Jonfairway
Justified & Ancient
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Err probably nowt Jerry 
Interesting topic mind
Interesting topic mind
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Techybloke said:Err probably nowt Jerry
Interesting topic mind
Urmmmmmm yes but rather random here.
I'd suggest I split that off and add it onto the Night Hag/Sleep Paralysis thread.
Agreed?
Jonfairway
Justified & Ancient
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agreed
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Techybloke said:
Yes it has come up numerous times - I link to a few articles somewhere back there (I can repost the links if you like). Abduction scenarios like that share common elements with other well known supernatural attack scenarios and a range of related parasomnia.
The thing that distrubs me is that they feel the only people they can turn to are people who interpret their experience in similar ways which only serves to reinforce that interpretation.
I might have mentioned it earlier but due to the high frequency of SP and related parasomnia in the population and the poor level of understanding and the high level unusual interpretations it might even make sense to introduce it in class discussing the various elements and getting kids to write down or tlak about their own experiences. Its distrubing enough without you thinking it is demons or aliens!!
On a wider level they could certianly benefit from a few lessons in Forteana and Forteanism at school.
A
Anonymous
Guest
NOCTURNAL ATTACK! SLEEP PARALYSIS revisited..
exact same thing happened to me as a 15 y.o. kid (here in Toronto.) Kick to the ribs (hurt for weeks) shadowy face-less entity etc.. definitely sleep paralysis..author Jorge Conesa ""Wrestling With Ghosts" indicated that "had he been aware of this material earlier" - he would have included it in his hardcover treatment on the mysterious subject of sleep paralysis. This is not your common garden-variety intruder - it's an uber-menace from beyond! Forget expert opinions ascribing S.P. as an internally manifested phenomenon - definitely externally manifest. Share your thoughts on this. Demand an explanation from the experts. This is no collective hallucination.
Houston! We have a problem
The Toronto Star
Saturday September 18, 1999
Pg. A03
Woman Confronts Attacker's 'pure evil'
Scarborough victim relives nightmare of assault in one place she should feel safe.
By Maureen Murray (Staff Reporter)
She felt she was in the presence of pure evil.
A Darkened room: a poke in the ribs; being suddenly jolted from deep sleep by a faceless, hooded figure obscured by shadows.
"Seeing the hood and no face, I could make out a figure. It just went into the pit of my stomach, the feeling of evil."
These are the words of a woman who awoke to a nightmare and the struggle of her life on a hot and sultry night in early August, finding an intruder at her bedside - the sexual predator some have dubbed the Scarborough "Bedroom Rapist."
The middle-aged woman says she was lying face down and in a deep sleep when the intruder first jabbed her in the ribs. In her groggy state, she first thought it was one of her adult children coming into her second-floor bedroom to mooch bus fare.
Then suddenly she was seized by violent hands grabbing her body and shaking her into a panicked wakefulness. "He just shook me and all of a sudden I couldn't breath," says the woman, sitting on her porch recounting the tale that has robbed her of her sense of security in her own home.
She says she didn't scream; she needed all her energy reserves to fight off the menace intent on overpowering her.
"I just focused on survival, the physical stress of resisting."
She flailed, she twisted, she struck out with an ever-increasing sense of sheer terror that she was losing the battle.
"You just resist. It takes all of your energy. It just seems to go on for so long."
Despite being a woman of large build, he had all the advantages. On his side, he had the element of surprise and the fear of a victim finding an intruder in her home.
The she felt her energy collapse. She had no wind left, her breath was gone. The predator was on the verge of getting
what he came for or worse."He could of killed me at that point," she says.
I was kaput...I had sustained as much (fighting) as I could."
As if caught in some surreal nightmare, she is unclear on what happened next. But she found herself falling from her bed, descending through the air with the intruder still in tow.
In desperation, she called out into the night; "Oh Jesus, help me."
The man suddenly turned and fled from the room. She rushed to the door to lock herself in her bedroom and he silently escaped form her home.
"He doesn't make a sound," she says of the man, who has mastered the art of being elusive.
Police continued their search yesterday along a water-runoff canal in a detailed hunt for evidence they hope will lead to the attacker.
The canal, a weed-filled ditch that encircles a large residential zone near Warden and Finch Aves., is a possible route to reach many of the homes where he has struck.
At least two of the homes he has entered back on to the canal. Others are just a short walk away.
Meanwhile, police hope that by residents turning on all possible external lights, the predator - who uses the cover of darkness - will have no place to hide.
Police Superintendent James Bamford announced the "Light The Night" program, urging residents to leave outside lights on in an effort to thwart the rapist's shadowy attacks.
"If we light the whole area up, the predator will have more trouble moving around and it will be harder for him to hide," Bamford said yesterday.
"And the better we light the place up , the better opportunity we'll have to get a better description."
According to police sources, the sexual predator rarely speaks. In all his attacks, he's only uttered about two words - and that happened during only one of his 12 break-ins since June 2.
It wasn't enough for police to properly ascertain any discernable accent.
Since the assailant, who has so far been connected to eight sexual assaults, strikes between 12:30 a.m. and 6:20 a.m., police believe he may live with someone - a girlfriend, wife or family member - who works overnight.
If that's the case, he could easily slip out and not be missed once his partner went to work, sources say. But it's only a theory, and until they catch him, police are relying on educated guesses based on years of (in)experience.
The victim can't describe his face or his smell. "He is deliberate. He carefully masks his identity."
But she can't forget the anger of his touch. "He's angry. Angry at somebody for something."
To this day, she and police are uncertain why her assailant fled. Maybe it was because he feared being identified during the fierce struggle, or perhaps he tired of her resistance.
But as far as this victim is concerned, God answered her prayers in her moment of greatest need.
'He has stolen my sense of security in my home'
She also wonders how her attacker knew she was alone. He struck shortly after her adult children went out for the night. She's convinced he had been staking out her house.
Although the attack left her sore and with bruises all over her body, what hurts most is what the predator has taken away from her.
"He has gone in, stolen my sense of security in my home...I felt safe in my house." She says it's a challenge to stay there, although a number of her adult children live with her.
Now she jolts awake at 3 a.m. to double-check that her windows are locked, and she repeatedly makes sure her doors are locked. She is looking to sell her long-time home to try and get away from the memories and sense of violation.
She is uncertain how he crept into her home. There was no forced entry. "I thought all the window were locked. But we're not exactly sure. We have no air-conditioning and it was a very, very hot night.
"I think people should be allowed to have a window open on a hot summer night."
Although the man frightened her senseless, incredibly she says that as a mother, she feels sorry for her twisted attacker. "This is somebody's son." As a religious woman, she prays for him, just as she prays he will be apprehended before he hurts anyone else. (what a nice lady! W_B)
"I just want to know what happened to him that promoted this self-destructive behavior.
"I think about it all the time. Why? Why? Why?
Papers play new rapes just like cops want
They don't ask if real Scarboro Bedroom Rapist in jail or still on the street. <click for full article
By ENZO Di MATTEO
The idea that someone other than the "Bedroom Rapist" police already have in custody may still be terrorizing a Scarborough neighborhood doesn't seem to have captured the imagination of three of this city's four daily newspapers.
