The Pyramids Of Giza

Heckler

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#91
Timble2 said:
I don't think it's so much keeping Zahi Hawass in a job as keeping him onside, as he has the power to stop them doing any research. He's one of the variety of academics/administrators, who manages to his name on all the publications in the field, without actually doing anything and is determined to take credit for everything that's discovered.
Any documentaries on Egypt seem to rapidly degnerate into the Zahi Hawass show, no matter how outlandish the theory on display.
 

markclaire

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#92
Hall Of Records

This subject absolutely fascinates me.

I've tried, over some time, to read as much info as possible on this mysterious chambers that may or may not exist under the Pyramids of Egypt.

I remember seeing a documentary once where they sent a small camera down a shaft and discovered a door way, and beyond that a chamber they believed was flooded with water. I can't remember if they could see a door the other side.

It does all seem very hush hush regarding this. Maybe it is just the subject matter, or maybe the Egyptian authorities aren't too keen on this room being found, since it could, in a sense, destroy religion as we know it.

Has anyone found any websites or footage regarding this? It is the stuff of day dreams as to what they may/may not find in there, if they ever find it.

RS
 

McAvennie

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#93
I remember watching on Discovery Channel when they went through one blocked tunnel live only to discover another slab of rock right behind.

From my own personal experience I found the Pyramids themselves pretty dull*, presumably there are more tunnels and rooms that are not open to the public but it seemed like a long scrabble down and then a long scrabble up to find a plain empty room with an empty stone tomb in it.

Maybe our guide just took us in the dull part, I remember one of the other Pyramids having an entrance a few steps up that we didn't get to go in.

It fascinates me what may be stored away underneath the Pyramids and what is behind those blocked off areas, sadly though i think the truth is probably less interesting than the myth. While there is an unknown something behind a blocked tunnel we are free to conjure up all sorts of ideas as to what may be in there. Once we manage to see on the other side I'd wager it is most likely to just be a dead end tunnel or an empty room.
:(

* The interior that is, the exterior was endlessly fascinating.
 

AngelAlice

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#94
Heckler20 said:
Timble2 said:
I don't think it's so much keeping Zahi Hawass in a job as keeping him onside, as he has the power to stop them doing any research. He's one of the variety of academics/administrators, who manages to his name on all the publications in the field, without actually doing anything and is determined to take credit for everything that's discovered.
Any documentaries on Egypt seem to rapidly degnerate into the Zahi Hawass show, no matter how outlandish the theory on display.
Yes, and he's not really a force for enlightenment is he. It seems to me between his "I have all the answers so just take my word" reductionism and the "oh my God, it was all ALIENS!" madness there are just so many valid and fascinating questions going unanswered. You don't have to be a believer in Ancient Aliens to think the total absence of tomb-inscriptions, the apparent water-damage on the sphinx, and other anomalies just might be worth thinking about, but that kind of moderation seems to get precious little airtime.
 

Mythopoeika

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#95
Timble2 said:
I don't think it's so much keeping Zahi Hawass in a job as keeping him onside, as he has the power to stop them doing any research. He's one of the variety of academics/administrators, who manages to his name on all the publications in the field, without actually doing anything and is determined to take credit for everything that's discovered.
Uh yeah, Timble said it so much better than me.
It's what I meant with my previous comment.
 

EnolaGaia

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#96
These alternative theorists' actions don't help in any way, and might well result in further restrictions impeding research ... :roll:

(The concluding section is a skeptic's rebuttal of their theories, so take or leave it as you wish ...)

Great Pyramid at Giza Vandalized to 'Prove' Conspiracy Theory

Dominique Goerlitz and Stefan Erdmann who visited the Egyptian pyramids in April 2013 now face criminal charges for their attempt to prove their "alternative history" conspiracy theories through vandalism.

The men are apparently convinced the cartouche identifying Khufu as the creator of the Great Pyramid at Giza is a fake.

