the label, give it to a local raffle/charity and let its 'taint' be removed by anonymity.
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Yeah, I was thinking the charity shop route, and whilst I know its future owner would have no idea of its provenance, something just made me feel a little icky about it.

I just need to get over myself and put in the ever growing charity shop pile.

Going back to Saville himself, it is pretty odd to think of the aftermath of his death, before the revelations came into public view.
Whilst there is a lot of "I knew he was a wrong 'un" being said now (and I talk of the wider public, not these boards), let us not forget that he was treated like royalty with his coffin laid in state at The Queens Hotel here in Leeds (not the city's finest hour).

The queues were literally out of the door every day, as I would pass them on my way to work.
 
He was the most patronising children's tv presenter ever - if a child on his show was, say, nine then he'd speak to them as if they were four. However did someone who so clearly disliked children and, accordingly, struggled to relate to them, get work involving children?
 
BaronHardacre said:
Yeah, I was thinking the charity shop route, and whilst I know its future owner would have no idea of its provenance, something just made me feel a little icky about it.

I just need to get over myself and put in the ever growing charity shop pile.

Going back to Saville himself, it is pretty odd to think of the aftermath of his death, before the revelations came into public view.
Whilst there is a lot of "I knew he was a wrong 'un" being said now (and I talk of the wider public, not these boards), let us not forget that he was treated like royalty with his coffin laid in state at The Queens Hotel here in Leeds (not the city's finest hour).

The queues were literally out of the door every day, as I would pass them on my way to work.
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There are those who collect memorabilia associated with notorious figures. Maybe sell it to one of them and give the money to a charity.
 
This is a sort of generalised comment, don't bite me. On the one hand, we are no longer to touch anyone without an invite. (And i don't mean touching somewhere 'sexual' which should always have been a no-no.)

On the other hand, people of both sexes seem now to greet me with a hug, the violence of which varies depending on the height, sex and culture of the hugger. What happened to a handshake or a chaste kiss? I'm not actually all that keen on people invading my personal space without permission.

And it was only a couple of months ago some bloke in a bar thought he was entitled to grab my ass on the assumption that because I was wearing a a hat I must be gay.

It's all a bit of a conundrum, isn't it?
 
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brownmane said:
I would agree with this. My mom is someone who wouldn't have a clue about a person's real intentions if they play the game right. Though, i can't see her being impressed with someone who touches and does hand kisses:slapd:
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Shit. I've just remembered I kissed the back of the hand of my mate's wife's sister a few years ago. I was only mucking about (we all were) and I never normally kiss the back of a woman's hand. All three of these people have remained good friends and even turned up at my house uninvited to surprise party with me this New Year's Eve.. I won't be doing any hand kissing again (I wasn't planning on it anyway) now I've read people saying it's that creepy. We were all pissed, I'm English and they're Polish so maybe they thought it was a cultural difference thing?. I'm glad I got away with that now .. phew! ..

I don't know the correct spelling but I got used to hearing my mate calling his wife "Mishka". I'd just assumed that was her Polish name so one day I did the same thing to be polite and they both paused. I realised I'd somehow said something wrong so I asked him "What does Mishka mean?" .. they both laughed and he replied "It means darling". That was well embarrassing.
 
Cochise said:
This is a sort of generalised comment, don't bite me. On the one hand, we are no longer to touch anyone without an invite. (And i don't mean touching somewhere 'sexual' which should always have been a no-no.)

On the other hand, people of both sexes seem now to greet me with a hug, the violence of which varies depending on the height, sex and culture of the hugger. What happened to a handshake or a chaste kiss? I'm not actually all that keen on people invading my personal space without permission.

And it was only a couple of months ago some bloke in a bar thought he was entitled to grab my ass on the assumption that because I was wearing a a hat I must be gay.

It's all a bit of a conundrum, isn't it?
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I too, don't get the hug thingy. My nieces and nephews do it and I allow them because they are important to me. My family never hugged. Though often, as a child, I would ask my dad to tuck me in and give me a whisker rub. Nothing was ever really given without me asking specifically. We were not and are not demonstrative.

Others hugging randomly is icky to me. I have reassured good friends with a hug, but even then I ask them.
 
brownmane said:
I too, don't get the hug thingy. My nieces and nephews do it and I allow them because they are important to me. My family never hugged. Though often, as a child, I would ask my dad to tuck me in and give me a whisker rub. Nothing was ever really given without me asking specifically. We were not and are not demonstrative.

Others hugging randomly is icky to me. I have reassured good friends with a hug, but even then I ask them.
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I only ever hug people who I know are OK with it.
Handshakes for everybody else.
 
Mythopoeika said:
I only ever hug people who I know are OK with it.
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Yeah, this!

In autistic groups it's accepted without question that people can wear badges showing how much of what sort of conversation they would like. Also hug/no hug badges. Takes the guesswork out and everyone is happy. In groups I run the phrase appropriate hugs tends to be used a lot. Online you can send a brief eyebrow raise across a soccer pitch and it'll be received as full body deep-pressure HUG!
 
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My family was never demonstrative. Even as a young child, I was never hugged.
Even now, it's only lovers who I felt it was okay to touch me. I 'accept' hugs from close family. I like to hug my wife and be demonstrative because I know her family are 'huggers'.
I shake hands in formal context but, outside that, I neither touch nor like being touched. This was a problem for me in the New Year because everybody, strangers and acquaintances, seemed to feel it appropriate to shake hands!
 
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