Since Friday (October 29), two more sexual assaults have been reported in and around the same Warden and Sheppard neighborhood where in late September police arrested Eli Nicholas, the so-called Bedroom Rapist, after a string of attacks.
In each of the latest two attacks, police say the assailant broke into the victim's home while she was sleeping -- the same modus operandi as Nicholas's. ...... :!: :!:
exact same thing happened to me as a 15 y.o. kid (here in Toronto.) Kick to the ribs (hurt for weeks) shadowy face-less entity etc.. definitely sleep paralysis..author Jorge Conesa ""Wrestling With Ghosts" indicated that "had he been aware of this material earlier" - he would have included it in his hardcover treatment on the mysterious subject of sleep paralysis. This is not your common garden-variety intruder - it's an uber-menace from beyond! Forget expert opinions ascribing S.P. as an internally manifested phenomenon - definitely externally manifest. Share your thoughts on this. Demand an explanation from the experts. This is no collective hallucination.
Houston! We have a problem
The Toronto Star
Saturday September 18, 1999
Pg. A03
Woman Confronts Attacker's 'pure evil'
Scarborough victim relives nightmare of assault in one place she should feel safe.
By Maureen Murray (Staff Reporter)
She felt she was in the presence of pure evil.
A Darkened room: a poke in the ribs; being suddenly jolted from deep sleep by a faceless, hooded figure obscured by shadows.
"Seeing the hood and no face, I could make out a figure. It just went into the pit of my stomach, the feeling of evil."
These are the words of a woman who awoke to a nightmare and the struggle of her life on a hot and sultry night in early August, finding an intruder at her bedside - the sexual predator some have dubbed the Scarborough "Bedroom Rapist."
The middle-aged woman says she was lying face down and in a deep sleep when the intruder first jabbed her in the ribs. In her groggy state, she first thought it was one of her adult children coming into her second-floor bedroom to mooch bus fare.
Then suddenly she was seized by violent hands grabbing her body and shaking her into a panicked wakefulness. "He just shook me and all of a sudden I couldn't breath," says the woman, sitting on her porch recounting the tale that has robbed her of her sense of security in her own home.
She says she didn't scream; she needed all her energy reserves to fight off the menace intent on overpowering her.
"I just focused on survival, the physical stress of resisting."
She flailed, she twisted, she struck out with an ever-increasing sense of sheer terror that she was losing the battle.
"You just resist. It takes all of your energy. It just seems to go on for so long."
Despite being a woman of large build, he had all the advantages. On his side, he had the element of surprise and the fear of a victim finding an intruder in her home.
The she felt her energy collapse. She had no wind left, her breath was gone. The predator was on the verge of getting
what he came for or worse."He could of killed me at that point," she says.
I was kaput...I had sustained as much (fighting) as I could."
As if caught in some surreal nightmare, she is unclear on what happened next. But she found herself falling from her bed, descending through the air with the intruder still in tow.
In desperation, she called out into the night; "Oh Jesus, help me."
The man suddenly turned and fled from the room. She rushed to the door to lock herself in her bedroom and he silently escaped form her home.
"He doesn't make a sound," she says of the man, who has mastered the art of being elusive.
Police continued their search yesterday along a water-runoff canal in a detailed hunt for evidence they hope will lead to the attacker.
The canal, a weed-filled ditch that encircles a large residential zone near Warden and Finch Aves., is a possible route to reach many of the homes where he has struck.
At least two of the homes he has entered back on to the canal. Others are just a short walk away.
Meanwhile, police hope that by residents turning on all possible external lights, the predator - who uses the cover of darkness - will have no place to hide.
Police Superintendent James Bamford announced the "Light The Night" program, urging residents to leave outside lights on in an effort to thwart the rapist's shadowy attacks.
"If we light the whole area up, the predator will have more trouble moving around and it will be harder for him to hide," Bamford said yesterday.
"And the better we light the place up , the better opportunity we'll have to get a better description."
According to police sources, the sexual predator rarely speaks. In all his attacks, he's only uttered about two words - and that happened during only one of his 12 break-ins since June 2.
It wasn't enough for police to properly ascertain any discernable accent.
Since the assailant, who has so far been connected to eight sexual assaults, strikes between 12:30 a.m. and 6:20 a.m., police believe he may live with someone - a girlfriend, wife or family member - who works overnight.
If that's the case, he could easily slip out and not be missed once his partner went to work, sources say. But it's only a theory, and until they catch him, police are relying on educated guesses based on years of (in)experience.
The victim can't describe his face or his smell. "He is deliberate. He carefully masks his identity."
But she can't forget the anger of his touch. "He's angry. Angry at somebody for something."
To this day, she and police are uncertain why her assailant fled. Maybe it was because he feared being identified during the fierce struggle, or perhaps he tired of her resistance.
But as far as this victim is concerned, God answered her prayers in her moment of greatest need.
'He has stolen my sense of security in my home'
She also wonders how her attacker knew she was alone. He struck shortly after her adult children went out for the night. She's convinced he had been staking out her house.
Although the attack left her sore and with bruises all over her body, what hurts most is what the predator has taken away from her.
"He has gone in, stolen my sense of security in my home...I felt safe in my house." She says it's a challenge to stay there, although a number of her adult children live with her.
Now she jolts awake at 3 a.m. to double-check that her windows are locked, and she repeatedly makes sure her doors are locked. She is looking to sell her long-time home to try and get away from the memories and sense of violation.
She is uncertain how he crept into her home. There was no forced entry. "I thought all the window were locked. But we're not exactly sure. We have no air-conditioning and it was a very, very hot night.
"I think people should be allowed to have a window open on a hot summer night."
Although the man frightened her senseless, incredibly she says that as a mother, she feels sorry for her twisted attacker. "This is somebody's son." As a religious woman, she prays for him, just as she prays he will be apprehended before he hurts anyone else. (what a nice lady! W_B)
"I just want to know what happened to him that promoted this self-destructive behavior.
"I think about it all the time. Why? Why? Why?
Papers play new rapes just like cops want
They don't ask if real Scarboro Bedroom Rapist in jail or still on the street. <click for full article
By ENZO Di MATTEO
The idea that someone other than the "Bedroom Rapist" police already have in custody may still be terrorizing a Scarborough neighborhood doesn't seem to have captured the imagination of three of this city's four daily newspapers.
Since Friday (October 29), two more sexual assaults have been reported in and around the same Warden and Sheppard neighborhood where in late September police arrested Eli Nicholas, the so-called Bedroom Rapist, after a string of attacks.
In each of the latest two attacks, police say the assailant broke into the victim's home while she was sleeping -- the same modus operandi as Nicholas's. ...... :!: :!:
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- May 25, 2004
- Messages
- 23
Off topic, but I just wanted to say how weird it is to see my podunk community college psych professor mentioned on IHTM in a post about paranoraml nocturnal attacks!!