Two German men who visited the Egyptian pyramids in April 2013 now face criminal charges for their attempt to prove their "alternative history" conspiracy theories through vandalism. The men, Dominique Goerlitz and Stefan Erdmann, were joined by a third German, a filmmaker who accompanied them to document their "discoveries."

The men were allowed to enter the inner chambers of the Great Pyramid at Giza normally off-limits to the public and restricted to authorized archaeologists and Egyptologists. The group reportedly took several items from the pyramids, including taking samples of a cartouche (identifying inscription) of the pharaoh Khufu, also known as Cheops. Goerlitz and Erdmann, who are not archaeologists but have instead been described as "hobbyists," allegedly smuggled the artifacts out of the country in violation of strict antiquities laws, according to news reports.

In addition to the three Germans, six Egyptians are being held in connection with the case, including several guards and inspectors from the Egyptian Antiquities Ministry who allowed the men into the pyramid. Tourism, one of Egypt's most important industries, has dropped dramatically in recent years due to social and political unrest. Tour-agency owners — including one of the men recently arrested in connection with this case — are often willing to bend or break the rules if it means satisfying wealthy foreigners, news reports suggest. The German government expressed outrage over the acts, and categorically stated the men were private citizens and not in any way affiliated with its German Archaeological Institute.

Trying to prove a conspiracy

Goerlitz and Erdmann acknowledged their acts, and even went so far as to post photographs and videos of themselves vandalizing the archaeological sites. However, they claimed their goal was a noble one: to prove their "alternative history" conspiracy theory that the pyramids were not built by ancient Egyptians.

The men are apparently convinced the cartouche identifying Khufu as the creator of the Great Pyramid at Giza is a fake, and they hoped to do an analysis on the pigments to prove they were not as old as the pyramids themselves. In essence, they claimed, pharaoh Khufu simply put his name on (and took credit for) pyramids that had been built thousands of years earlier by people from the legendary city of Atlantis. They accuse mainstream archaeologists of covering up — or willfully ignoring — evidence pointing to non-Egyptian origins of the pyramids.

The conspiracy theories that Goerlitz and Erdmann endorse did not appear in a vacuum; instead, they have been widely promoted by best-selling authors such as Erich von Däniken, who wrote "Chariots of the Gods?" first published in 1968. Such authors claim the true builders of the pyramids were not ancient Egyptians but instead others, like extraterrestrials or residents of the legendary Atlantis. While "alternative history" and "ancient astronaut" theorists such as von Däniken do not explicitly endorse vandalism of any Egyptian sites, Goerlitz and Erdmann's actions were clearly driven by belief in such theories. (Ancient-astronaut theorists propose, unscientifically, that extraterrestrials intelligently designed humans.)

The true pyramid builders

As physicist Wolfgang Pauli famously said about a ludicrous idea, "It's not even wrong." There are countless glaring fallacies in Goerlitz and Erdmann's wild theory, beginning with the fact that Atlantis never existed; it was first described in two dialogues by Plato — the "Timaeus" and the "Critias" — written around 330 B.C. The Atlantis discussed by Plato did not refer to any actual ancient empire, because the dialogues were fictional stories and fables. Suggesting that people from Plato's Atlantis built the pyramids is like saying people from Tolkien's Middle Earth built the pyramids, or inhabitants of Superman's home planet of Krypton built the pyramids — it makes no sense, because they're fictional characters. [Top 10 Wild Conspiracy Theories]

Aside from that, there's clear evidence that ancient Egyptians did, indeed, build the pyramids. Ken Feder, an archaeologist and professor of anthropology at Central Connecticut State University and author of "Frauds, Myths, and Mysteries: Science and Pseudoscience in Archaeology" (McGraw-Hill, 2013) takes a dim view of such baseless ideas.
"Here's an archaeological shocker: Ancient Egyptians built the pyramids," Feder told Live Science. "Contrary to what some purveyors of fantasy maintain, the technological skills necessary to construct the pyramids were not unknown in ancient Egypt. In actual fact, the Great Pyramid at Giza was the culmination of a lengthy, multigenerational, evolutionary process."