Jorge Conesa
http://www.angelfire.com/co/SleepParaly ... esume.html
I would be interrested in reading his book. He was a great instructor.
Jorge Conesa
http://www.angelfire.com/co/SleepParaly ... esume.html
I would be interrested in reading his book. He was a great instructor.
Welcome, Way_Beyond, and greetings from Kingston. :hello: God, how terrifying! So, you're saying that your own SP experience was similar to the MO of the (new) Scarborough Rapist?
Btw, if you don't mind, I'll add this to the Creepy Canada thread.
Btw, if you don't mind, I'll add this to the Creepy Canada thread.
A
Anonymous
Guest
Yes Sir! Only Worse - Way_Worse!
my experience was in 1977 - atleast twenty years before the one described in the newspaper article. It should be noted that the Scarboro (Scarborough) Bedroom Rapist (S.B.R.) is not to be confused with the infamous Scarboro Rapist nor the Midnight Rapist nor for that matter - the equally infamous Balcony Rapist (of Jane Doe fame.) Torontonians are familiar with all of these nefandous (unspeakable) characters.
I had submitted my story to an individual researching S.P. (presumably as a college assignment) he took the liberty of posting it. He informed me of his action - I suggested it prolly needs some clean-up (lots of stilted grammar and coloquilisms) oh well - he never responded. I've never actually re-read the entire script (too embarrassed) but I believe it to be accurate and complete - so for better or worse here is the link - this is really scary stuff - http://www.madghoul.com/ghoul/Arcanum/occult/OldHag.mhtml
http://www.nzghosts.co.nz/images/monk1.jpg
my experience was in 1977 - atleast twenty years before the one described in the newspaper article. It should be noted that the Scarboro (Scarborough) Bedroom Rapist (S.B.R.) is not to be confused with the infamous Scarboro Rapist nor the Midnight Rapist nor for that matter - the equally infamous Balcony Rapist (of Jane Doe fame.) Torontonians are familiar with all of these nefandous (unspeakable) characters.
I had submitted my story to an individual researching S.P. (presumably as a college assignment) he took the liberty of posting it. He informed me of his action - I suggested it prolly needs some clean-up (lots of stilted grammar and coloquilisms) oh well - he never responded. I've never actually re-read the entire script (too embarrassed) but I believe it to be accurate and complete - so for better or worse here is the link - this is really scary stuff - http://www.madghoul.com/ghoul/Arcanum/occult/OldHag.mhtml
http://www.nzghosts.co.nz/images/monk1.jpg
- Joined
- Aug 18, 2002
- Messages
- 19,407
Re: NOCTURNAL ATTACK! SLEEP PARALYSIS revisited..
I'm unsure what your evidence for this conclusion is. There is nothing in the reports that hasn't come up in some SP reports - the contagious aspect is unusual but it does crop up. I'm esp. reminded of that Old Hag documentary on Channel 4 (mentioned in Announcements I think) that featured an African village suffering from this.
I've also merged the thread you started with this one which as you posted the same reports before and they got moved over here.
As this all took place 6 years ago what was the final conclusion? Was there any evidence this creatured existed?
[edit: And the book is available through Amaozn (and elsewhere):
HB:
www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/14134 ... ntmagaz-21
www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1413446 ... enantmc-20
PB:
www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/14134 ... ntmagaz-21
www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1413446 ... enantmc-20 ]
Way_Beyond said:
I'm unsure what your evidence for this conclusion is. There is nothing in the reports that hasn't come up in some SP reports - the contagious aspect is unusual but it does crop up. I'm esp. reminded of that Old Hag documentary on Channel 4 (mentioned in Announcements I think) that featured an African village suffering from this.
I've also merged the thread you started with this one which as you posted the same reports before and they got moved over here.
As this all took place 6 years ago what was the final conclusion? Was there any evidence this creatured existed?
[edit: And the book is available through Amaozn (and elsewhere):
HB:
www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/14134 ... ntmagaz-21
www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1413446 ... enantmc-20
PB:
www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/14134 ... ntmagaz-21
www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/1413446 ... enantmc-20 ]
A
Anonymous
Guest
Contagious?
Only thing contagious about this ultra-malevolence is that it can readily kill you! People suggesting Sleep Paraysis as benign (strangely some experiencers suggest this) are not aware of the full potential of the shadowy face-less entity - it's a psychic vampire of the worst order - make no mistake about it. Familiarize yourselves with the following material.. no shortage of similar material to be found online.. Google for "Hmong +SUNDS" It's out there! And there exist various conspiracies of confusion and obfuscation to confuse this picture. Understanably so - we are powerless to stop it.
Only thing contagious about this ultra-malevolence is that it can readily kill you! People suggesting Sleep Paraysis as benign (strangely some experiencers suggest this) are not aware of the full potential of the shadowy face-less entity - it's a psychic vampire of the worst order - make no mistake about it. Familiarize yourselves with the following material.. no shortage of similar material to be found online.. Google for "Hmong +SUNDS" It's out there! And there exist various conspiracies of confusion and obfuscation to confuse this picture. Understanably so - we are powerless to stop it.
Last edited by a moderator:
A
Anonymous
Guest
I believe that night terrors are not caused by REM sleep, which gives you narrative type dreams. The type of dreams you have when you are being chased or feeling strong emotion etc occur during non-REM sleep - within these cycles movement is possible. However, sleep walking does appear to be REM state, however, whatever controls muscle paralysis (possibly the ascending reticular activation system) hasn't switched off properly, so movement and indeed sleepwalking can occur.
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Re: Contagious?
I am also aware of cases where nightmares induces heart attacks and other internal injuries. SUNDS could clearly be caused by SP but it could be somehting else - unfortunately you can't interview people afterwards.
I still see no evidence to suggest it is some kind of malevolent external entities.
Way_Beyond said:
I am also aware of cases where nightmares induces heart attacks and other internal injuries. SUNDS could clearly be caused by SP but it could be somehting else - unfortunately you can't interview people afterwards.
I still see no evidence to suggest it is some kind of malevolent external entities.
Last edited by a moderator:
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Week of July 9, 2005; Vol. 168, No. 2 , p. 27
Night of the Crusher
The waking nightmare of sleep paralysis propels people into a spirit world
Bruce Bower
As a college student in 1964, David J. Hufford met the dreaded Night Crusher. Exhausted from a bout of mononucleosis and studying for finals, Hufford retreated one December day to his rented, off-campus room and fell into a deep sleep. An hour later, he awoke with a start to the sound of the bedroom door creaking open—the same door he had locked and bolted before going to bed. Hufford then heard footsteps moving toward his bed and felt an evil presence. Terror gripped the young man, who couldn't move a muscle, his eyes plastered open in fright.
Without warning, the malevolent entity, whatever it was, jumped onto Hufford's chest. An oppressive weight compressed his rib cage. Breathing became difficult, and Hufford felt a pair of hands encircle his neck and start to squeeze. "I thought I was going to die," he says.
At that point, the lock on Hufford's muscles gave way. He bolted up and sprinted several blocks to take shelter in the student union. "It was very puzzling," he recalls with a strained chuckle, "but I told nobody about what happened."
Hufford's perspective on his strange encounter was transformed in 1971. He was at that time a young anthropologist studying folklore in Newfoundland, and he heard from some of the region's inhabitants about their eerily similar nighttime encounters. Locals called the threatening entity the "old hag." Most cases unfold as follows: A person wakes up paralyzed and perceives an evil presence. A hag or witch then climbs on top of the petrified victim, creating a crushing sensation on his or her chest.
It took Hufford another year to establish that what he and these people of Newfoundland had experienced corresponds to the event, lasting seconds or minutes, that sleep researchers call sleep paralysis. Although widely acknowledged among traditional cultures, sleep paralysis is one of the most prevalent yet least recognized mental phenomena for people in industrialized societies, Hufford says.
Now, more than 30 years after Hufford's discovery, sleep paralysis is beginning to attract intensive scientific attention. The March Transcultural Psychiatry included a series of papers on the condition's widespread prevalence, regional varieties, and mental-health implications.
Sleep paralysis differs from nocturnal panic, in which a person awakens in terror with no memory of a dream. Neither does sleep paralysis resemble a night terror, in which a person suddenly emerges from slumber in apparent fear, flailing and shouting, but then falls back asleep and doesn't recall the incident in the morning.
Curiously, although the word nightmare originally described sleep paralysis, it now refers to a fearful or disturbing dream, says Hufford, now at the Penn State Medical Center in Hershey, Pa. Several hundred years ago, the English referred to nighttime sensations of chest pressure from witches or other supernatural beings as the "mare," from the Anglo-Saxon merran, meaning to crush. The term eventually morphed into nightmare—the crusher who comes in the night.
Sleep paralysis embodies a universal, biologically based explanation for pervasive beliefs in spirits and supernatural beings, even in the United States, Hufford argues. The experience thrusts mentally healthy people into a bizarre, alternative world that they frequently find difficult to chalk up to a temporary brain glitch.
Hufford doesn't believe that an invisible force attacked him in his college room or during several sleep paralysis episodes that have occurred since then, but he sees the appeal of such an interpretation. "We need to deeply question 2 centuries of assumptions about the nonempirical and nonrational nature of spirit belief," he says.
Ominous presence
In the past 10 years, psychologist J. Allan Cheyne of the University of Waterloo in Canada has collected more than 28,000 tales of sleep paralysis. According to one of the chroniclers, "The first time I experienced this, I saw a shadow of a moving figure, arms outstretched, and I was absolutely sure it was supernatural and evil." Another person recalled awakening "to find a half-snake/half-human thing shouting gibberish in my ear." Yet another person reported periodically waking with a start just after falling asleep, sensing an ominous presence nearby. The tale continues: "Then, something comes over me and smothers me, as if with a pillow. I fight but I can't move. I try to scream. I wake up gasping for air."
Many who experience sleep paralysis also report sensations of floating, flying, falling, or leaving one's body. The condition's primary emotion, terror, sometimes yields to feelings of excitement, exhilaration, rapture, or ecstasy. "A small number of people, while acknowledging fear during initial episodes of sleep paralysis, come to enjoy the experience," Cheyne says.
Cheyne runs a Web site (http://watarts.uwaterloo.ca/~acheyne/S_P.html) where visitors fill out surveys about their experiences during sleep paralysis. Several thousand individuals also provide online updates about recurring episodes.
It doesn't surprise Cheyne that those who contact him seem to be average, emotionally stable folk. In surveys that he has conducted with large numbers of college students and other volunteers, about 30 percent report having experienced at least one incident of sleep paralysis. Roughly 1 in 50 people cites repeated episodes, often one or more each week. Cheyne regards the sights, sounds, and other sensations of sleep paralysis as hallucinations that share a biological kinship with dreaming.
Cheyne notes work by Japanese researcher Kazuhiko Fukuda of Fukushima University. Fukuda enlisted volunteers who had experienced many incidents of sleep paralysis. In a sleep laboratory, the Japanese team monitored the volunteers, whom they roused at various times during the night to trigger the phenomenon. The researchers found that during sleep paralysis, the brain, suddenly awake, nonetheless displays electrical responses typical of sleep characterized by rapid eye movement (REM).
Two brain systems contribute to sleep paralysis, Cheyne proposes. The most prominent one consists of inner-brain structures that monitor one's surroundings for threats and launches responses to perceived dangers. As Cheyne sees it, REM-based activation of this system, in the absence of any real threat, triggers a sense of an ominous entity lurking nearby. Other neural areas that contribute to REM-dream imagery could draw on personal and cultural knowledge to flesh out the evil presence.
A second brain system, which includes sensory and motor parts of the brain's outer layer, distinguishes one's own body and self from those of other creatures. When REM activity prods this system, a person experiences sensations of floating, flying, falling, leaving one's body, and other types of movement, Cheyne says.
Hufford, however, regards the intrusion of REM activity into awake moments as inadequate to explain sleep paralysis. Dream content during REM sleep varies greatly from one person to another, but descriptions of sleep paralysis are remarkably consistent. "I don't have a good explanation for these experiences," he says.
Pushy ghosts
Psychiatrist Devon E. Hinton has heard his share of terrifying stories. While sitting in Hinton's office in Lowell, Mass., a 48-year-old Cambodian woman recounted two such tales from her own life. The first detailed nearly weekly nocturnal events of a type known among her fellow Cambodians as "the ghost pushes you down." At these times, the woman said, she awakens from sleep unable to move. Three ghastly demons stalk into her room, each covered in fur and displaying long fangs. One of the creatures then leans close to her head; the second holds down her legs; and the third pins down her arms. She told Hinton that when these terrors befall her, she knows that the demons want to scare her to death and she feels that they might succeed.
Her second tale was even more dreadful. She told Hinton that the ghost terrors usually trigger a flashback to an actual incident that occurred more than 20 years ago. Before reaching the United States, she survived the genocidal reign of Cambodian dictator Pol Pot, who directed the slaughter of roughly 2 million Cambodians. On one occasion, the young woman witnessed soldiers escorting into a nearby clump of trees three blindfolded persons, whom she recognized as friends from her village. Soon, she heard the sickening sounds of her friends being clubbed to death.
In his therapy, Hinton, who speaks the woman's Khmer language, asked the woman to establish a connection between the two sets of stories. She told him that the three demons are the spirits of her three executed friends, who return to haunt her so that she won't forget them. She also related her worries that a sorcerer would make the spirits enter her body, causing insanity, or will instruct the spirits to place objects inside her, causing anxiety and physical illness.
Each ensuing episode of sleep paralysis over the years has intensified the woman's flashbacks, sleep difficulties, and other symptoms of what psychiatrists call post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD). Hinton says that many Cambodian refugees relive past horrors through sleep paralysis. He notes that few people discuss these incidents with their physicians. "Unless you specifically ask about sleep paralysis, you don't know that a patient has it," Hinton says.