Archaeologists have found several early, failed attempts to build the pyramids, Feder noted. "Early attempts at true, geometric pyramid burial monuments resulted in spectacular screw-ups, including a 'collapsed' pyramid (the slope of the face of the monument was too steep)," Feder said. "In another attempt, cracks appeared in the lower part of the pyramid, again because the slope was too steep and one corner of the pyramid was positioned on a soft, sandy base."

"Finally, the Egyptian builders were not above taking credit for their labors; workers sometimes actually incised dates onto pyramid blocks, and one piece of graffiti in a chamber in the Great Pyramid bears the phrase, 'We did this with pride in the name of our great King Khnum-Khuf,' another name for the Pharaoh Khufu," he added.

In the end, "There is no controversy concerning who built the pyramids," Feder said. "Anyone caught trying to rewrite this history through theft or subterfuge isn't doing archaeology. They're breaking the law and insulting the memory of the thousands of ancient workers whose labors produced one of the wonders of the ancient world."


SOURCE: http://news.yahoo.com/great-pyramid-giz ... 26469.html
 

JamesWhitehead

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#99
Are there suddenly a lot of Mysterious Egypt stories to lure back the lost chamber of tourists? :cool:
 

Jim

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I don't think it's so much keeping Zahi Hawass in a job as keeping him onside, as he has the power to stop them doing any research. He's one of the variety of academics/administrators, who manages to his name on all the publications in the field, without actually doing anything and is determined to take credit for everything that's discovered.
Well it's not as though Dr. Hawass is a snob or anything. He a critical thinking open minded scientist ha ha.
 

Jim

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There was a debate that was supposed to have occurred last year between Egyptologist Dr. Zahi Hawass and Graham Hancock.
Watch in the beginning of the presentation from (5 to 16) minutes in and decide for yourselves about Dr Hawass’s open minded, well informed nature?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mvIHCZrLjU
 
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Jim

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The key to fully understanding these (structures - monuments - early civilizations) is for all the sciences to meet with open minds: Geology, Climatology, Archeology, Anthropology, etc. The trouble is some of these so called experts refuse to accurately look at the total viewpoint (picture). Hawass really makes a real arse of himself in the video. By publicly stating he doesn't even believe in radar (hence electronics). He is really showing short sightedness.
I admit when pushing back the date of a structure like the sphinx from (4500 to >11600) years old one should use a healthy bit of skepticism, but one also has to take an honest look at all the evidences. I for now believe it could be much older than originally thought. Dr. Robert Schoch (and others) present some very compelling arguments for this.
 

kamalktk

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I admit when pushing back the date of a structure like the sphinx from (4500 to >11600) years old one should use a healthy bit of skepticism, but one also has to take an honest look at all the evidences.
If they were shown to be 11600 years old instead of 4500, it would increase Dr. Hawass' standing/importance as their keeper.
 

Jim

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If they were shown to be 11600 years old instead of 4500, it would increase Dr. Hawass' standing/importance as their keeper.
Zahi Hawass the former Egyptian Minister of Antiquities and Director of Excavations at Giza, Saqqara, Bahariya Oasis, and the Valley of the Kings is now on the international lecture circuit, hopefully permanently. He's been out of Egypt for a while, so perhaps the old guard is starting to move on!
It's an established preconditioned thinking in which the present theory for the age of the Egyptian Sphinx and other structures cannot change by much or they could stand to lose face. So in the minds of the established archeologist - Egyptologist they have nothing to gain.
 

Tribble

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Megan Fox is a Pyramid Truther

Her interest in the supernatural mysteries of the world began during filming for Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen in Egypt in 2009, she told the Times. She and Shia LaBeouf were given a tour of the Great Pyramid of Giza by the Ministry of Antiquities, and someone “high-ranking in that field—I will not say who” said the pyramid wasn’t actually a tomb.