So, Hinton surveyed people at his outpatient clinic in Lowell, which has the second-largest Cambodian population in the country. Of 100 consecutive Cambodian refugees whom Hinton saw as patients at the clinic in 2003, he notes, 42 reported currently experiencing at least one sleep-paralysis episode each year. Most reported seeing an approaching demon or other entity that created pressure on their chests and typically triggered panic attacks. Among the refugees questioned, 45 had been diagnosed with PTSD. Of those, 35 reported being afflicted by sleep paralysis, usually with at least one episode a month.
The Cambodians told Hinton that sleep paralysis permits people who suffer unjust deaths to haunt the living and creates "bad luck." These cultural ideas foster panic attacks, Hinton asserts.
Panic attacks, PTSD, and other mental disorders may indirectly promote sleep paralysis by disrupting the sleep cycle and yanking people out of REM sleep during the night, he adds. Other factors that disturb sleep, such as jet lag and shift work, have also been linked to sleep paralysis.
Psychological treatment that delves into the personal meaning of bouts of sleep paralysis reassures sufferers that these encounters aren't signs of physical illness or supernatural visits, Hinton says.
Evidence from Shanghai also supports a connection between sleep paralysis, PTSD, and panic attacks. Albert S. Yeung of Massachusetts General Hospital in Boston and his team interviewed 150 psychiatric outpatients in Shanghai. About one-quarter of these patients had experienced sleep paralysis at least once, and more than half of those with PTSD or panic attacks described incidents of sleep paralysis, according to Yeung.
However, unlike the Cambodian immigrants whom Hinton studied, nearly all of Yeung's Chinese study participants in retrospect regarded the incidents as innocuous. Most had experienced feelings of dread but didn't encounter supernatural creatures.
For African Americans who experience panic attacks, sleep paralysis is also especially common, according to community surveys conducted by psychologist Cheryl M. Paradis of Marymount Manhattan College in New York City. Although 25 percent of the African-American participants reported having experienced sleep paralysis, nearly 60 percent of blacks who had panic attacks said that they regularly experienced sleep paralysis. In contrast, sleep paralysis turned up among only 7 percent of whites who have panic attacks, Paradis says.
High stress levels in African Americans, at least partly the result of poverty and racism, contribute to anxiety, sleep problems, and sleep paralysis, she suggests.
Sexual abuse may also make a person susceptible to sleep paralysis. Harvard University psychologists Richard J. McNally and Susan A. Clancy have found that, among adults who report having been sexually abused during childhood, nearly half describe at least one past episode of sleep paralysis. In their study, only 13 percent of participants who hadn't been sexually abused reported sleep paralysis.
Long-standing sleep disturbances in those who have been sexually abused may foster the phenomenon, McNally suggests.
Alien invaders
There is a kinship between waking nightmares starring Night Crushers and reports of alien abductions, McNally and Clancy find. For more than a decade, they have been studying people who claim to have been abducted by aliens from outer space. McNally and Clancy are convinced that these claims derive from sleep-paralysis hallucinations
Accounts of space-alien encounters typically begin with the abductee waking in the night while lying face up, McNally says. The person can't move but senses electric vibrations. A feeling of terror makes breathing difficult. Alien beings advance to the foot of the bed or climb on top of the person, who then experiences a sense of floating or of being transported to an alien craft.
Days or weeks later, in response to a therapist's hypnotic suggestions, the abductee may generate details of being sexually probed or otherwise assaulted by the aliens, McNally notes.
Claims of abductions by space aliens trigger much controversy, media attention, and ridicule. The late Harvard psychiatrist John Mack fueled the hubbub by defending the accounts as descriptions of actual encounters with visitors from other planets.
There's another, far more likely, explanation for the reported experiences of the "abductees," says McNally. Traumatic encounters that a person seems to experience during sleep paralysis feel as vividly real as anything that happens during the day does, he notes.
Despite their fantastic claims, these people are mentally healthy, says McNally. "Sleep paralysis is an entirely natural phenomenon," he remarks. "In isolated cases, it's no more pathological than a case of the hiccups."
McNally and Clancy linked the claims of 10 alien abductees to episodes of sleep paralysis. Memories of the scary incidents sparked heart-rate increases and other physiological stress reactions that exceeded those previously reported for Vietnam veterans with PTSD as they recalled distressing combat events.
Even the most rational people who experience sleep paralysis often find it difficult to write off their nighttime ordeals as unreal, Hufford notes. He has interviewed many U.S. medical students who, even after hearing about REM sleep and the brain's threat-detection system, insist that their frightening meetings with the Night Crusher were real. Until sharing their stories with Hufford, most of the students had never told them to anyone.
"I suspect that millions of people in the United States are walking around never having told anybody about having these terrifying experiences," Hufford says.
That's unlikely to change anytime soon, he adds. Scientists and physicians treat reports of mingling with supernatural creatures and spirits as evidence of mental imbalance. And mainstream religions condemn connections with ghosts, demons, and evil presences.
But the world of sleep works according to its own rules. Whether shunned or embraced, Hufford says, the Night Crusher returns with frightening regularity.
--------------
References:
Cheyne, J.A. 2001. The ominous numinous: Sensed presence and 'other' hallucinations. Journal of Consciousness Studies 8:133-150. Abstract available at http://www.ingentaconnect.com/content/imp/
jcs/2001/00000008/F0030005/1203. Reprint available at http://www.nidsci.org/pdf/cheyne.pdf
Hinton, D.E., et al. 2005. 'The ghost pushes you down': Sleep paralysis-type panic attacks in a Khmer refugee population. Transcultural Psychiatry 42(March):46-77. Abstract available at http://tps.sagepub.com/cgi/content/abstract/42/1/46
Hufford, D.J. 2005. Sleep paralysis as spiritual experience. Transcultural Psychiatry 42(March):11-45. Abstract available at http://tps.sagepub.com/cgi/content/abstract/42/1/11
McNally, R.J., and S.A. Clancy. 2005. Sleep paralysis, sexual abuse, and space alien abduction. Transcultural Psychiatry 42(March):113-122. Abstract available at http://tps.sagepub.com/cgi/content/abstract/42/1/113
Paradis, C.M., and S. Friedman. 2005. Sleep paralysis in African Americans with panic disorder. Transcultural Psychiatry 42(March):123-134. Abstract available at http://tps.sagepub.com/cgi/content/abstract/42/1/123
Yeung, A., Y. Xu, and D.F. Chang. 2005. Prevalence and illness beliefs of sleep paralysis among Chinese psychiatric patients in China and the United States. ww 42(March):134-145. Abstract available at http://tps.sagepub.com/cgi/content/abstract/42/1/135
-----------------
Further Readings:
Fukuda, K., et al. 1998. The prevalence of sleep paralysis among Canadian and Japanese college students. Dreaming 8(June):59–66. Abstract available at http://dx.doi.org/10.1023/B
For J. Allan Cheyne's Web site, with extensive information about sleep paralysis, go to http://watarts.uwaterloo.ca/~acheyne/S_P.html
---------
Sources:
J. Allan Cheyne
Department of Psychology
University of Waterloo
200 University Avenue
Waterloo, ON N2L 3G1
Canada
Susan A. Clancy
INCAE
Camps Francisco de Sola
Carretera Sur
Km. 15.5 Managua
Nicaragua
Devon E. Hinton
Southeast Asian Clinic
Arbour Counseling Services
Lowell, MA 01852
David J. Hufford
Department of Humanities
Penn State College of Medicine
Hershey, PA 17033
Richard J. McNally
Department of Psychology
Harvard University
1230 William James Hall
33 Kirkland Street
Cambridge, MA 02138
Cheryl M. Paradis
Department of Psychology
Marymount Manhattan College
221 East 71st Street
New York, NY 10021
Albert S. Yeung
Massachusetts General Hospital
Depression Clinical & Research, 4th Floor
50 Staniford Street
Boston, MA 02114
-------------
From Science News, Vol. 168, No. 2, July 9, 2005, p. 27.
www.sciencenews.org/articles/20050709/bob9.asp
A
Anonymous
Guest
Does anyone know if this occurs during rem or non rem sleep?
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Gadaffi_Duck said:
See e.g.:
http://watarts.uwaterloo.ca/~acheyne/S_P2.html#SPREM
-------------
The special issue of Transcultural Psychiatry is listed here:
http://tps.sagepub.com/content/vol42/issue1/
A
Anonymous
Guest
Interesting article here
http://tinyurl.com/7duxa
or here if tinyurl misbehaves
http://sciencenews.org/articles/20050709/bob9.asp
http://tinyurl.com/7duxa
or here if tinyurl misbehaves
http://sciencenews.org/articles/20050709/bob9.asp
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From my posts above:
There is an excellent review of her new book in the current FT (FT203:62) which draws together her researcha nd ideas:
Abducted : How People Come to Believe They Were Kidnapped by Aliens
by Susan A. Clancy
www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/06740 ... ntmagaz-21
www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0674018 ... enantmc-20
There is an excellent review of her new book in the current FT (FT203:62) which draws together her researcha nd ideas:
Abducted : How People Come to Believe They Were Kidnapped by Aliens
by Susan A. Clancy
www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/ASIN/06740 ... ntmagaz-21
www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0674018 ... enantmc-20
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Two Old hag Experiences 20 Years Apart
An Englishman named Charles Stirling had a really interesting - and possibly unique - Old Hag experience. Moreover, it is one which doesn't seem to have previously appeared in the OH and Sleep Paralysis literature.
In the later 19th century he spent a night in a old British castle.
He awoke to find his chamber visited by the most repulsively hideous and evilly visaged old crone he'd ever encountered. The experience, although brief, seems to have frightened him half to death.
Twenty years passed before Stirling again stayed at this particular domicile.
The identical old witch appeared once more.
But this time she spoke.
"Here I am again after twenty years!" she cackled, just in case Stirling had forgotten.
Stirling's wife, Mrs. A. M. W. (Wilhelmina) Pickering-Stirling, included the details in her 1920s memoirs LIFE'S LITTLE DAY.
An Englishman named Charles Stirling had a really interesting - and possibly unique - Old Hag experience. Moreover, it is one which doesn't seem to have previously appeared in the OH and Sleep Paralysis literature.
In the later 19th century he spent a night in a old British castle.
He awoke to find his chamber visited by the most repulsively hideous and evilly visaged old crone he'd ever encountered. The experience, although brief, seems to have frightened him half to death.
Twenty years passed before Stirling again stayed at this particular domicile.
The identical old witch appeared once more.
But this time she spoke.
"Here I am again after twenty years!" she cackled, just in case Stirling had forgotten.
Stirling's wife, Mrs. A. M. W. (Wilhelmina) Pickering-Stirling, included the details in her 1920s memoirs LIFE'S LITTLE DAY.
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I once experienced a very trite case of sleep paralysis. I woke up to find two grey aliens leaning over me, and that I was paralysed. They proceeded to produce some sort of nozzle with a needle that they jammed into my eye. I believe I managed to blink, and when my eyes opened it was all gone.
I'm pretty sure this wasn't any actual alien abduction for a few reasons... One, I woke up toward the middle of the day, so they would have had to abduct me in broad daylight. Second, had recently watched a show on sleep paralysis and A Fire in the Sky, so the imagery was really sharp in my mind.
If it had lasted longer than it did (about ten seconds), and I hadn't known about the phenomenon, who knows what I would have thought, though.
I'm pretty sure this wasn't any actual alien abduction for a few reasons... One, I woke up toward the middle of the day, so they would have had to abduct me in broad daylight. Second, had recently watched a show on sleep paralysis and A Fire in the Sky, so the imagery was really sharp in my mind.
If it had lasted longer than it did (about ten seconds), and I hadn't known about the phenomenon, who knows what I would have thought, though.
James_H
And I like to roam the land
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Further to the post about the Scarborough Bedroom Rapist (previous page) which sounds like an extreme case of SP, and to the writer in the latest issue of FT (203, I think, in the review about alien abductions): the writer said that when he had his one episode of sleep paralysis, his mother asked the following morning is he had "felt" anything strange in the house during the night. The Scarborough thing sounds like it's widespread and consistent around an area (perhaps it is an actual rapist, but it sounds very mysterious and supernatural in some aspects).
So perhaps SP episodes are not entirely confined to individual people, but to certain times and places (see the post above about the hag appearing in the same place, with 20 years time difference). Perhaps there is a certain "soemthing in the air" that creates SP episodes?
So perhaps SP episodes are not entirely confined to individual people, but to certain times and places (see the post above about the hag appearing in the same place, with 20 years time difference). Perhaps there is a certain "soemthing in the air" that creates SP episodes?
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OH and SP
I really like H. James' approach here.
There are certain "natural" phenomena which seem to operate right over against the edge of the Paranormal or the "goblin world." Ball lightning is surely one of these, "Old Hag" is likely another.
WHY should sleep paralysis, a perfectly natural occurrence, consistently produce an illusion of an old women present in the bedchamber? Why a hideous, evil and malignant old witch? Why not a beautiful, friendly and loving young lady?
In fact, why anybody or anything at all?
I'm left with the feeling that there may be some capital-R Reality behind the Old Hag phenomenon, although that Reality may be rather Jungian or indeed Keelian.
I really like H. James' approach here.
There are certain "natural" phenomena which seem to operate right over against the edge of the Paranormal or the "goblin world." Ball lightning is surely one of these, "Old Hag" is likely another.
WHY should sleep paralysis, a perfectly natural occurrence, consistently produce an illusion of an old women present in the bedchamber? Why a hideous, evil and malignant old witch? Why not a beautiful, friendly and loving young lady?
In fact, why anybody or anything at all?
I'm left with the feeling that there may be some capital-R Reality behind the Old Hag phenomenon, although that Reality may be rather Jungian or indeed Keelian.
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Re: OH and SP
The simple answer is that sometimes (more often than not?) there is nobody at all. Also with regard to the encounters with old hags - there are a whole range of entities encountered. If you read Hufford's book one of the most eye opening things is the sheer variety of entities.