“They presume they may have been some type of energy plant at some point,” she continued. “The sarcophagus that is in the Great Pyramid was put there by the government for tourism. And that sparked in me an interest in really exposing this sort of sort of [sic] thing, because I realized I have access to things I shouldn’t have access to because of what I do for a living.”


http://jezebel.com/megan-fox-is-a-pyramid-truther-and-aspiring-vice-corres-1780403260

(As the commenters say :

*high ranking official to other high ranking official*: "Hey wanna f*** with some gullible Americans today?"

“Depends, who are they?”

“Megan Fox and Shia LaBeouf.”

“Oh f*** yeah.”
)
 

Mythopoeika

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Megan Fox is a Pyramid Truther

Her interest in the supernatural mysteries of the world began during filming for Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen in Egypt in 2009, she told the Times. She and Shia LaBeouf were given a tour of the Great Pyramid of Giza by the Ministry of Antiquities, and someone “high-ranking in that field—I will not say who” said the pyramid wasn’t actually a tomb.

“They presume they may have been some type of energy plant at some point,” she continued. “The sarcophagus that is in the Great Pyramid was put there by the government for tourism. And that sparked in me an interest in really exposing this sort of sort of [sic] thing, because I realized I have access to things I shouldn’t have access to because of what I do for a living.”


http://jezebel.com/megan-fox-is-a-pyramid-truther-and-aspiring-vice-corres-1780403260

(As the commenters say :

*high ranking official to other high ranking official*: "Hey wanna f*** with some gullible Americans today?"

“Depends, who are they?”

“Megan Fox and Shia LaBeouf.”

“Oh f*** yeah.”
)
Ha! Energy plant!
I played with that idea myself a few years back.
If you look at the way the Great Pyramid is constructed, it could (by a stretch of the imagination) have been used to house a nuclear reactor. It has thick radiation-proof walls, is earthquake-proof and impervious to attack by even modern weapons, it has air vents, it is near a river...
 

kamalktk

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Logbook of pyramid construction found.

http://www.livescience.com/55439-ancient-logbook-on-great-pyramid-unveiled.html

more at link above
----------------------

"Over a period of several months, [the logbook] reports — in [the] form of a timetable with two columns per day — many operations related to the construction of the Great Pyramid of Khufu at Giza and the work at the limestone quarries on the opposite bank of the Nile," Tallet and Marouard wrote.

Merer recorded the logs in the 27th year of Khufu's reign. His records say that the Great Pyramid was near completion, with much of the remaining work focusing on the construction of the limestone casing that covered the outside of the pyramid, Tallet and Marouard wrote.

The limestone used in this casing, according to the logbook, was quarried at Tura near modern-day Cairo, and was brought to the pyramid site by boat along the Nile River and a system of canals. One boat trip between Tura and the pyramid site took four days to complete, the logbook notes.
 

PeteByrdie

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Logbook of pyramid construction found.

http://www.livescience.com/55439-ancient-logbook-on-great-pyramid-unveiled.html

more at link above
----------------------

"Over a period of several months, [the logbook] reports — in [the] form of a timetable with two columns per day — many operations related to the construction of the Great Pyramid of Khufu at Giza and the work at the limestone quarries on the opposite bank of the Nile," Tallet and Marouard wrote.

Merer recorded the logs in the 27th year of Khufu's reign. His records say that the Great Pyramid was near completion, with much of the remaining work focusing on the construction of the limestone casing that covered the outside of the pyramid, Tallet and Marouard wrote.

The limestone used in this casing, according to the logbook, was quarried at Tura near modern-day Cairo, and was brought to the pyramid site by boat along the Nile River and a system of canals. One boat trip between Tura and the pyramid site took four days to complete, the logbook notes.
So, nothing about aliens or Atlanteans? It's a conspiracy!
 
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