As I've argued elsewhere there can be a rather fluid contnuum of entities encountered and some like the Old Hag and the Greys tend to be easy to classify and so parts of the range will tend to be lumped into them (esp. as they have to be interpretted afterwards from wha you can recollect) making it appear like a discrete class of entity. Of course once you have defined such a class and it has got into local folklore they become what one expects and what one will more naturally interpret somethng similarish as.
And following on from what H_James it seems likely (from the evidence that Hufford gives for the cases from New Foundland) that they can be induced and they appear to be contagious (to some extent anyway). Throw in what I just mentioned about the way people might classify such enouncters and would could see a scenario where that could explain the SBR - the documentary that was on many moons ago showed a number of similar things along these lines (I'm thinking of the African tribe under attack from a single entity and the Scottish? lad who moved into his brother's bedroom and started having SP attacks even though his borther had never mentioned it and didn't have any attacks when not sleeping in that specific room). This is certainly the area that needs more study but with more data this could be one of the most fascinating areas.
OldTimeRadio said:
The simple answer is that sometimes (more often than not?) there is nobody at all. Also with regard to the encounters with old hags - there are a whole range of entities encountered. If you read Hufford's book one of the most eye opening things is the sheer variety of entities.
As I've argued elsewhere there can be a rather fluid contnuum of entities encountered and some like the Old Hag and the Greys tend to be easy to classify and so parts of the range will tend to be lumped into them (esp. as they have to be interpretted afterwards from wha you can recollect) making it appear like a discrete class of entity. Of course once you have defined such a class and it has got into local folklore they become what one expects and what one will more naturally interpret somethng similarish as.
And following on from what H_James it seems likely (from the evidence that Hufford gives for the cases from New Foundland) that they can be induced and they appear to be contagious (to some extent anyway). Throw in what I just mentioned about the way people might classify such enouncters and would could see a scenario where that could explain the SBR - the documentary that was on many moons ago showed a number of similar things along these lines (I'm thinking of the African tribe under attack from a single entity and the Scottish? lad who moved into his brother's bedroom and started having SP attacks even though his borther had never mentioned it and didn't have any attacks when not sleeping in that specific room). This is certainly the area that needs more study but with more data this could be one of the most fascinating areas.
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Clarification
I'm sorry, Emperor, but I didn't express myself as well as I might have.
I didn't mean to indicate that ONLY "Old Hags" are perceived during Sleep Paralysis episodes, but rather that they seem to be the most common and consistent type. (Hideous Old Men are sometimes perceived as well, but they seem to be a clear minority of the cases.)
Women encounter MALE entities (not neccessarily old and hideous, but oftentimes young and seductive) much more often then do men, but even among female SPers "Old Hags" still still to be more common than males of any age.
It is not the gender of the apparations which concerns me so much as the SHEER MALIGNANCY the great majority of these entities seem to ecxcude.
So, again, why should such an normal physiological process as Sleep Paralysis DO that?
I'm sorry, Emperor, but I didn't express myself as well as I might have.
I didn't mean to indicate that ONLY "Old Hags" are perceived during Sleep Paralysis episodes, but rather that they seem to be the most common and consistent type. (Hideous Old Men are sometimes perceived as well, but they seem to be a clear minority of the cases.)
Women encounter MALE entities (not neccessarily old and hideous, but oftentimes young and seductive) much more often then do men, but even among female SPers "Old Hags" still still to be more common than males of any age.
It is not the gender of the apparations which concerns me so much as the SHEER MALIGNANCY the great majority of these entities seem to ecxcude.
So, again, why should such an normal physiological process as Sleep Paralysis DO that?
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Sorry
Apologies - "exude," of course, not "ecxcude." I have vision problems which make the screen fuzzy.
I'm reminded of the old newspaper retraction which apologized for describing Inspector Jenkins as "a DEFECTIVE on our police force."
"What we meant to say is that he is a detective on our police FARCE."
Apologies - "exude," of course, not "ecxcude." I have vision problems which make the screen fuzzy.
I'm reminded of the old newspaper retraction which apologized for describing Inspector Jenkins as "a DEFECTIVE on our police force."
"What we meant to say is that he is a detective on our police FARCE."
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Re: Clarification
While the data suggests a much wider range of entities than most people think (and I remain to be convinced that they are the most commonly encountered entity except possibly purely as an artefct of the classifcation process itself) this malignancy does seem to be one of the key factors (and is far more common than the appearance an actual entity). There is no agreed explanation but the best idea is one from the principle researchers and in much the same way that the sleep process (paralysis/awake) breaks down something also seems to go wrong with the threat response system:
From the article I quote in full above:
---------------
Even when no entity is actually seen the experience can be expressed in terms of the entity (a lot of Huffords case refer to a "Hag" experience which doesn't actually include an actual old hag just the more physical elements of SP). I suppose if you wake up and you can't move or breath properly and it feels like you are being pinned down then you're mind would possibly infer an entity - I wonder if it is a bit like when you really need a wee and you seem to have this dream of going to a toilet but not being able to wee - your brain sort of fills in the blanks to build a coherent experience from scattered bits and bobs. You are "awake" but paralysed which is going to be a terrifying experience. Often more hallucinatory elements are at work which would also tend to be shaped by this creating an actual sinister figure (mine specifically pinning me down). It might also explain why sometimes people have a more euphoric experience if the elements combine to suggest something less sinister causing other parts of the brain to start firing off.
OldTimeRadio said:
While the data suggests a much wider range of entities than most people think (and I remain to be convinced that they are the most commonly encountered entity except possibly purely as an artefct of the classifcation process itself) this malignancy does seem to be one of the key factors (and is far more common than the appearance an actual entity). There is no agreed explanation but the best idea is one from the principle researchers and in much the same way that the sleep process (paralysis/awake) breaks down something also seems to go wrong with the threat response system:
From the article I quote in full above:
---------------
Even when no entity is actually seen the experience can be expressed in terms of the entity (a lot of Huffords case refer to a "Hag" experience which doesn't actually include an actual old hag just the more physical elements of SP). I suppose if you wake up and you can't move or breath properly and it feels like you are being pinned down then you're mind would possibly infer an entity - I wonder if it is a bit like when you really need a wee and you seem to have this dream of going to a toilet but not being able to wee - your brain sort of fills in the blanks to build a coherent experience from scattered bits and bobs. You are "awake" but paralysed which is going to be a terrifying experience. Often more hallucinatory elements are at work which would also tend to be shaped by this creating an actual sinister figure (mine specifically pinning me down). It might also explain why sometimes people have a more euphoric experience if the elements combine to suggest something less sinister causing other parts of the brain to start firing off.
Graylien
As if!
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I'm not quite sure if this belongs here or on the sleep paralysis thread, but I especially like the totally meaningless 'message' imparted by the little entity:
Incidentally, the entity's apparel reminds me more of a Leprecaun than of someone from the "American Revolutionary era".
Incidentally, the entity's apparel reminds me more of a Leprecaun than of someone from the "American Revolutionary era".
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"Breaking" the Night-Mare
I've had a lot of experience with old hag/sleep paralysis. For a period of about 3 years, from ages 12-15, I would have at least one OH episode a week.
I would be lying in bed asleep and then I would suddenly awake and realize that I couldn't move. I could only open and shut my eyes and lift my head just a little. I could see around my room, and it was as real as if I was awake. If I rearranged during the day, the OH dream would reflect the new room setup. One time I had a helium balloon in my room, and in my OH episode, I saw it bobbing across the ceiling. I could hear real-time, real-life noises from the world outside--train whistles, car horns, rain and thunder if it was storming. In every episode I was certain that I was awake and conscious.
All my OH dreams started the same way. I'd awake and hear this great frenzied whooshing noise from outside my bedroom door--in my head I'd think of it a "spectral tornado." I could hear it coming closer to the door and then the bedroom door would blow open, revealing-- nothing except an unnatural darkness and a horrible feeling that something dreadful was in that darkness. But all the while I could hear this horrible hungry wind.
In one variation of the dream, the tornado would continue to spin outside my doorway and slowly, everything in my room would be sucked into its mouth. It seemed to be pulling even the air out of the room. As it grew stronger I would find it hard to breathe. Eventually my blankets and top sheets would fly into the doorway. I would be left clinging to my bed, but soon the tornado's vacuum would suck me in as well. In this version of the dream, I always woke up just as my body crossed the threshhold of my room.
In the other version of the dream, the spectral tornado would spin into my room, becoming smaller, but more dense, more malignant as it got closer to me. I couldn't see it, but I could feel--not physically, but psychically, or spiritually. I felt like I was being surrounded on all sides, encased by an invisible cocoon. It seemed like this entity was trying to enter my body to possess me. I would fight it for what seemed like hours, saying various prayers in my mind over and over until it felt like both myself and the entity were exhausted. Then, always just before dawn, as the eastern sky was getting light, the "presence" of the entity would disappear. I would wake up for real and realize that I had been dreaming.
As I said, this went on for almost three years. While dreaming, I was completely unable to tell that these events weren't actually happening--even though I had no doubt, after I woke up, that it had been a dream. Finally, I found a way to combat the phenomenon, completely by accident.
I was having one of my episodes and a part of me, even in the midst of being convinced that the attack was real, just decided f*ck it--I'm sick of this. And I just gave up on my resistance, and let the presence "win". Immediately after, the OH dream turned into the most wonderful flying dream.
With each OH episode I would remember to "give up" a little earlier, until I actually started to look forward to OH dreams, because I knew I could turn them into flying dreams, and from there started to learn enough dream control to begin dreaming lucidly.
Since then I have had periodic outbreaks of OH after a long dormant period--this was usually associated with a change of abode. I would endure a couple of unpleasant episodes before I remembered how to "ride" the nightmares again, and soon after that the OH dreams would go dormant again.
I'm 40 now and still have one or two old hag episodes a year, which is unfortunate, because they had become guaranteed springboards to lucid and flying dreams.
For any of you who are really bothered by this phenomenon, the book Creative Dreaming helped me a lot. The techniques really work.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0684801728/
[Emp edit: Shortening longish link]
I've had a lot of experience with old hag/sleep paralysis. For a period of about 3 years, from ages 12-15, I would have at least one OH episode a week.
I would be lying in bed asleep and then I would suddenly awake and realize that I couldn't move. I could only open and shut my eyes and lift my head just a little. I could see around my room, and it was as real as if I was awake. If I rearranged during the day, the OH dream would reflect the new room setup. One time I had a helium balloon in my room, and in my OH episode, I saw it bobbing across the ceiling. I could hear real-time, real-life noises from the world outside--train whistles, car horns, rain and thunder if it was storming. In every episode I was certain that I was awake and conscious.
All my OH dreams started the same way. I'd awake and hear this great frenzied whooshing noise from outside my bedroom door--in my head I'd think of it a "spectral tornado." I could hear it coming closer to the door and then the bedroom door would blow open, revealing-- nothing except an unnatural darkness and a horrible feeling that something dreadful was in that darkness. But all the while I could hear this horrible hungry wind.
In one variation of the dream, the tornado would continue to spin outside my doorway and slowly, everything in my room would be sucked into its mouth. It seemed to be pulling even the air out of the room. As it grew stronger I would find it hard to breathe. Eventually my blankets and top sheets would fly into the doorway. I would be left clinging to my bed, but soon the tornado's vacuum would suck me in as well. In this version of the dream, I always woke up just as my body crossed the threshhold of my room.
In the other version of the dream, the spectral tornado would spin into my room, becoming smaller, but more dense, more malignant as it got closer to me. I couldn't see it, but I could feel--not physically, but psychically, or spiritually. I felt like I was being surrounded on all sides, encased by an invisible cocoon. It seemed like this entity was trying to enter my body to possess me. I would fight it for what seemed like hours, saying various prayers in my mind over and over until it felt like both myself and the entity were exhausted. Then, always just before dawn, as the eastern sky was getting light, the "presence" of the entity would disappear. I would wake up for real and realize that I had been dreaming.
As I said, this went on for almost three years. While dreaming, I was completely unable to tell that these events weren't actually happening--even though I had no doubt, after I woke up, that it had been a dream. Finally, I found a way to combat the phenomenon, completely by accident.
I was having one of my episodes and a part of me, even in the midst of being convinced that the attack was real, just decided f*ck it--I'm sick of this. And I just gave up on my resistance, and let the presence "win". Immediately after, the OH dream turned into the most wonderful flying dream.
With each OH episode I would remember to "give up" a little earlier, until I actually started to look forward to OH dreams, because I knew I could turn them into flying dreams, and from there started to learn enough dream control to begin dreaming lucidly.
Since then I have had periodic outbreaks of OH after a long dormant period--this was usually associated with a change of abode. I would endure a couple of unpleasant episodes before I remembered how to "ride" the nightmares again, and soon after that the OH dreams would go dormant again.
I'm 40 now and still have one or two old hag episodes a year, which is unfortunate, because they had become guaranteed springboards to lucid and flying dreams.
For any of you who are really bothered by this phenomenon, the book Creative Dreaming helped me a lot. The techniques really work.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0684801728/
[Emp edit: Shortening longish link]
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- Aug 18, 2002
- Messages
- 19,407
tattooted: Fascinating stuff and a very interetsing variation on the theme. Have you dropped the experiences into the SP researcher at the University of Waterloo (details above)? I'd have thought they'd be very interested in them.
Its also good to hear you managed to overcome these dreams - there are a number of techniques people have used although they don't work or everyone it is still good to hear that some people can find a way around these kinds of dreams.
Are your OH dreams still of the spectral tornado-type when they occur?
Its also good to hear you managed to overcome these dreams - there are a number of techniques people have used although they don't work or everyone it is still good to hear that some people can find a way around these kinds of dreams.
Are your OH dreams still of the spectral tornado-type when they occur?